aju
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Post by aju on Dec 10, 2018 17:10:22 GMT
On the full loanbook, I've seen mentions of it in a few places on Ratesetter but as yet not stumbled onto it. I've emailed them to see what they say about where i might find it if it exists. I checked out P2PFA, knowing they were not there since quite a few months ago to no avail either. Time on my hands, Mrs Aju hasn't wanted to go shopping for over two days now not sure if she's ill .... still need to sort Insurance for car and I'm behind a bit with my monthlies on Zopa accounts but yeah I'm sure I can find time to create yet another spreadsheet. Market data, then loan book But bear in mind its absolutely massive, its all the loans not your loans I'm sure it is large, Zopa's is definitely large but in some things it's the only way to get to the bottom of a lot of data. (with PM's help I have found it and downloaded it now its as you 75M as a binary it loads quite fast and I dare say it will take a little while to analyse it myself.)
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aju
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Post by aju on Dec 10, 2018 17:13:08 GMT
Its called the data hub and it can be found here (I added a link into the original message above). Its in the section 3 "Rate trends since 2010" I think the day in the datadump.csv is actually the day rate but its not really clear I say this as i pulled it yesterday and had yesterdays date in it. Thanks.
Same info under "Market Data" in left drop down but more broken up. This includes the Historic Loanbook.
Regards
PM
propman, I've found it now with your very kind assistance. Lets hope I can find something useful in it. Many Thanks, aju
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aju
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Post by aju on Dec 11, 2018 11:04:30 GMT
mjc , Thanks to macq comments on another thread regarding blogs on understanding Ratesetter manual lending methods I did some google searches and found these useful links. p2pblog seems to have an easy to understand method and it also explains how to read the market information. DIY Income Investor is a bit older but none the lass has a similar approach 4thway Offers similar and mentions about spikes that can occur at certain times. Which Magazine has a review but not sure how much is visible if you do not have a subscription. I'm still wading through them all but the p2pblog one is very comprehensive with diagrams on how to read the market information so hopefully it will be well worth a fuller read when I get to it. Again thanks to macq for pointing us onto the right path. I've read a lot of these sites but only at the Zopa level and didn't think to go back and check them for more info on ratesetter.
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macq
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Post by macq on Dec 11, 2018 12:28:37 GMT
mjc , Thanks to macq comments on another thread regarding blogs on understanding Ratesetter manual lending methods I did some google searches and found these useful links. p2pblog seems to have an easy to understand method and it also explains how to read the market information. DIY Income Investor is a bit older but none the lass has a similar approach 4thway Offers similar and mentions about spikes that can occur at certain times. Which Magazine has a review but not sure how much is visible if you do not have a subscription. I'm still wading through them all but the p2pblog one is very comprehensive with diagrams on how to read the market information so hopefully it will be well worth a fuller read when I get to it. Again thanks to macq for pointing us onto the right path. I've read a lot of these sites but only at the Zopa level and didn't think to go back and check them for more info on ratesetter. Glad it helped & there's also Financialthing.com as another good P2P blog with a RS review as well.And hopefully you've got your 6%+ rate now
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aju
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Post by aju on Dec 11, 2018 13:27:41 GMT
Thanks to macq comments on another thread regarding blogs on understanding Ratesetter manual lending methods I did some google searches and found these useful links. p2pblog seems to have an easy to understand method and it also explains how to read the market information. DIY Income Investor is a bit older but none the lass has a similar approach 4thway Offers similar and mentions about spikes that can occur at certain times. Which Magazine has a review but not sure how much is visible if you do not have a subscription. I'm still wading through them all but the p2pblog one is very comprehensive with diagrams on how to read the market information so hopefully it will be well worth a fuller read when I get to it. Again thanks to macq for pointing us onto the right path. I've read a lot of these sites but only at the Zopa level and didn't think to go back and check them for more info on ratesetter. Glad it helped & there's also Financialthing.com as another good P2P blog with a RS review as well.And hopefully you've got your 6%+ rate now I was about to make some changes and Mrs Aju decided shopping was more important, apparently christmas is coming!
