SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Jul 16, 2015 6:27:01 GMT
It's now 2 weeks since Fuzzy Consequences parked its tank on ReBS' lawn by introducing E rate-band loans at 18.2-20% (in practice they're filling in minutes at the 18.2% minimum). In that time, FC have posted some 25 new E loans (most have already drawn down) whilst ReBS has posted 1 (and that 10 days ago, with 4 days still to run).
Simple question: what do lenders think of the prospects for ReBS in this new competitive environment?
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arbster
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Post by arbster on Jul 16, 2015 7:32:37 GMT
As a relative newcomer to this business, I've had "look into ReBS" on my backlog for a few weeks now, but with the availability of asset-backed lending with good returns, and high rates for FC's D/E rated loans I can't see a compelling reason to do so, except for further platform diversification. However, the low loan volumes makes it less tempting to diversify here.
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merlin
Minor shareholder in Assetz and many other companies.
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Post by merlin on Jul 16, 2015 8:41:04 GMT
It's now 2 weeks since Fuzzy Consequences parked its tank on ReBS' lawn by introducing E rate-band loans at 18.2-20% (in practice they're filling in minutes at the 18.2% minimum). In that time, FC have posted some 25 new E loans (most have already drawn down) whilst ReBS has posted 1 (and that 10 days ago, with 4 days still to run). Simple question: what do lenders think of the prospects for ReBS in this new competitive environment? I think it is simply comes down to the sort of deal borrowers are being offered by FC and RBS. If RBS are not competitive they will disappear quite quickly in my opinion. Another factor could well be the volume of defaults but you wont see this for a while with FC.
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Post by danraj on Jul 16, 2015 18:07:22 GMT
Fuzzy Consequences! - I like that!
I'd be very interested to read what lenders would like from us.
We're working to improve the performance of the site. We will also be making it easier for businesses to get a 'decision in principle' before they apply. This should help encourage more of the right kind of applications.
We do have a few innovations in the pipeline that we believe will attract many new good quality applications.
Watch this space..
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Jul 16, 2015 20:28:12 GMT
Fuzzy Consequences! - I like that! I'd be very interested to read what lenders would like from us. We're working to improve the performance of the site. We will also be making it easier for businesses to get a 'decision in principle' before they apply. This should help encourage more of the right kind of applications. We do have a few innovations in the pipeline that we believe will attract many new good quality applications. Watch this space.. My recurring frustration with ReBS is the length of time money can be tied up in auctions before a loan ever gets to the stage of drawing down, especially when it is extended (and then extended again...) because it hasn't filled. I appreciate lenders are given the option to withdraw their bids, but that simply puts me back to where I started. As an example, my bids in the long-running "Soft Play Centre" loan were submitted on the 6th June, some 6 weeks ago, and the loan still hasn't completed. Now FC is offering similar loans and I can be fairly certain that money will be earning interest within 7 days. Their SM is dramatically more liquid too. Not sure how you fix this without attracting a lot more investors...
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Post by jh on Jul 17, 2015 14:41:35 GMT
Fuzzy Consequences! - I like that! I'd be very interested to read what lenders would like from us. We're working to improve the performance of the site. We will also be making it easier for businesses to get a 'decision in principle' before they apply. This should help encourage more of the right kind of applications. We do have a few innovations in the pipeline that we believe will attract many new good quality applications. Watch this space.. From an introducers' point of view, and possible a private conversation to be had, there is increasing frustration regarding the time it takes from application to actually listing. Each platform has their advantages and disadvantages to us, but at least the "Fuzzy" lot decline within 24-48 hours and agree and list within 72 hours ! From a lenders point of view, I would say shorter listing times (7 days) with the option to extend once, or twice in exceptional circumstances would decrease the time money is tied up with no income, with the aim of the case drawing down within 72 hours of the end of the auction.
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trevor
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Post by trevor on Jul 17, 2015 16:28:44 GMT
Fuzzy Consequences! - I like that! I'd be very interested to read what lenders would like from us. We're working to improve the performance of the site. We will also be making it easier for businesses to get a 'decision in principle' before they apply. This should help encourage more of the right kind of applications. We do have a few innovations in the pipeline that we believe will attract many new good quality applications. Watch this space.. The new loan flow is so slow I am able to fund new loans with my current loans monthly repayments even though my quantity of loans is in the tens. Allowing 2 weeks or more for lenders to fund a loan is too long. All my new p2p money is going to other platforms that given decent returns, OK lower than ReBS but it starts earning far more quickly. I suggest you reduce the length of the pipeline before you loose lenders. I also worry for the future of the platform with such a slow new loans rate. I suspect but obviously cannot prove that the current rate makes the platform financials unsustainable. I have been seriously considering withdrawing totally.
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Post by lynnanthony on Jul 18, 2015 7:59:35 GMT
I recently dipped a toe in Rebs for platform diversity reasons, here's my two-pen'orth:
1. Not enough loans coming through, hence impossible to get fully invested in a reasonable time-scale without buying on the secondary market, which I don't like for reasons given below.
