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Post by sannytwist on Aug 5, 2017 19:34:46 GMT
Early this year l wanted to borrow to invest, plan is sound and unlike others my timetable allows me to put in the work to make this happen but in the end l decided against it.
Reason being: - P2p is still a developing industry, this gives the rise for hidden risks that can't be factored in. - I'm pretty comfortable investing affordable income on a monthly basis. - Stress is something that comes with investing with other people's money and it might have an effect on my sleep.
Hope it goes well for you tho if you decide to do it, pls put a update on your progress if possible.
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Post by khampson on Aug 5, 2017 23:28:04 GMT
Certainly will do, I have the plan in place its just having the balls to carry it out, my thoughts are to find I had 10k to invest I would not have an issue putting it in p2p so why would I not consider borrowing 10k to put in, I know p2p is more than a risk than my bank. I did consider putting £5000 into bondmason at 6.5% to give me exposure to a number of platforms
I will see where I go with this, I am going to ponder it for another few weeks yet
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jaswells
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Post by jaswells on Aug 5, 2017 23:47:30 GMT
The strategy is workable and not just with p2p. For example I have borrowed money invested in stocks, shares, fixed rate bonds, retail bonds and p2p. It is the desired outcome of central bank policy to get money into the economy by pumping up liquidity and injecting money in the system. It is, after all what a large chunk of investment bankers do for a living but on a huge scale reaping huge rewards (for little work (or non productive) IMO). The problem is this is not a free market and money markets are distorted. The likely outcome is that one asset class eventually underperforms and these huge leveraged bets go bad (think US property 2008-9).
Its insane.
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Post by sannytwist on Aug 6, 2017 2:19:12 GMT
Certainly will do, I have the plan in place its just having the balls to carry it out, my thoughts are to find I had 10k to invest I would not have an issue putting it in p2p so why would I not consider borrowing 10k to put in, I know p2p is more than a risk than my bank. I did consider putting £5000 into bondmason at 6.5% to give me exposure to a number of platforms I will see where I go with this, I am going to ponder it for another few weeks yet If your gonna do it why not just spread your money on to different p2p platforms yourself and earn the full whack of interest. l rather spend a good amount of time doing my DD on loans from the likes of MT and get between 10-13% interest than effectively giving ure money to someone else to do it. Up to you though.
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Post by khampson on Aug 6, 2017 7:52:18 GMT
Certainly will do, I have the plan in place its just having the balls to carry it out, my thoughts are to find I had 10k to invest I would not have an issue putting it in p2p so why would I not consider borrowing 10k to put in, I know p2p is more than a risk than my bank. I did consider putting £5000 into bondmason at 6.5% to give me exposure to a number of platforms I will see where I go with this, I am going to ponder it for another few weeks yet If your gonna do it why not just spread your money on to different p2p platforms yourself and earn the full whack of interest. l rather spend a good amount of time doing my DD on loans from the likes of MT and get between 10-13% interest than effectively giving ure money to someone else to do it. Up to you though. Great point, the reasoning about using Assetz and Growth street was 30 day access to at least £4000 (2k in each) but yes I could try and get it invested at 10%+ such as Moneything, Funding secure and so on but that would mean putting all the money away for the duration of the loan assuming it cant be sold on a secondary market.
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angrysaveruk
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Post by angrysaveruk on Aug 6, 2017 8:25:06 GMT
What is going to happen if you make a loss and you cant repay the loan in full in time? Can you sell something to repay the loan or borrow the money from a family member? If not risking personal bankruptcy, debt collectors and all the hassel that goes with it might not be worth it. The fact you can earn a decent return on some P2P platforms is probably because it is a high risk investment, it is definitely not a one way bet.
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Aug 6, 2017 9:29:58 GMT
I'm a big fan of stoozing/cashback and other ingenious ways of maximising returns for the less wealthy investor, but I have to say this sounds like a really bad idea. I'm pretty much just going to re-iterate the points others have made in bullet form:
1) Over-leveraging yourself is inherently very risky. 2) Defaults and bad debts will happen, and you won't know when. They're unlikely to be at convenient times. 3) Similarly, you are likely to find a reasonable proportion of your loans will repay, but will be locked in for months/years beforehand due to unforeseen problems. 4) As you are unlikely to have a full grasp of all the foibles of these platforms, you're likely to make a few mistakes which will not be forgiven by your loan provider. 5) You will really struggle to get your £10k invested (or any amount) with any significant diversification at the rates you're after on day 1. 6) Cash drag will impact your returns both at the start and throughout. 7) You are eating into your own, very uncertain, returns by adding the cost of a loan to proceedings. I'm sure there are people here who would confess to coming very close to making a loss, or close to it, due to unfortunate P2P results even without having this cost. I am on Zopa+ just about, for one! 8) You will feel pressured to keep the funds invested even when no decent loan opportunities are about because you're paying for them, making it more likely you'll make bad decisions.
TLDR - I implore you not to do this.
To be less of a negative nelly, why not investigate these ideas (not advice):
1) Save a little, then take advantage of the best P2P sign up bonuses one at a time as they pop up, providing you also like the platforms. 2) Open bank accounts, savings accounts, credit cards just for cashback from quidco/topcashback. 3) You could look at matched betting (just google it) - again, there is risk here so this is not advice from me. 4) Use said bank accounts for promotional/ongoing high interest offers e.g. Nationwide £2500 @ 5% for a year.
I am confident that you can make the equivalent of 6-7% interest return on £10k i.e. £600-£700 a year by trying some combination of the 4 above alone.
