IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Jun 3, 2018 10:56:54 GMT
I tend to buy them below par sit on them and reduce the holding at par or better or trade out with 3- 6months to go till maturity . So I am very active in the secondary market at all times. Your CGT reporting must be fun You don't have to report CGT unless you have something to pay - if your average capital gain is say 0.5% per loan then you'd need to be buying over two million quid a year on P2P SMs before you even need to start thinking about it.
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nw99
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Post by nw99 on Jun 3, 2018 11:35:04 GMT
Indeed agreed
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pom
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Post by pom on Jun 3, 2018 20:15:50 GMT
Your CGT reporting must be fun You don't have to report CGT unless you have something to pay - if your average capital gain is say 0.5% per loan then you'd need to be buying over two million quid a year on P2P SMs before you even need to start thinking about it. Wrong I'm afraid - if your disposals are more than 4x the allowance (which if he's regularly buying and presumably selling 40k chunks they are quite likely to be- plus don't forget repayments of capital on amortising loans count as disposals too) then you have to report it even if you don't owe any tax. www.gov.uk/capital-gains-tax/work-out-need-to-pay
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Jun 3, 2018 21:16:07 GMT
You don't have to report CGT unless you have something to pay - if your average capital gain is say 0.5% per loan then you'd need to be buying over two million quid a year on P2P SMs before you even need to start thinking about it. Wrong I'm afraid - if your disposals are more than 4x the allowance (which if he's regularly buying and presumably selling 40k chunks they are quite likely to be- plus don't forget repayments of capital on amortising loans count as disposals too) then you have to report it even if you don't owe any tax. www.gov.uk/capital-gains-tax/work-out-need-to-payIf you are going by the book then sure you should report something - although I suspect no one other than the most obsessional minded will do so. The point was about calculating and reporting the precise figures. Even if one is going to bother to report, then I still don't think it would be necessary to give the actual figures, just a declaration and/or estimation that there is no gain to pay. At least that is what my accountant has advised me previously in relation to CGT disposals where clearly no CGT is due - stick a simple entry under "Any Other Information" explaining it. If they want more info they'll ask. But if someone really wants to add it all up deal by deal, to see how many £tens or £hundreds up or down they are, then of course go ahead. Bottom line is that there is obviously no tax to pay so it would be an extraordinary waste of everyone's time for HMRC to start chasing people over this.
However, if one really is dealing millions, then yes, another story, and possibly also if one has a lot of capital disposals elsewhere.
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pom
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Post by pom on Jun 3, 2018 21:49:05 GMT
Wrong I'm afraid - if your disposals are more than 4x the allowance (which if he's regularly buying and presumably selling 40k chunks they are quite likely to be- plus don't forget repayments of capital on amortising loans count as disposals too) then you have to report it even if you don't owe any tax. www.gov.uk/capital-gains-tax/work-out-need-to-payIf you are going by the book then sure you should report something - although I suspect no one other than the most obsessional minded will do so. The point was about calculating and reporting the precise figures. Even if one is going to bother to report, then I still don't think it would be necessary to give the actual figures, just a declaration and/or estimation that there is no gain to pay. At least that is what my accountant has advised me previously in relation to CGT disposals where clearly no CGT is due - stick a simple entry under "Any Other Information" explaining it. If they want more info they'll ask. But if someone really wants to add it all up deal by deal, to see how many £tens or £hundreds up or down they are, then of course go ahead. Bottom line is that there is obviously no tax to pay so it would be an extraordinary waste of everyone's time for HMRC to start chasing people over this.
However, if one really is dealing millions, then yes, another story, and possibly also if one has a lot of capital disposals elsewhere. Well I certainly wouldn't want to be using estimated figures for something where clearly actual figures exist, just for the sake of doing some spreadsheets. But whether it's a waste of time or not, if your disposals are high enough then you have to fill out the CGT pages- there is a clear y/n question as to whether you've had more than x in disposals during the year. And if you're buying in big chunks there's clearly going to be a lot to report on. Besides I would rather suspect (hope) tho that anyone buying/selling chunks that big will have other gains to report anyway, because otherwise it'd be a rather wasted allowance (I certainly don't deal in chunks anywhere near that big but I crystallise enough S&S gains each year to use my CGT allowance)
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Jun 3, 2018 21:52:51 GMT
Stick with the platform’s tax summary seems a reasonably safe rule of thumb.
