scooter
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Post by scooter on Mar 31, 2024 17:11:19 GMT
I have been doing a little digging on my account regarding the transparency claims of CP and I came across this and I wonder how many people see it the same way I do.
AutoInvest: “Our in-house tech experts have created a unique algorithm which proportionately allocates AutoInvest funds towards projects. You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one project and we guarantee to never exceed this, ensuring you achieve your desired level of diversification.”
• My maximum pledge was set at £100 and I have no individual pledges over this amount.
• I do however have many pledges in the same project, albeit different phases.
I wouldn't have a problem with the sentence if it said: "You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one phase of a project and we guarantee to never exceed this..."
But it doesn't say that does it. Or does it it say that to everyone else....
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dave4
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Post by dave4 on Mar 31, 2024 18:45:49 GMT
I have been doing a little digging on my account regarding the transparency claims of CP and I came across this and I wonder how many people see it the same way I do. AutoInvest: “Our in-house tech experts have created a unique algorithm which proportionately allocates AutoInvest funds towards projects. You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one project and we guarantee to never exceed this, ensuring you achieve your desired level of diversification.”• My maximum pledge was set at £100 and I have no individual pledges over this amount. • I do however have many pledges in the same project, albeit different phases. I wouldn't have a problem with the sentence if it said: "You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one phase of a project and we guarantee to never exceed this..." But it doesn't say that does it. Or does it it say that to everyone else.... It is misleading, should read max pledge to every loan offering.But autolend is designed for convenience to both lender and platform ie provided a easy way to fund a loan.
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Post by overthehill on Mar 31, 2024 19:32:28 GMT
I have been doing a little digging on my account regarding the transparency claims of CP and I came across this and I wonder how many people see it the same way I do. AutoInvest: “Our in-house tech experts have created a unique algorithm which proportionately allocates AutoInvest funds towards projects. You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one project and we guarantee to never exceed this, ensuring you achieve your desired level of diversification.”• My maximum pledge was set at £100 and I have no individual pledges over this amount. • I do however have many pledges in the same project, albeit different phases. I wouldn't have a problem with the sentence if it said: "You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one phase of a project and we guarantee to never exceed this..." But it doesn't say that does it. Or does it it say that to everyone else....
You're absolutely right, the sort of thing no one complains about until projects start losing capital. It's the sort of deliberate ambiguity which made me cautious and just one reason I wouldn't use autoinvest at CP - or anywhere to be fair.
Some of the projects have a lot of phases.
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scooter
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Post by scooter on Mar 31, 2024 19:56:43 GMT
I have been doing a little digging on my account regarding the transparency claims of CP and I came across this and I wonder how many people see it the same way I do. AutoInvest: “Our in-house tech experts have created a unique algorithm which proportionately allocates AutoInvest funds towards projects. You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one project and we guarantee to never exceed this, ensuring you achieve your desired level of diversification.”• My maximum pledge was set at £100 and I have no individual pledges over this amount. • I do however have many pledges in the same project, albeit different phases. I wouldn't have a problem with the sentence if it said: "You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one phase of a project and we guarantee to never exceed this..." But it doesn't say that does it. Or does it it say that to everyone else....
You're absolutely right, the sort of thing no one complains about until projects start losing capital. It's the sort of deliberate ambiguity which made me cautious and just one reason I wouldn't use autoinvest at CP - or anywhere to be fair.
Some of the projects have a lot of phases.
Thanks for giving me the confidence to take it up with them. Sometimes you can read so much you can't see the wood for the trees. Why do they make investors check up on them? So far I have found little that is better than Kuflink on the transparency front, nothing dodgy, but actually CP are harder to pin down because they don't show real documents at all. One up to Kuflink. Well I never!
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dave4
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Post by dave4 on Mar 31, 2024 20:57:21 GMT
You're absolutely right, the sort of thing no one complains about until projects start losing capital. It's the sort of deliberate ambiguity which made me cautious and just one reason I wouldn't use autoinvest at CP - or anywhere to be fair.
Some of the projects have a lot of phases.
Thanks for giving me the confidence to take it up with them. Sometimes you can read so much you can't see the wood for the trees. Why do they make investors check up on them? So far I have found little that is better than Kuflink on the transparency front, nothing dodgy, but actually CP are harder to pin down because they don't show real documents at all. One up to Kuflink. Well I never! Cp give u 24 hrs to cancil autopledges, also several e mail's giving loan launch notifications beforehand.