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Post by khampson on Aug 6, 2017 9:30:57 GMT
What is going to happen if you make a loss and you cant repay the loan in full in time? Can you sell something to repay the loan or borrow the money from a family member? If not risking personal bankruptcy, debt collectors and all the hassel that goes with it might not be worth it. The fact you can earn a decent return on some P2P platforms is probably because it is a high risk investment, it is definitely not a one way bet. I will be making regular payments on the loan, also I do have a cash account that would cover 50% of the total loan (£5000) I am not prepared to invest this as this is an rainy day account that I leave for that, I could use that if I get really desperate. your right it does come with a risk as do most investment do, You do highlight a good point and its not all sugar coated, I could well not bother with loan and use the credit card that is currently has a limit of £4000 for just over 2 years.
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angrysaveruk
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Post by angrysaveruk on Aug 6, 2017 9:59:13 GMT
What is going to happen if you make a loss and you cant repay the loan in full in time? Can you sell something to repay the loan or borrow the money from a family member? If not risking personal bankruptcy, debt collectors and all the hassel that goes with it might not be worth it. The fact you can earn a decent return on some P2P platforms is probably because it is a high risk investment, it is definitely not a one way bet. I will be making regular payments on the loan, also I do have a cash account that would cover 50% of the total loan (£5000) I am not prepared to invest this as this is an rainy day account that I leave for that, I could use that if I get really desperate. your right it does come with a risk as do most investment do, You do highlight a good point and its not all sugar coated, I could well not bother with loan and use the credit card that is currently has a limit of £4000 for just over 2 years. Sounds like your level of leverage to cash is fairly sensible. I have seen people do all kinds of crazy things like use credit cards to bet on derivatives markets. My personally view of investment has always been never play with more than you are willing to lose, for me personally slow steady growth wins in the long run. That said, everyone I know who is wealthy has at some point levered themselves upto the hilt to take a gamble, but at the same time I also know people who have lost everything and had their lives fall apart doing the same thing.
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Post by nellerdk on Aug 6, 2017 10:11:15 GMT
Generally, I would avoid to borrow to invest.
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Balder
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Post by Balder on Aug 6, 2017 10:14:24 GMT
I have as part of my whole retirement plan (2 years ago at 52) extended my mortgage until age 80 on a repayment basis. This is cheap money at current rates, if rates increase excessively then I can reverse the decision and pay off the mortgage rather than invest the money in a number of different ways. I also have a large amount of equity in the house if things go pear shaped.
The new pension freedoms have allowed me to do this as I can access drawdown from age 55. I even (many on here will say no way!) transferred a couple of final salary schemes into a SIPP that I manage myself - the advantage being that I can access at 55 not 65 and I can withdraw based on growth and need.
All managed in a huge spreadsheet, monthly until age 80 (sad) with all income/outgoings different scenarios , inflation factored in etc.
What it has definitely taught me is what poor value annuities are.
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Post by beeje13 on Aug 6, 2017 11:15:38 GMT
I can see the temptation, it is more money to be earned after all. I wouldn't personally do it.
Good luck if you do go ahead though!
A few notes on your platforms: Growth street: You are only going to get 6% if you started now, and only for one month. Rates are dropping 0.1% every month. Factor that into your expected returns. Good choice of platform though.
Unbolted: It would take you nearly a year to get £2000 invested here!
Ratesetter 5 year, Lending works 5 year, Assetz 30 day would be my 'safer' places to put things, although returns are lower of course.
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starfished
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Post by starfished on Aug 6, 2017 11:32:11 GMT
I have as part of my whole retirement plan (2 years ago at 52) extended my mortgage until age 80 on a repayment basis. This is cheap money at current rates, if rates increase excessively then I can reverse the decision and pay off the mortgage rather than invest the money in a number of different ways. I also have a large amount of equity in the house if things go pear shaped. The new pension freedoms have allowed me to do this as I can access drawdown from age 55. I even (many on here will say no way!) transferred a couple of final salary schemes into a SIPP that I manage myself - the advantage being that I can access at 55 not 65 and I can withdraw based on growth and need. All managed in a huge spreadsheet, monthly until age 80 (sad) with all income/outgoings different scenarios , inflation factored in etc.What it has definitely taught me is what poor value annuities are. Curious, why 80? Life expectancy is closer to 85 and not impossible to hit 100?
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Balder
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Post by Balder on Aug 6, 2017 11:38:29 GMT
I have as part of my whole retirement plan (2 years ago at 52) extended my mortgage until age 80 on a repayment basis. This is cheap money at current rates, if rates increase excessively then I can reverse the decision and pay off the mortgage rather than invest the money in a number of different ways. I also have a large amount of equity in the house if things go pear shaped. The new pension freedoms have allowed me to do this as I can access drawdown from age 55. I even (many on here will say no way!) transferred a couple of final salary schemes into a SIPP that I manage myself - the advantage being that I can access at 55 not 65 and I can withdraw based on growth and need. All managed in a huge spreadsheet, monthly until age 80 (sad) with all income/outgoings different scenarios , inflation factored in etc.What it has definitely taught me is what poor value annuities are. Curious, why 80? Life expectancy is closer to 85 and not impossible to hit 100? Only because the mortgage would be paid off by then and the figures show me I don't need to work it out for any longer (at the moment anyway).
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Post by dan1 on Aug 6, 2017 11:53:07 GMT
Curious, why 80? Life expectancy is closer to 85 and not impossible to hit 100?. Only because the mortgage would be paid off by then and the figures show me I don't need to work it out for any longer (at the moment anyway). Probably a good age to take out an annuity to cover your expenses and keep the remaining invested. Rates would be much higher, reduces the scam risk, and ensures you can pay for your old age even if your faculties have declined significantly.
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