macq
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Post by macq on Oct 25, 2018 16:45:54 GMT
Frogs & first born think you may need to change your name to The Wicker Man
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Oct 25, 2018 16:56:01 GMT
I did, and you can still have a 'bad' harvest in a polytunnel. It just a little too vulnerable to me Well, yes. Is that just this type of product or agriculture generally? One bad harvest does not greatly affect the value of the land. You might also worry about the following scenario: Water into blood (דָם): Ex. 7:14–24 Frogs (צְּפַרְדֵּעַ): Ex. 7:25–8:15 Lice (כִּנִּים): Ex. 8:16-19 Mixture of wild animals (עָרוֹב): Ex. 8:20-32 Diseased livestock (דֶּבֶר): Ex. 9:1–7 Boils (שְׁחִין): Ex. 9:8–12 Thunderstorm of hail and fire (בָּרָד): Ex. 9:13–35 Locusts (אַרְבֶּה): Ex. 10:1–20 Darkness for three days (חוֹשֶך): Ex. 10:21–29 Death of firstborn (מַכַּת בְּכוֹרוֹת): Ex. 11:1–12:36
Might be worth bearing in mind, that the 'cheap' labour available before these (easily scientifically explained) unfortunate incidents, left shortly afterwards never to return.
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Post by Proptechfish on Oct 25, 2018 17:04:20 GMT
I'm not particularly worried by any of those, what i am put off by is :
Property leveraged to the hilt
2nd charge loan
Bad blood with a previous lending facility
Bad year for business in 2017
Reducing profits
Business scaling back/reducing
Adding a circa 20% loan to already tight financials, not counting the 1st charge loan pressure.
In a sector that is very vulnerable to outside economic factors, tunnels or no tunnels.
I have not been with Abl all that long, but i'm personally assessing this as one of the worst offers i have seen from Abl. Of course my opinion is my own, i'm sure everybody is capable of making their own call.
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markyg61
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Post by markyg61 on Oct 25, 2018 17:25:50 GMT
Did you read the blurb ...they grow throughout the year in poly tunnels. I did, and you can still have a 'bad' harvest in a polytunnel. It just a little too vulnerable to me Don't get me wrong, I dont like it either and decided NOT to invest my hard earned pennies.
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blender
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Post by blender on Oct 25, 2018 18:36:34 GMT
I'm not particularly worried by any of those, what i am put off by is : Property leveraged to the hilt 2nd charge loan Bad blood with a previous lending facility Bad year for business in 2017 Reducing profits Business scaling back/reducing Adding a circa 20% loan to already tight financials, not counting the 1st charge loan pressure. In a sector that is very vulnerable to outside economic factors, tunnels or no tunnels. I have not been with Abl all that long, but i'm personally assessing this as one of the worst offers i have seen from Abl. Of course my opinion is my own, i'm sure everybody is capable of making their own call. You are quite right to point out all these concerns, which imo are far more important than natural disasters. Have you seen what the borrower is paying in total for one year? Up front fee of 5%, 15% to us and 1.25% pm to Ablrate - that is 35% for this year's bridge (of which less than half comes to us). This is desperate on one side and highly risky on the other. I guess the rate for the first charge will be rather lower. I still prefer it to 108, which filled to £1M very quickly. Sentiment has changed.
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Post by Ace on Oct 25, 2018 21:44:21 GMT
You are quite right to point out all these concerns, which imo are far more important than natural disasters. Have you seen what the borrower is paying in total for one year? Up front fee of 5%, 15% to us and 1.25% pm to Ablrate - that is 35% for this year's bridge (of which less than half comes to us). This is desperate on one side and highly risky on the other. I guess the rate for the first charge will be rather lower. I still prefer it to 108, which filled to £1M very quickly. Sentiment has changed.
Oops, I'm rubbish at this DD malarkey, I assumed that the 1.25% pm was our 15% !!!
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dh1
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Post by dh1 on Oct 25, 2018 21:47:55 GMT
I'm just after as much free advice as I can get dh1 ! Not all 70%s are equal. 70% of the current market valuation of a piece of agricultural land is real. 70% of the retail value of car stocks (before cost of sales) is unconvincing for me. 70% of the anticipated future value of a business and its assets based on development/refurbishment and three years projected trading growth starts to look like an unsecured loan to me. The second charge is not so good, but that is why it is 15% plus Ablrate's cut. Apologies for the slow response, blender. One of those days. Yep, I get what you're after and understand the points you make so well. Sadly, I don't have any further advice to give on Ablrate loans as my previous response hints.
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puddleduck
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Post by puddleduck on Oct 26, 2018 8:28:48 GMT
That said, I’m ever the optimist with regard to ABL’s judgment so may pitch in a few quid. It tends to be attitudes like this that mean the loans that should never fly get funded. Far too many examples to list over numerous P2P companies.
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ozboy
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Mine's a Large One! (Snigger, snigger .......)
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Post by ozboy on Oct 26, 2018 8:39:08 GMT
Spot on puddleduck - it's the continuing funding of s****y loans that only encourages the Platforms to dive further downmarket and offer more.
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blender
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Post by blender on Oct 26, 2018 9:11:41 GMT
That said, I’m ever the optimist with regard to ABL’s judgment so may pitch in a few quid. It tends to be attitudes like this that mean the loans that should never fly get funded. Far too many examples to list over numerous P2P companies. True, but it will be instructive to see what happens to this one. It has risen to 20%, but full size is ticked as 'required' and I wonder if underwriters will be keen? P2P works on the basis that lenders and others make judgements based on their own financial interests. So some might put a modest amount in early, in anticipation of a long period of income-tax-free instant-returns at 15%, followed by return of cash or short-term sale. If it fails to fill then Ablrate will take notice, if it fails to sell then we will learn a lesson.
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marka
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Post by marka on Oct 26, 2018 13:24:07 GMT
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boundah
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Post by boundah on Oct 26, 2018 16:28:00 GMT
That said, I’m ever the optimist with regard to ABL’s judgment so may pitch in a few quid. It tends to be attitudes like this that mean the loans that should never fly get funded. Far too many examples to list over numerous P2P companies. In my experience over several years with ABL and 3 other P2P platforms, I have found ABL's offerings to be the most reliable. I don't put money into every loan, but I do spread my muck quite widely. I've found that has worked quite well so far.
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gibmike
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What is a cynic? A man who knows the price of everything and the value of nothing.
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Post by gibmike on Oct 26, 2018 22:47:24 GMT
First loan in a long while I have looked at and thought "punt" (the other being a pub near a train station some months ago which was withdrawn).
I do DD and read into locations//business etc. as I do on Assetz but this is just a touch too far for me.
Many of the loans look ripe and juicy but this is just too green for me...
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kaya
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Post by kaya on Oct 27, 2018 9:49:52 GMT
For me it's over-ripe, turning an unpleasant shade of brown.
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ceejay
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Post by ceejay on Nov 1, 2018 14:01:22 GMT
Cancelled, apparently due to issues with the existing lender. Though it wasn't looking good to fill, anyway.
Yet again we are promised more new loans...
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