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Qardus
Mar 8, 2022 18:14:30 GMT
Post by Ace on Mar 8, 2022 18:14:30 GMT
Withdrawal is working for me now.
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dave4
Member of DD Central
Cynical is a hobby not a lifestyle
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Qardus
Mar 8, 2022 18:29:54 GMT
Post by dave4 on Mar 8, 2022 18:29:54 GMT
No not yet, will send a message now as its not just me. They often make this payment on the same day as another from memory, perhaps they have just worked out that making one withdrawal payment is cheaper and have 'hampered' the first wave? Who knows they may evolve to synchronising payment emails over time. Obviously it could just be a system glitch, but where is the fun in that. Good call mr idiot. Working well now.
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alibaba
Member of DD Central
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Qardus
Apr 13, 2022 18:00:38 GMT
Post by alibaba on Apr 13, 2022 18:00:38 GMT
Just downloaded the tax return can anyone tell me the difference between Profit Payment and Profit instalment, I am trying to round up the amount of tax I have to pay. My guess is one is interest and one is capital repayment but they both say profit. (I am easily confused).
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littleoldlady
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Running down all platforms due to age
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Post by littleoldlady on Apr 13, 2022 18:32:11 GMT
Just downloaded the tax return can anyone tell me the difference between Profit Payment and Profit instalment, I am trying to round up the amount of tax I have to pay. My guess is one is interest and one is capital repayment but they both say profit. (I am easily confused). Congratulations on starting on your tax return so soon. I am fairly sure they are all interest income so far as HMRC are concerned. Return of capital is not shown. The difference seems to be loan by loan. If you ask Q can you post their reply here?
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Post by Ace on Apr 13, 2022 18:37:31 GMT
Just downloaded the tax return can anyone tell me the difference between Profit Payment and Profit instalment, I am trying to round up the amount of tax I have to pay. My guess is one is interest and one is capital repayment but they both say profit. (I am easily confused). I don't think there is any difference between the two. They are both listed as dividend payments, so I'm putting them in the dividends section of my tax form. EDIT: Also,I believe from memory, that all of the investment memoranda state that returns are paid as dividends and quote tax at the dividend rate.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 10,886
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Qardus
Apr 13, 2022 18:58:38 GMT
Post by ilmoro on Apr 13, 2022 18:58:38 GMT
Just downloaded the tax return can anyone tell me the difference between Profit Payment and Profit instalment, I am trying to round up the amount of tax I have to pay. My guess is one is interest and one is capital repayment but they both say profit. (I am easily confused). I don't think there is any difference between the two. They are both listed as dividend payments, so I'm putting them in the dividends section of my tax form. EDIT: Also,I believe from memory, that all of the investment memoranda state that returns are paid as dividends and quote tax at the dividend rate. Mubaraba profits are taxed as interest according to the info Ive seen, maybe they are structured differently.
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Greenwood2
Member of DD Central
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Qardus
Apr 13, 2022 19:13:44 GMT
Post by Greenwood2 on Apr 13, 2022 19:13:44 GMT
I don't think there is any difference between the two. They are both listed as dividend payments, so I'm putting them in the dividends section of my tax form. EDIT: Also,I believe from memory, that all of the investment memoranda state that returns are paid as dividends and quote tax at the dividend rate. Mubaraba profits are taxed as interest according to the info Ive seen, maybe they are structured differently It would be helpful to see this clarified. By Qardus maybe?
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 10,886
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Post by ilmoro on Apr 13, 2022 19:23:36 GMT
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billt
Posts: 90
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Post by billt on Apr 14, 2022 7:12:34 GMT
I have sent a query to Qardus will report back
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Greenwood2
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Qardus
Apr 14, 2022 7:49:29 GMT
Post by Greenwood2 on Apr 14, 2022 7:49:29 GMT
From reading around it seems that the spirit of the law is to treat income from Shariah products in the same way as similar 'western' products, so it might be that income should be treated as interest even though it is paid as dividends (since the Shariah product is effectively replacing a loan). The Qardus tax statement talks about income tax but then gives payments as dividends so clear as mud. It would be good to get a definitive from Qardus.
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Post by Ace on Apr 14, 2022 12:51:18 GMT
The latest IM clearly states that the profits are to be taxed as dividends. I accept that Q may have been badly advised, but I'm happy to use that, along with the fact that all profit payments have been clearly marked as dividends, as evidence to HMRC if required to justify my position, unless billt receives a counter statement before I submit my return.
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trium
Member of DD Central
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Qardus
Apr 15, 2022 8:37:23 GMT
via mobile
Post by trium on Apr 15, 2022 8:37:23 GMT
The latest IM clearly states that the profits are to be taxed as dividends. I accept that Q may have been badly advised, but I'm happy to use that, along with the fact that all profit payments have been clearly marked as dividends, as evidence to HMRC if required to justify my position, unless billt receives a counter statement before I submit my return. You have bought shares in a SPV which makes profits trading commodities. It seems self evident that distributions to shareholders in respect of profits are dividends. The peculiarity, when comparing to the purchase of shares in any other company, is that you wouldn't normally get 1/36th of your investment returned each month and, if you did, you would not normally continue to participate in dividends on the returned portion.
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tallsuk
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Qardus
Apr 15, 2022 9:00:47 GMT
Post by tallsuk on Apr 15, 2022 9:00:47 GMT
As I understand it, not paying or charging interest is am important part of Islam which is the reason these product exist.
This means that HMRC would either have to have one rule for muslims and another for non muslims or it just considers all returns as dividends. Whilst I suspect they would prefer the former, I suspect that doing anything other than the latter would open them up to all sorts of problems.
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littleoldlady
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Running down all platforms due to age
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Qardus
Apr 15, 2022 11:39:43 GMT
Post by littleoldlady on Apr 15, 2022 11:39:43 GMT
The latest IM clearly states that the profits are to be taxed as dividends. I accept that Q may have been badly advised, but I'm happy to use that, along with the fact that all profit payments have been clearly marked as dividends, as evidence to HMRC if required to justify my position, unless billt receives a counter statement before I submit my return. I am not going to rely on Q's description of the payments as "dividends". In financial, as opposed to religious, terms they are clearly the same type of payment as interest and quite unlike dividends. Q also say that investors must get their own tax advice. We need to get a specific ruling from HHMRC.
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tallsuk
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Qardus
Apr 15, 2022 12:31:45 GMT
via mobile
Post by tallsuk on Apr 15, 2022 12:31:45 GMT
As a financial product that is designed with the sole intention of allowing one religious group to invest/attract investment I don't think you can differentiate between the financial and religious. They may look similar to other P2P investments but there entire purpose is to avoid interest and HMRC know this.
A good Muslim could not invest in or borrow from a P2P company which is why these product exist. The borrower's pay a higher return to avoid paying interest and therefore it would be wrong for investors to consider it as interest.
However, do Axia Funder not use SPVs in a similar way? I would have thought that those returns are far more likely to be questioned by HMRC. I have not had any returns from them yet but so here have. Any feedback on those returns?
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