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Post by Ace on Mar 31, 2024 20:58:36 GMT
It's not the first time that this issue has been raised. There is a short thread on it here. I also directly asked the CP rep about this back in 2019, see here. They replied, but didn't address this specific point. |
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scooter
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Post by scooter on Mar 31, 2024 21:48:47 GMT
It's not the first time that this issue has been raised. There is a short thread on it here. I also directly asked the CP rep about this back in 2019, see here. They replied, but didn't address this specific point. Hi, I have only £10k invested and £2.8k is invested above my specified risk level of £100, in 30 projects, 18 of which are late. As you mentioned it to them in 2019 I can't see what excuse they can have for not correcting themselves years ago if that is not what they intended. I've written my email so i will let people know the response.
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firedog
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Post by firedog on Apr 1, 2024 8:25:45 GMT
The autoinvest function is sold as 'an easy way to diversify your CrowdProperty investments'; autoinvesting into different tranches of the same loan does precisely the opposite.
If they had been advised of the ambiguity of their language in 2019 and have done nothing to address it, that leaves them on shaky ground legally.
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eeyore
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Post by eeyore on Apr 1, 2024 11:12:07 GMT
For the last year or so, I've used CP's AutoInvest facility to do "AutoPurchase" - I look at each individual loan phase when availability is notified (email day before the loan is opened) and decide whether I want to invest (I don't invest in Phase-1 loans because of the extended loan set-up delays, or loans where I've already invested in three phases, or I'm not entirely satisfied with the development's progress). If I do want to invest, I top-up my balance. Sometimes I have to use the "Skip-next-loan" option and on the couple of occasions when I've miscalculated, I just cancel the pledge.
Of course, this policy is very hands-on and requires monitoring to keep the cash account balance below the AutoInvest threshold, but I'd rather miss loans than buy into an unsuitable loan - I've been trapped in many poor loans from when I was too optimistic...
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Post by scepticalinvestor on Apr 1, 2024 16:49:26 GMT
I have been doing a little digging on my account regarding the transparency claims of CP and I came across this and I wonder how many people see it the same way I do. AutoInvest: “Our in-house tech experts have created a unique algorithm which proportionately allocates AutoInvest funds towards projects. You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one project and we guarantee to never exceed this, ensuring you achieve your desired level of diversification.”• My maximum pledge was set at £100 and I have no individual pledges over this amount. • I do however have many pledges in the same project, albeit different phases. I wouldn't have a problem with the sentence if it said: "You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one phase of a project and we guarantee to never exceed this..." But it doesn't say that does it. Or does it it say that to everyone else.... In spite of my general historic naivety around P2P offerings, I quickly learnt that most kinds of ‘Autoinvest’ weren’t fit for purpose given the risks involved. Setting that aside, I would read the above to mean what is said - maximum limit per project, not phase of a project. Given that CP used a statement as strong as “we guarantee to never exceed this” and that a ‘project’ has a certain meaning on the platform, I think you’re absolutely right to question the gap between the wording and how it actually works.
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Post by mikec on Apr 4, 2024 10:31:00 GMT
.... Sometimes I have to use the "Skip-next-loan" option and on the couple of occasions when I've miscalculated, I just cancel the pledge. Of course, this policy is very hands-on and requires monitoring to keep the cash account balance below the AutoInvest threshold, but I'd rather miss loans than buy into an unsuitable loan - I've been trapped in many poor loans from when I was too optimistic... This is indeed what you have to do. Yes it is hands-on, but if you're not happy to just auto-invest pledges into every project & phase there is always the escape option to cancel a pledge (within the notice timeframe) or plan to skip the next project loan. Personally, I rather like the lazy investment approach with CP, and my auto-investment commitments are set relatively low (£50), so mostly I'm happy to just go with the flow. Very occasionally I might push pause, where cash reserves are getting low, or I'm making some other investment plans for my cash.
