|
Post by dualinvestor on Apr 12, 2016 6:11:53 GMT
I have been a investor in Zopa for many years, which now appears to be a managed fund (rather than as the acronym, which for those of you have not exercised your mind over it stands for "Zone of Potential Agreement", suggests a market) and a more recent investor in Ratesetter. Tomorrow is my 60th birthday and I shall be equalising my investment on both "platforms." Each will be five figures.
For some time I have been concerned about the quality of information provided by Zopa, figures do not add up on the summary page, nearly a month after the launch of their "new" products there is still no information regarding funds on the market, position in queue or speed of lending. readily available. Of more concern to me is that the rate I actually receive in interest is significantly below the rate stated as the average return on my loan book.
Therefore starting next month I shall publish the actual percentage return on my investments. If it hadn't been for the tinkering with products by Zopa they would have been homogeneous, i.e. "longer" term subject to the respective protection funds.
|
|
maxmarengo
Member of DD Central
Posts: 96
Likes: 28
|
Post by maxmarengo on Apr 12, 2016 15:33:04 GMT
Great idea - I have always calculated actual performance- but us this in the correct section?
|
|
|
Post by westonkevRS on Apr 12, 2016 17:39:30 GMT
This won't be the first time such a comparison has been run before: www.p2pindependentforum.com/thread/1157/started-ratesetter-zopa-experimentThe difference this time will be what RateSetter term (hopefully the 5-yr product) and Zopa product. If it's the Zopa classic I'm quite certain of the result, if it's the Z+ it will depend on bad debt performance and timeliness of my defaults. " May the best platform win"... Kevin.
|
|
|
Post by dualinvestor on Apr 12, 2016 19:32:09 GMT
For the avoidance of doubt this is not a competition between the platforms. It is an entirely different comparison to the earlier thread being between two mature accounts without any inclusion of starting bonuses. It also anticipates full reinvestment of proceeds and no additional funds into either account for the next twelve months.. Zopa state that I receive a annual return of 5.3% and Ratesetter 6.2%, it may be a "victory" for one or the other if they get closest to this return as much as what the actual return is. There are many and multifarious reasons to invest in either or both platforms not just performance. I should make it clear at the outset I am neither giving investment advice nor a recomendation to anyone by the intended publication of this data. Therefore in my opinion the final comment by the poster above "May the best platform win"... is entirely inappropriate.
I append my posting on the Zopa thread of this title to give an indication of the type of portfolios and comparison you will see.
"Let's not over complicate this, as the title suggests the purpose of the thread is to inform readers of my ACTUAL RETURNS. i shall look at both sites tomorrow morning, add funds from my bank account to each to make the investment equal in both (this addition will be around 0.5% of the total portfolio in each), they have been at this level for the last month so the peculiarities of repayment schedules and accrued interest have already had an opportunity to be insignificant to actual returns. The one major diference between the portfolios is diversification, due to the longevity of the accounts there are approximately 1200 loans in Zopa and 250 in Ratesetter.
Having been a qualified Chartered Accountant for over 30 years I am aware of all the potential knobs and tweaks I could make so that this would be a scientific comparison however that is not the purpose of the thread, it is just to tell people I received x% on site A and y% on site B, from roughly homogeneous portfolios. In the real world that is what matters to people with an investment not estimated, and sometimes artificial, adjustments that really only mean anything to financial professionals. It is not meant to be financial advice or a recommendation to either site, merely a record of the result.
PS Both accounts have re-lending switched on, so any difference in the rate of relending will reflect in the actual performance of each site, as of this morning 100% of the Ratesetter protfolio is lent (at a stated return of 6.2% pa) and 98% of the Zopa account is on loan (at a stated rate of 5.3%)
|
|
|
Post by dualinvestor on May 13, 2016 6:26:11 GMT
Result to 13 May 2016
Ratesetter Total Return 0.051% AER 6.3% Amount lent out 98.4%
Zopa Total Return 0.043% AER 5.3% Amount lent out 99.7%
I shall not be publishing any further detail or answering queries on these figures, please do not post on this thread so that this information will be readily avaiable for those that want to see it, if you wish to discuss the results please create your own thread for that purpose.
|
|
|
Post by closetotheedge on May 13, 2016 8:36:27 GMT
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on May 13, 2016 8:39:20 GMT
|
|
star dust
Member of DD Central
Posts: 2,998
Likes: 3,531
|
Post by star dust on May 13, 2016 15:06:43 GMT
dualinvestor, as has been stated in response to your identical thread and posts on the Zopa board, "Please don't post on my thread" is basically unenforceable (even the platform owners beta/announcement threads don't manage it without a lot of moderator intervention). The easiest way to avoid the numbers getting lost in the subsequent debate is to add (all) the numbers to the first posting (by editing it). That one will be easily viewable being at the start of the thread, and you could always add a post in thread to alert posters to an update. An alternative might be to host your own blog somewhere and provide a link to it here.
|
|
|
Post by dualinvestor on May 13, 2016 15:10:25 GMT
dualinvestor , as has been stated in response to your identical thread and posts on the Zopa board, "Please don't post on my thread" is basically unenforceable (even the platform owners beta/announcement threads don't manage it without a lot of moderator intervention). The easiest way to avoid the numbers getting lost in the subsequent debate is to add (all) the numbers to the first posting (by editing it). That one will be easily viewable being at the start of the thread, and you could always add a post in thread to alert posters to an update. An alternative might be to host your own blog somewhere and provide a link to it here. star dust It is no skin off my nose whether I publish this information or not, as another moderator, on the other thread has posted in such glowing terms (not) I am minded to stop doing so.
|
|
pip
Posts: 542
Likes: 725
|
Post by pip on May 14, 2016 6:22:02 GMT
Dual investor please stop. The information you posted on this boared is of no value to anybody as based on the information you posted it is impossible to understand what total return means. Also the rate you get is not indicative of everybody as people will have invested at different times and have different rate contracts.
Your idea that nobody should be able to post to the board is quite frankly arrogant and not in the spirit of free speech. If you really insist on doing this pointless exercise then a) please make it into a graph that you update and people can easily see the trend b) please include an assumptions page for your calculations.
Even if you did this I still don't think your idea achieves anything. The difference of rates may well reflect different risk profiles. You can't really make any conclusions on which is the best platform based on who gives you the best rate in good times. If the higher rate platform has 30% defaults the next year....
One final thing while I am in my early morning grumpy mood. Please don't pull out the I am a chartered accountant card. FYI so am I but I can assure people that does automatically validate what I say or mean I am always right. I also judge based on the merits of the argument not what qualifications the person has.
|
|
adrianc
Member of DD Central
Posts: 9,014
Likes: 4,825
|
Post by adrianc on May 14, 2016 7:59:44 GMT
dualinvestor , as has been stated in response to your identical thread and posts on the Zopa board, "Please don't post on my thread" is basically unenforceable (even the platform owners beta/announcement threads don't manage it without a lot of moderator intervention). The easiest way to avoid the numbers getting lost in the subsequent debate is to add (all) the numbers to the first posting (by editing it). That one will be easily viewable being at the start of the thread, and you could always add a post in thread to alert posters to an update. An alternative might be to host your own blog somewhere and provide a link to it here. star dust It is no skin off my nose whether I publish this information or not, as another moderator, on the other thread has posted in such glowing terms (not) I am minded to stop doing so. If we can't play to my rules, I'm going to take my ball home.
|
|