trium
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Post by trium on Oct 8, 2021 13:19:54 GMT
I recently opened a Vanguard S&S ISA with the intention of transferring £10k from my long-running Cash ISA. I was surprised to find that Vanguard requires the source ISA to be transferred in its entirety. Only an idiot would dump 10 years worth of accumulated cash savings on the stock market all at once. Also, it took 2 months to tell me I can't do what I want to do.
One solution might be to open a Cash ISA with someone who will accept the £10k then transfer that to Vanguard, but it's a bit of a faff and not very fair on the third party provider I'm abusing.
I checked the T&Cs, but it's not exactly flashing warnings at you.
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littleoldlady
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Post by littleoldlady on Oct 8, 2021 15:42:50 GMT
I recently opened a Vanguard S&S ISA with the intention of transferring £10k from my long-running Cash ISA. I was surprised to find that Vanguard requires the source ISA to be transferred in its entirety. Only an idiot would dump 10 years worth of accumulated cash savings on the stock market all at once. Also, it took 2 months to tell me I can't do what I want to do. One solution might be to open a Cash ISA with someone who will accept the £10k then transfer that to Vanguard, but it's a bit of a faff and not very fair on the third party provider I'm abusing. I checked the T&Cs, but it's not exactly flashing warnings at you. Are you sure that V are not under the misapprehension that it is a current year ISA? Otherwise it makes no sense to me.
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trium
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Post by trium on Oct 8, 2021 16:36:10 GMT
No, they say they can only accept current year in full (which is a regulatory requirement) or all previous years in full (which isn't). It's in their T&Cs though you'd be forgiven for not spotting it, especially as you're unlikely to be expecting it.
As it is the ISA is useless and I'll have to go elsewhere.
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Post by Ace on Oct 8, 2021 16:59:03 GMT
No, they say they can only accept current year in full (which is a regulatory requirement) or all previous years in full (which isn't). It's in their T&Cs though you'd be forgiven for not spotting it, especially as you're unlikely to be expecting it. As it is the ISA is useless and I'll have to go elsewhere. I thought that I'd read about this crazy restriction before, but I couldn't find it in their T&Cs now. The closest I could find was: Which doesn't say that you can't do a partial transfer in. Having tried to go through the transfer in of a cash ISA to Vanguard process, I have to say that is really poor and confusing. Their customer support response time to messages is also very slow. Taking 2 months to reject the application is also very poor given that they say the whole process will be completed in 30 days. Despite the above, I'm very happy with my Vanguard investments.
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corto
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Post by corto on Oct 8, 2021 17:07:09 GMT
I can confirm that they request a total transfer (for previous years money), but not that they are slow; their responses were within 1 or 2 days.
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littleoldlady
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Post by littleoldlady on Oct 8, 2021 18:27:05 GMT
T thought that current year's subscriptions had to be transferred in full, not the whole of an ISA opened in the current year (if it contained funds transferred in from prior years).
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corto
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Post by corto on Oct 8, 2021 20:45:52 GMT
Yes, current years money always has to be transferred in full. That's a requirement by HMRC. For previous years money it's at the freedom of the provider. Likewise if they want to charge for it; some still have moving out fees or an interest penalty.
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Oct 9, 2021 7:35:25 GMT
I recently opened a Vanguard S&S ISA with the intention of transferring £10k from my long-running Cash ISA. I was surprised to find that Vanguard requires the source ISA to be transferred in its entirety. Only an idiot would dump 10 years worth of accumulated cash savings on the stock market all at once. Also, it took 2 months to tell me I can't do what I want to do. One solution might be to open a Cash ISA with someone who will accept the £10k then transfer that to Vanguard, but it's a bit of a faff and not very fair on the third party provider I'm abusing. I checked the T&Cs, but it's not exactly flashing warnings at you. Actually, dumping in all your money at once is statistically likely to outperform dripping it in 2/3 of the time, so it’s not as idiotic as it you think. It can feel scary to the uninitiated though.
