stevio
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General P2x Discussion
Exiting P2P
Nov 25, 2016 7:08:44 GMT
Post by stevio on Nov 25, 2016 7:08:44 GMT
locutus . I appreciate the compliment but it's nothing to do with my skill. Ignoring my quirkier investments (including P2P of course) the fact is that anybody who invested in bog-standard global 70:30 equity/bond passive tracker portfolio inside a SIPP/ISA has done extraordinarily well over the past few years. Who needs skill when you have every major global central bank putting a floor under asset prices! Of course if they ever pull away the floor ... I too complement your 'outstanding' successes and concede, your knowledge of investments and maximizing the tax benefits far succeeds mine! Particularly with the dip in the £, surprisingly high returns on gilts and a ever decreasing panicked stock market I did invest in funds via SIPP and ISA, firstly trying to pick funds that outperformed the market, which they did for a while, then realized those that outperform often dip well below the market cyclically....along with charges eroding any meager gains, so tried low cost trackers, but unfortunately by then I had given up with equities and loved the almost immediate returns from P2P
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Nov 25, 2016 6:31:54 GMT
The loan details the how the charge and security are structured In respect of APF's credit, the only security listed in the draft loan contract is assignment of the second charge and a cross guarantee from another group company. Assignment of the second charge only has value if the underlying borrower defaults. If the underlying borrower continues to perform but APF defaults (eg one their other loan defaults, blows-up, fraud, etc etc) nothing I have read in any of the loan documentation suggests that we would have any preferential creditor claim on APF or any direct recourse to the loan repayments that the underlying borrower will continue to pay APF. Any contractual claim for the assignment of the loan repayment wouldn't rank any higher than other creditor claim. Maybe I'm missing something (which is why I raised the query), but the structuring of this loan via APF would appear to expose lenders fully to APF's credit without mitigation. Not a show stopper, but does mean that you have to get comfortable with APF's credit which is difficult given the companies were only recently incorporated and have no publicly filed financials. Loan is to APF and APF is in turn making a loan to underlying borrower. Its up to APF to claim on security if underlying borrower defaults, but APF will still be expected to continue payments of the loan to AB. If APF defaults, then AB claim on the assigned security, independent of whether or not the underlying borrower defaults, otherwise there is no point assigning security if you can't use it when needed If AB don't have step in rights to continue the loan (I am not sure in this case), then AB may come to an agreement in some way for the underlying borrower to pay off APF loan to AB and chase up APF themselves. But the risk lies with the underlying borrower as they have agreed to the assignment of the security when taking out the loan with APF.
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Nov 24, 2016 22:00:09 GMT
MoneyThing asked for this before and you agreed not a bad idea - could there be a thread for updates to progress of loans midway through, just the long term ones - you can lump them together one thread, so know where find - doesn't have to be rigourous intervals, any update at all is better than your competition and would help SM, also primary market if people confident mid loan update some point
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stevio
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General P2x Discussion
Exiting P2P
Nov 24, 2016 21:20:24 GMT
via mobile
Post by stevio on Nov 24, 2016 21:20:24 GMT
What the FIC is a FIC?
What other investments are outperforming P2P and what returns are you seeing?
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stevio
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Ablrate (ABL) in Administration
Holiday Park
Nov 24, 2016 21:12:25 GMT
via mobile
Post by stevio on Nov 24, 2016 21:12:25 GMT
ablrate - I have a few further questions I hope you can answer in order to fully understand the credit risk associated with this loan: 1. Whilst the fact that APF are intermediaries has been discussed as being positive from a credit perspective, it does complicate assessing the total exposure to lenders as we are exposed to both APF and the underlying borrower's credit risk. The loan documentation mainly focuses on the underlying borrower's credit and associated security documents which are sufficient to give a view on the underlying loan. The area I have less comfort, is the credit of APF, and the security in place (if any) should APF default (for whatever reason that may be unrelated to the underlying loan). Specifically, what security do we have from APF in respect of thier performance. I understand that the 2nd charge on the underlying borrower's asset will be assigned to lenders, but I'm not sure whether this helps in the event of APF defaulting (and the underlying borrower continues to perform). I note that as APF are administering the loan, a valid fixed charge cannot be placed on the underlying debt. My fear is that in the event of APF defaulting (for reasons other than the underlying loan defaulting), the underlying borrower would continue to make repayments to APF in administration/liquidation and we would be a unsecured creditor. How would lenders secure the repayments from the underlying borrower in the event of APF's default/administration/liquidation? Is there any direct contractual relationship with the underlying borrower that could procure them to make payments direct to us in the event of APF entering into adminstation/liquidation? Absence this, the only other potential security would be a floating charge on the underlying debt but I'm sure that would be complicated/diluted by existing security arrangements APF has with other lenders financing its loan book. What comfort, if any, can you provide that risk is mitigated? 2. Will a SM be made immediately in this loan on draw down? I'm still in the process of building up a diversified loan book on the platform and I'm willing to make larger initial investments if a SM in the loan is made to allow me to later diversify and reduce my concentration in the loan. I had invested in the container SPV loan on this basis but have been left holding my full investment as no SM has been made in that loan to date. Not really a specific risk regarding this loan, but nevertheless affects the amount I'm willing to invest. Thanks Nick The loan details the how the charge and security are structured
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stevio
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Ablrate (ABL) in Administration
16%!