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Post by propman on Dec 14, 2018 12:35:23 GMT
Rather annoyed. Spotted £1.1m as Borrower Offers on the 1 yr market that would have required rates >6% to match, rushed to put money on the market. This has now disappeared with rates peaking at 5.2%. Checking the weekly total this has increased significantly suggesting that the £1.1m was matched. Don't think the other markets moved much so I can only conclude that the borrowing had already been matched before I saw it with the lender offers removed but not the borrower offer and sio the data was misleading.
- PM
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ceejay
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Post by ceejay on Dec 14, 2018 16:05:34 GMT
Rather annoyed. Spotted £1.1m as Borrower Offers on the 1 yr market that would have required rates >6% to match, rushed to put money on the market. This has now disappeared with rates peaking at 5.2%. Checking the weekly total this has increased significantly suggesting that the £1.1m was matched. Don't think the other markets moved much so I can only conclude that the borrowing had already been matched before I saw it with the lender offers removed but not the borrower offer and sio the data was misleading.
- PM I think you may have been placing too much reliance on the borrower/lender data. Not that it was necessarily inaccurate, more that it is only ever a snapshot at a given instant. You have no way of knowing how much other lender money is about to pour in, either from active lenders such as yourself who see an opportunity (but whose target may be lower than yours) or (more likely) from money being automatically recycled.
There is no requirement for RS to force an instant match of existing borrowers and lenders - it is in their interest to hold back on matching until maximum lender funds are available.
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Post by propman on Dec 14, 2018 16:22:09 GMT
There is no requirement for RS to force an instant match of existing borrowers and lenders - it is in their interest to hold back on matching until maximum lender funds are available.
I agree, but I would expect that the data is consistent. £1m is a huge amount on the 1 year market, extremely unlikely that this was absorbed by new money in the hour or so between me looking at the data. Yes putting money on at higher rates risks other lenders undercutting me and might happen if the loan left unfilled for many hours, I fully expect that and said above that you should assume some will be matched by other money.
A borrower might have rejected the rate available, but seeing the increase in amount lent in the week, this doesn't appear to have been the case.
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rscal
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Post by rscal on Dec 14, 2018 17:22:11 GMT
There is no requirement for RS to force an instant match of existing borrowers and lenders - it is in their interest to hold back on matching until maximum lender funds are available.
I agree, but I would expect that the data is consistent. £1m is a huge amount on the 1 year market, extremely unlikely that this was absorbed by new money in the hour or so between me looking at the data. Yes putting money on at higher rates risks other lenders undercutting me and might happen if the loan left unfilled for many hours, I fully expect that and said above that you should assume some will be matched by other money.
A borrower might have rejected the rate available, but seeing the increase in amount lent in the week, this doesn't appear to have been the case.
I suspect that '1.1m' was a single borrower as it often is. Suppose that is Ratesetter itself. They might have indicated they wanted to raise upto '1.1m' initially but why not simply let their lender bids flow in - and keep the rate fixed - until (say) they had reached 500k? Then take the borrow order off the board? In other words about the only thing you can rely on is that you can't place your order at where the queue corresponds with the asked for amount and assume it will be reached.
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aju
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Post by aju on Dec 14, 2018 18:20:48 GMT
I too noticed some increases yesterday and this morning to no avail though so I reduced my high £10 testers down to 6.0 from 6.4 the other day when things seemed to be improving. I keep a watchful eye in the left side of my screen, I reload the 5yr Mkt rate (id#4) and the Market Rate screen every minute and keep an eye on the flows - there are times when nothing happens then a burst of activity. There was a point this morning where the numbers all of a sudden crept up but then dropped back again - I think it was this morning.
My £40 in £10 blocks is now watching 6.0, 6.1, 6.2 & 6.3. I'm not sure I am achieving much at the moment but I am getting used to the MR activities if not fully understanding the twists and turns it seems to follow.
