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Post by keyboardworrier on Aug 7, 2017 18:19:51 GMT
I think I will give this one a miss!
This has given me a new appreciate of Octopus Choice and Kuflink who have skin in the game, so I'd like to think they are a little more careful.
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Post by mrclondon on Aug 7, 2017 18:23:28 GMT
The Chartered Surveyors used for the VR is from London, and...... I can't help but think that a Surveyors closer to the site would have been more appropriate.
There can't be a lack of Chartered Surveyors in and around Glasgow! How about the Chartered Surveyors that marketed the property back in July (and have an office in Paisley
To repeat CD's point, it seems a surprising choice of surveyor. MT, can you explain this please? Report preamble - "The day the inspection took place 16th June 2017 at 10.30 PM, we can confirm that it was a sunny day." Even up there in June the sun sets by 2200? Also note the photos are time stamped 16th May 12 noon-ish, and the weather is very light cloud locally with much darker cloud on the horizon. Certainly not "sunny". Whilst on the subject of photos, no internal shots were included with the VR, but there are some on the phoney college website.
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am
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Post by am on Aug 7, 2017 18:30:52 GMT
This is a tad annoying... The Chartered Surveyors used for the VR is from London, and whilst (after a quick glance at their website) there is no doubt they carry out business across the country, I can't help but think that a Surveyors closer to the site would have been more appropriate There can't be a lack of Chartered Surveyors in and around Glasgow! How about the Chartered Surveyors that marketed the property back in July (and have an office in Paisley!). Before PP it was valued as potential development property, which is the sort of thing any Tom, Dick and Harry valuation practice can handle (though with large uncertainties to the valuation). With PP, the valuation depends on the value of the college as a business (which influences the rent and hence valuation of the building) and the residual value of the apartment project, which is a bit more complicated. There might be a case for involving a specialist valuer, though I would have thought that one could have found one in Glasgow or Edinburgh. ( haven't look to see if the actual valuer is plausibly such a valuer.) (I don't think it's a bad as the Ribblesdale farmland on Lendy, where they employed an (IIRC) Essex valuer with (IIRC) no sign of agricultural expertise.)
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copacetic
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Post by copacetic on Aug 7, 2017 18:31:30 GMT
Why would any Platform care, it's not their money or risk?!! Other than Reputational Risk of course. And when if it all goes breasts up you'll hear: "The Valuation was provided by a Qualified & Professional RICS Valuer and we therefore had/have no reason to query its accuracy or veracity"So far I haven't got the impression that Moneything are anything but above board in their dealings with investors. At the moment I'm thinking they perhaps just didn't yet have the benefit of the crowd of DD bloodhounds that (very usefully!) pick over every detail of the borrower and security before launching this loan. I for one won't be investing based on the contributions on this thread, but I hope that MT for the sake of investors not on this board will consider any information brought to light that they didn't previously know and consider if this loan is sensible. A 'U-turn' bafflingly always seems to get negative press in the media but changing your mind when it becomes apparent that a deal may be dubious based on new information is nothing but good in my opinion.
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am
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Post by am on Aug 7, 2017 18:36:08 GMT
The Chartered Surveyors used for the VR is from London, and...... I can't help but think that a Surveyors closer to the site would have been more appropriate.
There can't be a lack of Chartered Surveyors in and around Glasgow! How about the Chartered Surveyors that marketed the property back in July (and have an office in Paisley
To repeat CD's point, it seems a surprising choice of surveyor. MT, can you explain this please? Report preamble - "The day the inspection took place 16th June 2017 at 10.30 PM, we can confirm that it was a sunny day." Even up there in June the sun sets by 2200? Paisley is sufficiently north and west that sunset was 2205. But I suspect that this a typo and should read AM, or 12.30, or something. Sloppy, but not a serious issue.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Aug 7, 2017 18:36:29 GMT
There are a couple of interesting diagrams, created just yesterday on gliffy.com. Google for : S***** College site:gliffy.com Wow !!! So we are supposed to get repaid from Gibralter .... and its all predicated on 175 year leases that may not even be permissible under Scottish law. What great entertainment ! Predicated on a non-existent college, brought to you by the man/men who bought (some folks) a non-existent wind farm? Oh dear, somehow I don't think this one will fly, will it MoneyThing?
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Aug 7, 2017 18:40:03 GMT
/mod hat off (in case of any doubt)
I have it on reasonable authority (ie from the horse's mouth) that Ed will be opining on this loan, in this thread, in the near future. Until he's had a chance to do so I would suggest that additional speculation may prove to be unhelpful.