Nov 23, 2016 17:44:30 GMT
Post by stevio on Nov 23, 2016 17:44:30 GMT
Thanks Stevio - developer uploaded pledge system and some errant code went up... fixing it now. Thanks for pointing it out so quick! regards Ablrate No worries (and, to misquote Airplane!, "Don't call me stevio " ) I'd say that was an honor, don't diss it
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stevio
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Ablrate (ABL) in Administration
16%!
Nov 22, 2016 18:15:38 GMT
Post by stevio on Nov 22, 2016 18:15:38 GMT
16% for a 2nd charge loan sounds reasonable Even at possibly 100% LTV?
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stevio
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Ablrate (ABL) in Administration
Holiday Park
Nov 22, 2016 12:49:56 GMT
Post by stevio on Nov 22, 2016 12:49:56 GMT
ablrate changed from invest (somebodies £509) to pledge again now!
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stevio
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General P2x Discussion
Exiting P2P
Nov 22, 2016 10:20:34 GMT
Post by stevio on Nov 22, 2016 10:20:34 GMT
Is this the same with the similar AB loans? No Ablrate deal that has cars on HP comes to mind. Closest that come to my mind are the car dealer stocking loans and since they are stock they are in the possession of the dealers. If you think one does do HP please say which it is with enough specificity for me to identify it. Yes, the car dealer stocking loans In the same way AE can't walk off with the security because its in the hands of their borrowers, could not the same be said of ACF because the security is in the hands of their borrowers Also, be interested to hear your thoughts on Collateral? There is already a lot of information 'around'
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Nov 22, 2016 8:33:01 GMT
We are clarifying this. As it stands the £100k is being injected into the company giving the guarantee. This is different to what you originally said Hi stevio As per the email there is another £100k going in subordinate to Ablrate lenders Regards DavidSo the subordinated amount is only increasing by £18k and the LTV is slowly increasing towards 70% (from around 60%) the more tranches are released (or was this error and it was supposed to remain £2 35 instead of £2 53K)
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stevio
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General P2x Discussion
SIPPs
Nov 22, 2016 6:52:47 GMT
Post by stevio on Nov 22, 2016 6:52:47 GMT
Agree 100%. I e-mailed on Friday as well as the letter appeared to contradict itself. The least I am looking for is to get all the money onto my platforms (SS and Ablrate) split as I want by end December and then be free to leave all money there including re-investing matured loans and interest. I heard back from Greyfriars today. I assume anyone who contacted them will hear from them as well, so will leave them to tell it their way. But in general, good news. It's not a horrorshow, at least from my perspective. I tried calling but the person who sent the letter wasn't available and hasn't called me back yet - could elaborate please as there is only a finite time to make other arrangements
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Nov 21, 2016 18:56:27 GMT
Thanks Stevio - spoken to the borrower and will posting answers for you on this and the B********* one shortly. Is greater than 7hrs considered 'shortly'?
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stevio
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General P2x Discussion
Exiting P2P
Nov 21, 2016 16:36:46 GMT
Post by stevio on Nov 21, 2016 16:36:46 GMT
MoneyThing: the AEnnn care hire purchase loans. These are lending to a firm that does car hire purchase to low credit rating people. The cars all have built in trackers. The security is both a 50% LTV on the hire purchase payments by the car buyers and an 80% LTV on the car values. While the borrowing HP firm is still trading, any defaulting HP buyers are swapped out at no explicit cost to lenders. When a HP purchase completes a replacement car is added to the package. The loan terms are six month renewable so you have regular end of term exits if the secondary market quietens down. Since the HP payments are from consumers and the cars are owned by the consumers most of the risk of the security vanishing just isn't there because the borrower doesn't have possession of the security.Is this the same with the similar AB loans?
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stevio
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General P2x Discussion
Exiting P2P
Nov 21, 2016 16:29:11 GMT
Post by stevio on Nov 21, 2016 16:29:11 GMT
Where P2P can offer tax exempt gains is in capital gains from selling loans on platforms where the original loan issuance or secondary market is of simple debts. Capital gains on simple debts are exempt from CGT. Others may just do little enough gaining to stay within their CGT allowance. Could you kindly expand on the CGT points you mention? Are there specific platforms?
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Nov 21, 2016 8:07:21 GMT
ablrate where does this say this in the loan proposal? - previously it was "£235,000 in cash or loans made within ACI1 Ltd will be subordinated to the Ablrate debenture, further securing the transaction" now "£253,000 in cash or loans made within ACI1 Ltd will be subordinated to the Ablrate debenture, further securing the transaction" The underwriting has increased by 100k, but this is not the same ablrate is it possible to have an answer to this query please? Morning ablrate 3rd request for an answer to this question please?
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