One question I did have was on any given day when is the critical point that lending may actually pickup my stabs, bearing in mind there are a lot of factors moving things up and down?.
My instinct is that whilst we are all trying to better our returns by trying to game it and there will, as you say, perhaps be some players adding money in large amounts but surely these will be a very small proportion of people gaming things in this way.
In Zopa its relatively clear that there are lending cycles some we can see some we can't. In a lot of cases I am lending on Zopa - in ten pound blocks I'll admit - but it seems that loans can pickup at any times of the day, probably relative to where they are located in each of the queues and when their turn arrives in the queue.
Loans can be picked up, I think its 24 hourly, in zopa. does RS follow similar 24hr cycle of loans pickup?.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Dec 15, 2018 8:39:59 GMT
aju, I thought £10 part was good until someone told me it can’t be sold.
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aju
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Post by aju on Dec 15, 2018 9:00:40 GMT
aju , I thought £10 part was good until someone told me it can’t be sold. Its true i will not be able to sell but as i'm using it to get a handle on getting better rates for lending potentially much larger amounts later then its an acceptable issue. These £10 punts are not really about returns or resale but rather to try and see how RS is working at the rate punting end. At the moment there have been no touches anyway. We've recently had over £300 crystallized on zopa with their recent default sell offs so locking in £40 is not an issue for us. Mind you probably not best to tell Mrs aju as she would see 40 quid as another shopping opportunity. One final point is that I've never actually sold a loan from a P2P lender since starting in 2006 but there will come a time when I need to remove funds. I probably wouldn't sell out rather i'd wind down at least with RS I can actually relend capital and withdraw returns. Can't do that yet on Zopa.
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rscal
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Post by rscal on Dec 15, 2018 12:44:16 GMT
aju , I thought £10 part was good until someone told me it can’t be sold. I wonder about the interest too on £10 amortising loans and how RS handles penny fractions (since they don't show) Does anyone have info there?
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spiral
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Post by spiral on Dec 15, 2018 15:47:59 GMT
I wonder about the interest too on £10 amortising loans and how RS handles penny fractions (since they don't show) Does anyone have info there? I just checked one of my low value loans for the next 12 months.
What I saw wasn't what I expected.
Amortising loans remain the same amount each month but as each month goes by, the amount of capital increases and the amount of interest reduces as the capital gets paid off.
I assumed that if a repayment is calculated as 43.3p, the repayment I would see would be 43p (carrying over .3p each month) for 3 months and on the fourth month would increase to 44p (with 0.2p carrying over) thus reducing back to 43p the next month showing the trend distribution of increasing capital and reducing interest.
What I saw was 12 months where the capital repaid was identical and the interest was showing an upward trend starting at 18p and ending at 20p.
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aju
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Post by aju on Dec 15, 2018 16:22:55 GMT
If they are anything like Zopa they are handling them as fractions but presenting them to 2dp (Decimal Points). In Zopa one can see much lower than this level of detail, if one cares to look deeper in statements data etc, and when a Zopa loans default and they scrape up much smaller payments Zopa keeps track of this. Some months there are not enough payments to go round all lenders - according to Zopa they track these mismatched payments and even it out across lenders. Sometimes this means I get payments on some defaults 1 month nothing for 2 months then another very small payment. Who knows whether its for real or not. On RS I have a £10 loan and a £1000 loan, neither has actually received any payments as yet as its very new. The schedule for the £10 loan shows no interest in the last 5/6 months maybe due to the dp presentation level but all the totals add up as if they don't work at the sub 2dp level. The thing is though I'm guessing this evens out from a rounding point of view. Rounding on Zopa causes all kinds of discrepancies that they have struggled to mitigate but are still struggling after quite a few go's as (Its fixed, no it isn't etc etc). Beyond that perhaps RS is pocketing the difference who knows, anyone!
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