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Post by investorman on Apr 30, 2018 18:08:02 GMT
98 extended for 31 days. Really worried about this one, im not in it or 80, more that investors are already into this for £1.3m for 80, trying to push this £1.5m through to stop the £1.3m defaulting in due course, just means a £2.8m default could be a possibility in the future. Should let this one die gracefully. Would hate to see it ruin the rep of a good platform. Do people read the addendum? So the existing lender of the 98 loan has indicated a willingness to convert the whole loan to equity, but the borrower would clearly prefer to maximise this loan and give any balance as equity. Or that is what I understand, though of course the question is how much equity do they want. That is some way from any idea of a loss of confidence in the project, and means that 98 does not have to fill or fail. It just sounds to me like people optimising their position in this opportunity. And that the problem is that the combined size is a big ask for this small platform. But I may be just a mug punter. I assume the term is still 8 months fixed, not 7.
I read it as the existing lender has to turn their loan into equity because nobody else is willing to bail them out by refinancing the loan. However, they will take what they can get out from Abl lenders as they dont really want to own a building site in north wales if they can help it.
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blender
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Post by blender on Apr 30, 2018 20:11:54 GMT
Let's just say, investorman, that neither of us knows what motivates the current lenders to make their proposal. I thought your analysis unfairly negative, and I gave an alternative which you might feel too optimistic - lenders can make their own decisions. The rules will prevent Ablrate from commenting. I can't see Ablrate paying 'double or quits' with lenders cash. But, do we agree that, on the information given, there will be a way forward to fund the project to up to the point of qualifying for the development loan? Sure there is a risk of failure to get that, there always is, but not an inevitable default of £2.8M. I don't see how you have that knowledge. Agreed that such a default could cause an existential crisis. In North Wales? Yes. About 10 ish miles from Chester, which was not the third world when I last looked.
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blender
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Post by blender on May 31, 2018 11:36:35 GMT
All aboard the Skylark! Departing today.
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nw99
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Post by nw99 on May 31, 2018 15:22:00 GMT
All aboard the Skylark! Departing today. Extended till Monday
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blender
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Post by blender on May 31, 2018 16:19:15 GMT
OK, it seems we have a few seats left on the Skylark. The borrower must be keen to avoid any sale of equity, and Ablrate appear to be helping at £500 a day in instant returns. No problem, with ten weeks of instant returns and a fixed term of 8 months with pre-funded interest. What's not to like?
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sapphire
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Post by sapphire on May 31, 2018 16:35:46 GMT
As things stand, is the risk profile of #98 considered to be similar, better or worse than that of the related #80?
Would the proposed loan to equity conversion by the existing lender, mean that #98 has a lower risk profile compared to #80?
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blender
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Post by blender on May 31, 2018 20:45:52 GMT
As things stand, is the risk profile of #98 considered to be similar, better or worse than that of the related #80? Would the proposed loan to equity conversion by the existing lender, mean that #98 has a lower risk profile compared to #80? On the second question, the equity is irrelevant because it would presumably be in the borrower company which owns both sites. On the first question, there is no risk of default on paying the interest for either. The exit is the development funding which also covers both. A failure to obtain timely development funding could be the cause of a default. Presumably, as you said elsewhere, 80 could be extended further if it were a matter of time needed. How people judge the relative physical security of the two loans is complicated - and some other views from those with more expertise would be welcome. Personally I would like to know why 80 is still being sold at a discount, given that 98 will draw down.
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nw99
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Post by nw99 on May 31, 2018 21:38:56 GMT
No idea why the discount that’s why I have been buying them by the shed load all the way from 99 to 99.6
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Jun 1, 2018 19:45:56 GMT
No idea why the discount that’s why I have been buying them by the shed load all the way from 99 to 99.6 The discount is just a silly nonsense that has become self perpetuating. Far more important is to establish what quantity a 'shed load' is. Or indeed what constitutes a 'shed load' is it the amount that would fit in a garden shed? (given these come in all shapes and sizes) Or is it a load shed from a lorry? (again said 'shed loads' could vary considerably in size and shape). I know 'shed load' is commonly accepted as a considerable quantity, however if the term is to be used needs to be quantifiable to the passing reader.
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nw99
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Post by nw99 on Jun 1, 2018 20:28:14 GMT
Shed loads is I bought over £40,000 worth .
Great to see it trade at par today anyaway !
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Jun 1, 2018 20:43:07 GMT
Shed loads is I bought over £40,000 worth . Great to see it trade at par today anyaway ! That definitely qualifies. Most try to diversify 2% of their pot per loan so either you have 2 mill or great big balls heh
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blender
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Post by blender on Jun 1, 2018 21:32:18 GMT
Shed loads is I bought over £40,000 worth . Great to see it trade at par today anyaway ! That definitely qualifies. Most try to diversify 2% of their pot per loan so either you have 2 mill or great big balls heh Oh, is that it? I've been putting all my pot on one loan and moving it very frequently to other loans in succession. Is that wrong? As for units, I think that a container load would be a better, more standardised, measure than a shed load. However, it would be quite a large unit. It reminds me of the problem of the unit of beauty, the Helen, which was the capacity to launch a thousand ships. A more practical everyday measure would be the milliHelen, or the capacity to launch just one ship.
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Post by fatbritabroad on Jun 2, 2018 5:08:47 GMT
Plus you better hope said container actually exists... 😉
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nw99
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Post by nw99 on Jun 2, 2018 5:31:11 GMT
That definitely qualifies. Most try to diversify 2% of their pot per loan so either you have 2 mill or great big balls heh Oh, is that it? I've been putting all my pot on one loan and moving it very frequently to other loans in succession. Is that wrong? As for units, I think that a container load would be a better, more standardised, measure than a shed load. However, it would be quite a large unit. It reminds me of the problem of the unit of beauty, the Helen, which was the capacity to launch a thousand ships. A more practical everyday measure would be the milliHelen, or the capacity to launch just one ship.
I tend to buy them below par sit on them and reduce the holding at par or better or trade out with 3- 6months to go till maturity . So I am very active in the secondary market at all times.
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pom
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Post by pom on Jun 2, 2018 19:46:50 GMT
Oh, is that it? I've been putting all my pot on one loan and moving it very frequently to other loans in succession. Is that wrong? As for units, I think that a container load would be a better, more standardised, measure than a shed load. However, it would be quite a large unit. It reminds me of the problem of the unit of beauty, the Helen, which was the capacity to launch a thousand ships. A more practical everyday measure would be the milliHelen, or the capacity to launch just one ship.
I tend to buy them below par sit on them and reduce the holding at par or better or trade out with 3- 6months to go till maturity . So I am very active in the secondary market at all times. Your CGT reporting must be fun
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