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am
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Post by am on Aug 7, 2017 18:44:13 GMT
Why would any Platform care, it's not their money or risk?!! Other than Reputational Risk of course. And when if it all goes breasts up you'll hear: "The Valuation was provided by a Qualified & Professional RICS Valuer and we therefore had/have no reason to query its accuracy or veracity"So far I haven't got the impression that Moneything are anything but above board in their dealings with investors. At the moment I'm thinking they perhaps just didn't yet have the benefit of the crowd of DD bloodhounds that (very usefully!) pick over every detail of the borrower and security before launching this loan. I for one won't be investing based on the contributions on this thread, but I hope that MT for the sake of investors not on this board will consider any information brought to light that they didn't previously know and consider if this loan is sensible. A 'U-turn' bafflingly always seems to get negative press in the media but changing your mind when it becomes apparent that a deal may be dubious based on new information is nothing but good in my opinion. Ignoring what we've potentially discovered about the borrower, this has the same problems as the Kirkcudbright loan - the VR doesn't indicate how the value was calculated, and we are told nothing about the business plan, so we can't evaluate either the probability of default or the likely recovery rate in event of default. That's two successive(?) loans in which MoneyThing have provided less information than I have come to expect from them. At 12% we can't expect perfect borrowers, but we can expect sufficient information to evaluate the loan.
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baldpate
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Post by baldpate on Aug 7, 2017 18:45:36 GMT
Report preamble - "The day the inspection took place 16th June 2017 at 10.30 PM, we can confirm that it was a sunny day." Even up there in June the sun sets by 2200? Well it was definitely a sunny day on 14th MAY , which was apparently when the photos in the report appendix were taken (or the valuer has discovered the secret of time travel) . Seriously, this report is fully of shoddy little mistakes.
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Post by elephantrosie on Aug 7, 2017 18:45:54 GMT
i was about to transfer some cash to my MT account for this loan going live tomorrow. then decided to do a bit more research and hmm..... sorry, i am skipping this loan altogether.
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mouse
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Post by mouse on Aug 7, 2017 18:46:29 GMT
Report preamble - "The day the inspection took place 16th June 2017 at 10.30 PM, we can confirm that it was a sunny day." Even up there in June the sun sets by 2200? Sun... Scotland... You see.... I'm doubting the surveyor has ever actually been to Scotland Unfortunately i have heard anecdotally that some valuations are being done by use of google earth !
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Post by mrclondon on Aug 7, 2017 18:52:23 GMT
The loan details say "The borrower has been involved in property development for over ten years and have successfully traded, developed and added value through planning gain on a number of sites across the UK & Ireland." I've been distracted by SE, other people by DCR, and yet others by the various websites implying that the college is operating and the apartments have been constructed. Has anyone had a look at the development record either of the company which people have assumed is the borrower, or its principals? I assume you have googled the address given in para 1.70 of the VR. DOM******* LTD was the the subject of a winding up petitition on behalf of Burnley Borough Council (as reported in the Gazette Dec 16/Jan 17). These people hide behind a web of companies, (some offshore) which makes it hard to establish exactly what they have done in the past. The photos of the Burnley dev look ok on the Di****** Investments web site, but beyond that who knows.
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Nomad
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Post by Nomad on Aug 7, 2017 18:59:58 GMT
This is a tad annoying... The Chartered Surveyors used for the VR is from London, and whilst (after a quick glance at their website) there is no doubt they carry out business across the country, I can't help but think that a Surveyors closer to the site would have been more appropriate There can't be a lack of Chartered Surveyors in and around Glasgow! How about the Chartered Surveyors that marketed the property back in July (and have an office in Paisley!). I note that the valuer for Plymouth MTAS781 hails from north Lancashire...
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Aug 7, 2017 19:15:27 GMT
Wow !!! So we are supposed to get repaid from Gibralter .... and its all predicated on 175 year leases that may not even be permissible under Scottish law. What great entertainment ! Predicated on a non-existent college, brought to you by the man/men who bought (some folks) a non-existent wind farm? Oh dear, somehow I don't think this one will fly, will it MoneyThing ? Part of my DD took me via some very suspect gold prospecting schemes in the Scottish mountains. I haven't read whether any gold was found for/by participants but I did read a scathing posting somewhere pouring ridicule on that whole money making idea.
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mouse
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Post by mouse on Aug 7, 2017 19:17:25 GMT
This is a tad annoying... The Chartered Surveyors used for the VR is from London, and whilst (after a quick glance at their website) there is no doubt they carry out business across the country, I can't help but think that a Surveyors closer to the site would have been more appropriate There can't be a lack of Chartered Surveyors in and around Glasgow! How about the Chartered Surveyors that marketed the property back in July (and have an office in Paisley!). I note that the valuer for Plymouth MTAS781 hails from north Lancashire... Question for Ed. What is the policy for choice of valuer for loans on MT thnx
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