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Apr 10, 2024 11:15:37 GMT
I have been doing a little digging on my account regarding the transparency claims of CP and I came across this and I wonder how many people see it the same way I do. AutoInvest: “Our in-house tech experts have created a unique algorithm which proportionately allocates AutoInvest funds towards projects. You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one project and we guarantee to never exceed this, ensuring you achieve your desired level of diversification.”• My maximum pledge was set at £100 and I have no individual pledges over this amount. • I do however have many pledges in the same project, albeit different phases. I wouldn't have a problem with the sentence if it said: "You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one phase of a project and we guarantee to never exceed this..." But it doesn't say that does it. Or does it it say that to everyone else.... Also raised this with them when I got allocated a subsequent tranche of a loan I already held ... one of us appears to have had an impact as the website (apparently changed in the last 24 hrs) now states "You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one project phase and we guarantee to never exceed this, ensuring you achieve your desired level of diversification"
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scooter
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Post by scooter on Apr 10, 2024 12:08:50 GMT
I have been doing a little digging on my account regarding the transparency claims of CP and I came across this and I wonder how many people see it the same way I do. AutoInvest: “Our in-house tech experts have created a unique algorithm which proportionately allocates AutoInvest funds towards projects. You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one project and we guarantee to never exceed this, ensuring you achieve your desired level of diversification.”• My maximum pledge was set at £100 and I have no individual pledges over this amount. • I do however have many pledges in the same project, albeit different phases. I wouldn't have a problem with the sentence if it said: "You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one phase of a project and we guarantee to never exceed this..." But it doesn't say that does it. Or does it it say that to everyone else.... Also raised this with them when I got allocated a subsequent tranche of a loan I already held ... one of us appears to have had an impact as the website (apparently changed in the last 24 hrs) now states "You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one project phase and we guarantee to never exceed this, ensuring you achieve your desired level of diversification" Well I haven't heard back from them other than to say that they give themselves 8 weeks to respond. I'm surprised you only have one duplicate though, I had loads. I'm sure others must think invest and then look for ways to get out of the investment. I actually don't, I just understand things better when I have gone through a process and can compare what I was told, with what actually happened. I looked into CP as I had turned off investments in CP whilst I was busy looking into Kuflink and I could see all the unquiet about CP from others on here. I was actually looking to see if i should turn investments back on. I probably would have done if they had changed the algorithm to match the original wording instead of the other way around. Who wants 10 pieces of the same loan, unless those 10 pieces just get you up to your maximum for a project? And a sneaky change to the wording without telling investors they have done so is worthy of a report to the FCA and unworthy of my money.
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ilmoro
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Post by ilmoro on Apr 10, 2024 12:20:53 GMT
Also raised this with them when I got allocated a subsequent tranche of a loan I already held ... one of us appears to have had an impact as the website (apparently changed in the last 24 hrs) now states "You can specify the maximum amount you’d be willing to pledge towards any one project phase and we guarantee to never exceed this, ensuring you achieve your desired level of diversification" Well I haven't heard back from them other than to say that they give themselves 8 weeks to respond. I'm surprised you only have one duplicate though, I had loads. I'm sure others must think invest and then look for ways to get out of the investment. I actually don't, I just understand things better when I have gone through a process and can compare what I was told, with what actually happened. I looked into CP as I had turned off investments in CP whilst I was busy looking into Kuflink and I could see all the unquiet about CP from others on here. I was actually looking to see if i should turn investments back on. I probably would have done if they had changed the algorithm to match the original wording instead of the other way around. Who wants 10 pieces of the same loan, unless those 10 pieces just get you up to your maximum for a project? And a sneaky change to the wording without telling investors they have done so is worthy of a report to the FCA and unworthy of my money. Only a small investment and I generally just transfer money over when there is a loan I want coming up ... got caught out because a loan didnt progress so had funds available and by fluke the next loan was one Im in. They didnt acknowledge they had changed it ... only noticed when I wrote a lengthy rebuttal of their arguments and double checked the wording on the site.
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scooter
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Post by scooter on Apr 10, 2024 12:25:19 GMT
Well I haven't heard back from them other than to say that they give themselves 8 weeks to respond. I'm surprised you only have one duplicate though, I had loads. I'm sure others must think invest and then look for ways to get out of the investment. I actually don't, I just understand things better when I have gone through a process and can compare what I was told, with what actually happened. I looked into CP as I had turned off investments in CP whilst I was busy looking into Kuflink and I could see all the unquiet about CP from others on here. I was actually looking to see if i should turn investments back on. I probably would have done if they had changed the algorithm to match the original wording instead of the other way around. Who wants 10 pieces of the same loan, unless those 10 pieces just get you up to your maximum for a project? And a sneaky change to the wording without telling investors they have done so is worthy of a report to the FCA and unworthy of my money. Only a small investment and I generally just transfer money over when there is a loan I want coming up ... got caught out because a loan didnt progress so had funds available and by fluke the next loan was one Im in. They didnt acknowledge they had changed it ... only noticed when I wrote a lengthy rebuttal of their arguments and double checked the wording on the site. Would you be comfortable sharing the rebuttal on here?
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