2. Auctions take too long. If people are going to invest they'll invest in 7 days, IMHO. If a loan is going to be out there for fourteen days why bother committing until near the end?
3. I don't mind visiting a site on a daily basis but I can't always guarantee to be able to visit at a particular time, i.e. I can't necessarily be on-line for any frenzied last minute re-bids at auction end. I came out of FC for that reason (amongst others). Rebs needs dynamic bidding (you set an upper limit and a lower limit and the software rebids for you). No, not bidpal, I want to select the individual loans. I fondly imagine I may be able to dodge some bullets.
4. To me, and possibly others may differ, a secondary market is there to provide liquidity. Liquidity is important. It is not (IMHO) there to provide a way to make a quick buck. All those people generously offering to sell their micro loans at 2%, 3%, 4%, 5% mark-ups, well I ain't touching them. And given how stagnant the secondary market appears to be I may not be alone. (Compare with Assetz. Currently the secondary market works only at par. It is intended that discounted sales will come in soon, but not mark-ups. Works for me.) Rebs: can we have a filter to find offerings at par please? Or is there one and I've missed it?
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Post by mrclondon on Jul 18, 2015 10:01:39 GMT
I recently dipped a toe in Rebs for platform diversity reasons, here's my two-pen'orth: 3. I don't mind visiting a site on a daily basis but I can't always guarantee to be able to visit at a particular time, i.e. I can't necessarily be on-line for any frenzied last minute re-bids at auction end. I came out of FC for that reason (amongst others). Rebs needs dynamic bidding (you set an upper limit and a lower limit and the software rebids for you). No, not bidpal, I want to select the individual loans. I fondly imagine I may be able to dodge some bullets. In theory Rebs have an already developed solution for dynamic bidding by virtue of their work on the forthcoming ThinCats new software release. I can't imagine it would be a tremendous amount of effort to back port that into the live rebs platform.
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sqh
Member of DD Central
Before P2P, savers put a guinea in a piggy bank, now they smash the banks to become guinea pigs.
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Post by sqh on Jul 18, 2015 10:56:06 GMT
Fuzzy Consequences! - I like that! I'd be very interested to read what lenders would like from us. We're working to improve the performance of the site. We will also be making it easier for businesses to get a 'decision in principle' before they apply. This should help encourage more of the right kind of applications. We do have a few innovations in the pipeline that we believe will attract many new good quality applications. Watch this space.. Hi danraj, I would recommend the following: List auctions for no longer than 7 days. Start "C" rated auctions at 25% interest. That should guarantee they fill. Then offer borrowers the chance to have a free re-auction next year when rates will surely drop due to the vast amount of ISA money. That should taste sweeter than Fandy Closs.
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Post by betterthanworking on Jul 18, 2015 11:20:42 GMT
Break larger loans into tranches?
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Post by jh on Jul 18, 2015 16:04:56 GMT
Fuzzy Consequences! - I like that! I'd be very interested to read what lenders would like from us. We're working to improve the performance of the site. We will also be making it easier for businesses to get a 'decision in principle' before they apply. This should help encourage more of the right kind of applications. We do have a few innovations in the pipeline that we believe will attract many new good quality applications. Watch this space.. Hi danraj, I would recommend the following: List auctions for no longer than 7 days. Start "C" rated auctions at 25% interest. That should guarantee they fill. Then offer borrowers the chance to have a free re-auction next year when rates will surely drop due to the vast amount of ISA money. That should taste sweeter than Fandy Closs. As an introducer, I would say that a rate of 25% would stop me bringing business in this direction. The rate of 25% coupled with the time it takes to list, then the many hours of responding to the Q&A would sway my clients to the likes of Ezbob, MM and others which charge the higher rates without the additional work. Of course, should investors accept cases for maybe a 'D' grade at such rates, remove the Q&A on the basis ReBS have already underwritten the case, and agree on a pure unsecured with PG then it would be a little more attractive for us introducers to bring our clients in this direction. J
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Post by jackpease on Jul 19, 2015 6:28:53 GMT
>>>5%,...... a quick buck
Surely its not entirely black and white - if someone bids and ties up their money for weeks until drawdown, and holds the loan for the first dozen payments or so when there is the highest risk of default, then they have absorbed considerable risk and interest-free downtime - a premium seems reasonable.
Apart from the criminally slow speed of the site, i quite like Rebs not least because it reminds me of the good old days of Assetz when things were simple and 'wysiwyg'
Jack P
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trevor
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Post by trevor on Jul 20, 2015 21:29:59 GMT
And tomorrow there will be no loans to bid for......
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sqh
Member of DD Central
Before P2P, savers put a guinea in a piggy bank, now they smash the banks to become guinea pigs.
Posts: 1,426
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Post by sqh on Jul 20, 2015 23:24:13 GMT
And tomorrow there will be no loans to bid for...... ........ but there are 40 loans on the secondary market offering buyer rates over 15%.
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