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blender
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Post by blender on Jun 3, 2018 22:16:54 GMT
You don't have to report CGT unless you have something to pay - if your average capital gain is say 0.5% per loan then you'd need to be buying over two million quid a year on P2P SMs before you even need to start thinking about it. Wrong I'm afraid - if your disposals are more than 4x the allowance (which if he's regularly buying and presumably selling 40k chunks they are quite likely to be- plus don't forget repayments of capital on amortising loans count as disposals too) then you have to report it even if you don't owe any tax. www.gov.uk/capital-gains-tax/work-out-need-to-payNot quite:-
You still need to report your gains in your tax return if both of the following apply: •the total amount you sold the assets for was more than 4 times your allowance •you’re registered for Self Assessment
The word 'both' is important. I am not registered for self assessment, do not exceed the GGT limit, and therefore am not required to play these games.
Edit: by 'games' for example, consider that if you 'transfer' a holding from a normal account to an ISA account, through the SM, that will count as £20k of disposals which gets a fair way towards the 4 times allowance. It's easy to make up the rest on p2p SM trades and have to do all the analysis and reporting for no purpose.
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Post by gibson on Jun 4, 2018 9:49:57 GMT
Will Ablrate finally let this loan die, or will they offer another last minute extension?
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nw99
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Post by nw99 on Jun 4, 2018 17:23:33 GMT
Closed
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Balder
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Post by Balder on Jun 7, 2018 12:16:54 GMT
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Post by ablrate on Jun 7, 2018 12:26:16 GMT
Its in legals at the moment, we are hopping for a quick closing once all paperwork has been reviewed.
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ptr120
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Post by ptr120 on Jun 24, 2018 14:32:10 GMT
Its in legals at the moment, we are hopping for a quick closing once all paperwork has been reviewed. Hi ablrate I'm a little curious to know what is happening with loan #98. It looks to have closed some time ago but not drawn down which must be costing a bit in instant returns. It would be good to understand if it'll draw down, given that it is related to another loan on the platform.
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blender
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Post by blender on Jun 24, 2018 14:56:06 GMT
Its in legals at the moment, we are hopping for a quick closing once all paperwork has been reviewed. Hi ablrate I'm a little curious to know what is happening with loan #98. It looks to have closed some time ago but not drawn down which must be costing a bit in instant returns. It would be good to understand if it'll draw down, given that it is related to another loan on the platform. I regard this as pretty safe, and imagine a sort of dragon's den, where the existing lenders attempt to get as much of the company as possible for the shortfall in repayment. The paperwork presumably includes this equity release as a complicating matter. I first bid on 28th March, and expect a four-figure sum in instant returns. Looking at the lender terms, we read:
"a) Instant Returns are calculated from the day you bid until the day of draw down and are calculated at the prevailing date of rate of interest on borrowing request on a daily basis.
b) Upon acceptance of your bid by the borrower, the Ablrate platform will automatically calculate the figure to be paid and this will be credited to your Lending Members Account.
c) Unless otherwise stated Borrowers will pay the Instant Returns from the Loan proceeds"
So we are comforted that instant returns are accruing until draw down, though the word acceptance is odd and undefined, and can only mean draw down because returns cannot be calculated until draw down. And the borrowing proposal says that if the full amount is not raised, then we get our cash returned with instant returns. So it all seems covered, though there are some strange wording conflicts with the FAQs - perhaps an issue for another day.
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Post by ablrate on Jun 25, 2018 10:17:16 GMT
Hi All
We created instant returns for this very reason, i.e that you are compensated for a long draw down. The fact that they are accruing focuses the mind of all involved.. we are getting there, but we do want to make sure everything is in place before any money is sent anywhere.
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ptr120
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Post by ptr120 on Jun 25, 2018 17:55:42 GMT
...I'm not worried, more curious - but thanks for the reply!
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