iren
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Post by iren on Aug 8, 2016 11:10:54 GMT
I have to say it is very unnerving to me. I only signed up today at ablrate in order to have a look at the loans etc with a view to investing. I am invested with several other platforms and this one seemed to get a reasonable write up in various places, so it looked ideal for a little diversity.
But, I have to say after reading this and another thread connected to "containers" I am more than a little sceptical about investing here.
Having read through these threads and subsequently doing a few google searches, there seems to be quite a number of posts warning of "container" investments. Several being described by various posters to other forums as "Ponzi" schemes. Nothing connected to ablrate I hasten to add, these are high return (12-20%) schemes being sold in Australia via Hong Kong.
I have no idea what the problem is with this loan(s). I am not suggesting that is in any way similar to the schemes I have come across but the lack of information is a big problem for me.
I and other non-lenders of containers (sold mine) have had a full update by email, and personally I am happy with Ablrate's approach and that they have listened to comment and are developing their communications policy. I don't know enough to say where the container project has gone wrong, but it is the first on this platform and a very small part of the loan book. Avoid the containers perhaps - the security is very mobile and hard to track and get hold of - but that is no reason to avoid the platform. True that this is the only default to date, but there aren't a great number of loans on the platform. For me, a write off of the two container loans would result in my running an overall loss to date on Ablrate, and I expect there are many others in this position.
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Aug 8, 2016 11:27:52 GMT
Yes, same here, a write off of the December container loan would wipe out most of my earnings over the last two years on the platform and if the overdue Aircraft loan fails as well my overall net loss will be nearly double my current earnings to date.
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littleoldlady
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Running down all platforms due to age
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Post by littleoldlady on Aug 8, 2016 11:39:37 GMT
Yes, same here, a write off of the December container loan would wipe out most of my earnings over the last two years on the platform and if the overdue Aircraft loan fails as well my overall net loss will be nearly double my current earnings to date. Lucky you. I would lose 800% of my earnings, but I can't believe that the Aircraft loan will be a total loss. If it was just the containers it would still be 150%.
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iren
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Post by iren on Aug 8, 2016 12:09:16 GMT
For me that's in spite of the container loans being, individually, my two smallest loans out of a present eleven, which shows the issue Ablrate are looking at here from a reputational standpoint. I can see why legal action is being pursued so vigorously.
I don't put the overdue plane loan in the same category, as delays in deal making are to be expected on occasion, and nothing to get vexed about. Nevertheless, although I'm still bidding on one of the new loans, I expect I'll need to see the plane loan brought to a conclusion, as well as some concrete explanation and recovery prospects on the container loans, before taking investment on Ablrate much further.
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blender
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Post by blender on Aug 8, 2016 12:20:23 GMT
I and other non-lenders of containers (sold mine) have had a full update by email, and personally I am happy with Ablrate's approach and that they have listened to comment and are developing their communications policy. I don't know enough to say where the container project has gone wrong, but it is the first on this platform and a very small part of the loan book. Avoid the containers perhaps - the security is very mobile and hard to track and get hold of - but that is no reason to avoid the platform. True that this is the only default to date, but there aren't a great number of loans on the platform. For me, a write off of the two container loans would result in my running an overall loss to date on Ablrate, and I expect there are many others in this position. Yes, I was not wishing to minimise the seriousness of this container default for those who hold it and the platform. Two points. Firstly, you cannot fully diversify within Ablrate and potential losses need to be considered as a percentage of total P2P lending. Generally the security of Ablrate loans is good and a total loss on most loans is unthinkable, potential losses are usually a fraction of the loan amount. But secondly the security on containers depends on being able to recover the containers - rather unique. The aircraft 532 is entirely different. The loan is easily covered and the plane is in a hanger. What's going on there is presumably just the borrower wishing to get the max profit from the sale and having to juggle the timing and borrowing to limit cost. It that were a total loss it would be over a year's p2p total earnings gone for me (and rather more serious for Ablrate, like terminal).
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Aug 8, 2016 12:27:52 GMT
100% capital loss on this would mean 78.9% of my current overall ABL interest would be lost. " ... potential losses need to be considered as a percentage of total P2P lending..." That's how I approach it.
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iren
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Post by iren on Aug 8, 2016 12:50:19 GMT
True that this is the only default to date, but there aren't a great number of loans on the platform. For me, a write off of the two container loans would result in my running an overall loss to date on Ablrate, and I expect there are many others in this position. Yes, I was not wishing to minimise the seriousness of this container default for those who hold it and the platform. Two points. Firstly, you cannot fully diversify within Ablrate and potential losses need to be considered as a percentage of total P2P lending. Generally the security of Ablrate loans is good and a total loss on most loans is unthinkable, potential losses are usually a fraction of the loan amount. But secondly the security on containers depends on being able to recover the containers - rather unique. The aircraft 532 is entirely different. The loan is easily covered and the plane is in a hanger. What's going on there is presumably just the borrower wishing to get the max profit from the sale and having to juggle the timing and borrowing to limit cost. It that were a total loss it would be over a year's p2p total earnings gone for me (and rather more serious for Ablrate, like terminal).
I agree with everything you say. I've had no losses in 2+ years of P2P investing, taking into account the assistance of the provision fund at RS and probably W, and the decision of M&Co to buy the lenders out of a defaulted loan at par. I'm currently running a small capital profit, having sold a few loans on at a premium, and I'll take any loss I make at Ablrate in the round. But I'm aware I've achieved this not just by a good degree of luck but by constant vigilance, including over platform performance. As it stands, I applaud the decisive actions of Ablrate in addressing the container loan issues, but await explanation, at the appropriate juncture, as to how this point was reached.
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Post by oktaeder on Aug 10, 2016 16:21:48 GMT
Any news about the lost containers?
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Aug 10, 2016 16:35:58 GMT
Any news about the lost containers? Ah, lost are they? That is the first information that I have had on the status of my overdue loan.
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blender
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Post by blender on Aug 10, 2016 18:51:42 GMT
Lost is not the word. AIUI Ablrate is establishing their present location(s) and will secure them, when located.
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Aug 10, 2016 18:55:43 GMT
This container is not lost, it's probably pining for the fjords.
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blender
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Post by blender on Aug 10, 2016 19:26:10 GMT
Yes, making a dash for freedom and the fjords. We're going to need a bigger net.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Aug 10, 2016 19:39:49 GMT
This container is not lost, it's probably pining for the fjords. I had the misfortune (?) to see Die Another Day in the company of, amongst others, a former editor of a national red top. During the car chase scene on the ice he stood up and proclaimed to the audience "That's not an Aston Martin, it's a Fjord". I was &*^^%$" myself laughing at the same time as trying to hide under the chair .
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Aug 10, 2016 20:01:20 GMT
He's not an R500, he's a very naughty boy.
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Post by ablrateandy on Aug 10, 2016 20:48:27 GMT
If anybody knows the flight speed of an unladen Chinese shipping container, please PM me.
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