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macq
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Post by macq on Oct 9, 2021 8:13:44 GMT
I recently opened a Vanguard S&S ISA with the intention of transferring £10k from my long-running Cash ISA. I was surprised to find that Vanguard requires the source ISA to be transferred in its entirety. Only an idiot would dump 10 years worth of accumulated cash savings on the stock market all at once. Also, it took 2 months to tell me I can't do what I want to do. One solution might be to open a Cash ISA with someone who will accept the £10k then transfer that to Vanguard, but it's a bit of a faff and not very fair on the third party provider I'm abusing. I checked the T&Cs, but it's not exactly flashing warnings at you. Not sure how much interest you would lose while doing it (but not a lot i would guess) But having done this with other platforms as most wait till money is in before investing and presumably Vanguard may work the same - could you not transfer the £10k you require using your method which will be in cash (unless you tell them a fund first ) an then leave it sitting in your account as cash and drip feed at your leisure? I.e when investing cash by debit card you have the option of cash or invest now so if the same for a transfer maybe a work around? Having done it before it may also work in reverse - as i know Fidelity do now and HL did a couple of years back so other platforms are probably the same but when transferring a S&S ISA they insist a full transfer out regardless of the year/s
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Post by gramsky on Oct 9, 2021 8:40:12 GMT
I recently opened a Vanguard S&S ISA with the intention of transferring £10k from my long-running Cash ISA. I was surprised to find that Vanguard requires the source ISA to be transferred in its entirety. Only an idiot would dump 10 years worth of accumulated cash savings on the stock market all at once. Also, it took 2 months to tell me I can't do what I want to do. One solution might be to open a Cash ISA with someone who will accept the £10k then transfer that to Vanguard, but it's a bit of a faff and not very fair on the third party provider I'm abusing. I checked the T&Cs, but it's not exactly flashing warnings at you. On the .gov website regarding transferring ISAs www.gov.uk/individual-savings-accounts/transferring-your-isa" Transferring your ISA
You can transfer your Individual Savings Account (ISA) from one provider to another at any time. You can transfer your savings to a different type of ISA or to the same type of ISA. If you want to transfer money you’ve invested in an ISA during the current year, you must transfer all of it. For money you invested in previous years, you can choose to transfer all or part of your savings". So they are not following the government rules!
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macq
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Post by macq on Oct 9, 2021 8:41:32 GMT
Strangely their page transfer your investments to us mentions full or partial transfers and the key features document only mentions "an ISA opened this year money in full" ?
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Oct 9, 2021 8:55:05 GMT
On the .gov website regarding transferring ISAs www.gov.uk/individual-savings-accounts/transferring-your-isa" Transferring your ISA
You can transfer your Individual Savings Account (ISA) from one provider to another at any time. You can transfer your savings to a different type of ISA or to the same type of ISA. If you want to transfer money you’ve invested in an ISA during the current year, you must transfer all of it. For money you invested in previous years, you can choose to transfer all or part of your savings". So they are not following the government rules! I think this is telling you what the Government will allow, not what the platform must allow. Vanguard are not obliged to follow this.
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littleoldlady
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Post by littleoldlady on Oct 9, 2021 9:05:07 GMT
Actually, dumping in all your money at once is statistically likely to outperform dripping it in 2/3 of the time, so it’s not as idiotic as it you think. It can feel scary to the uninitiated though. That depends on the time frame. Get the timing wrong and it can take years to recover your losses. In the long run though you are correct, but you know what Keynes said about the long run.
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Post by overthehill on Oct 9, 2021 10:20:39 GMT
Actually, dumping in all your money at once is statistically likely to outperform dripping it in 2/3 of the time, so it’s not as idiotic as it you think. It can feel scary to the uninitiated though. That depends on the time frame. Get the timing wrong and it can take years to recover your losses. In the long run though you are correct, but you know what Keynes said about the long run.
I'm assuming we're talking about passive index funds for this Vanguard ISA, what are the fund charges, 0.2% pa ? For an extra 0.4% pa, you can buy a knowledgeable Baillie Gifford active Fund manager or multiple managers and a huge selection of funds and investment trusts covering every sector and geographical area. Just saying, compare the last 5 years performance records.
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Oct 9, 2021 10:24:39 GMT
Actually, dumping in all your money at once is statistically likely to outperform dripping it in 2/3 of the time, so it’s not as idiotic as it you think. It can feel scary to the uninitiated though. That depends on the time frame. Get the timing wrong and it can take years to recover your losses. In the long run though you are correct, but you know what Keynes said about the long run. True, but money shouldn’t really be invested in equities unless you have an absolute minimum time frame of 10 years
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