mosaic
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Post by mosaic on Oct 10, 2017 14:19:58 GMT
"Our IT dev team is working on this support issue"
23 weeks and counting
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Oct 10, 2017 18:02:57 GMT
Paul64 , Lendy Support : Can you please explain why Lendy continue to exclude DFL001, DFL002, and PBL155 -- loans where LPA receivers have been appointed -- from the non-performing loans total? ISTM that loans are either performing or non-performing. Why would a lender appoint LPA receivers to deal with a performing loan? Hi mikes1531 , thanks for the message. Those three loans are still in the tolerance period and therefore not in default yet. Please see our Overdue Loans policy (https://lendy.co.uk/documents/OVERDUE_LOANS_DEFAULT_POLICY.pdf) Lendy Support , Lendy Support : Thanks for replying. Perhaps I didn't make my question clear, however, as your reply didn't really respond to the issue I was trying to raise. I wasn't asking about loans classified as Default vs. loans not classified as Default. Lendy have made it very clear when they reclassify loans as DEF. I was asking about loans considered to be performing vs. those considered to be non-performing. The statement by Lendy was not that that 13% of their loans are in default, but that 13% of loans are considered non-performing. Let me try asking my question in a different way... Do Lendy consider DFL001, DFL002, and PBL155 to be performing loans? Hi all, I stick with what I provided before, that these loans are not in default - hence the reason I included our Overdue Loans policy - which includes our definition of what is performing and non performing, but these definitions vary company to company. , Lendy Support: In your message above you referred again to Lendy's Overdue Loans policy and stated that it "includes our definition of what is performing and non performing". I have gone back to that document and reread it yet again, and I'm afraid you need to do the same. It can't possibly do what you say it does because the word "performing" is not in it anywhere! If I have missed that definition in the document somewhere then I'd be pleased if you could point it out to me and I will apologise promptly. As I said earlier, Lendy have made it very clear when they reclassify loans as Defaulted, and I accept that. If Lendy wish to say "13% of Lendy’s loan book by value is considered to be in Default", I can't argue with that because Lendy have a published policy that defines Default. But I really don't think Lendy can say "13% of Lendy’s loan book by value is considered non-performing" without defining non-performing, especially if the Lendy's definition of that term -- which is used widely in the financial sector -- is so noticeably different from most anybody else's definition. I have extreme difficulty believing that anyone other than Lendy would consider a loan over which LPA receivers have been appointed to be 'performing'.
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coda
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Post by coda on Oct 10, 2017 19:53:58 GMT
It is appalling that Lendy considers that loans where the receivers have been appointed are not in default or are not non-performing loans. I have been negotiating loan agreements for a living on a daily basis for almost ten years. I have never seen any contractual documentation whereby the appointment of the receivers is not an event of default. It is not a matter of practice company by company. ALL the lenders on the market would consider that such event is putting the loan into the default and the non performing category. Lendy you are the only one to consider that a loan where the receiver has been appointed is not in default simply because of the "tolerance period". If that is the case under the loan documentation then I think Lendy needs serious advice as to the terms of their documentation.
I am personally slowly withdrawing from this platform as I really cannot believe that we have Lendy on this forum saying that they do not consider that the appointment of receivers put a loan into the default category. There is clearly an issue here. When you compare this with AC for instance, it is the day and night in terms of professional lending practice.
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fp
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Post by fp on Oct 10, 2017 20:00:03 GMT
Don't worry too much, its all free fodder for the reporters and anyone else who cares to take note.
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Post by martin44 on Oct 10, 2017 20:09:27 GMT
As ilmoro has pointed out, Lendy may say they have appointed receivers, but documentation on CH (or the lack of) would suggest that they might not have appointed receivers or they might 'have'.. i think. maybe Lendy have their own team of 'Lendy receivers' Specialist type receivers that do not exactly receive, but pretend to receive. It could be suggested that someone might be telling porky's, but i prefer to believe that Lendy will sort this all out in good time, as soon as they have gotten through the support tickets. |
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Oct 10, 2017 20:31:44 GMT
As ilmoro has pointed out, Lendy may say they have appointed receivers, but documentation on CH (or the lack of) would suggest that they might not have appointed receivers or they might 'have'.. i think. maybe Lendy have their own team of 'Lendy receivers' Specialist type receivers that do not exactly receive, but pretend to receive. It could be suggested that someone might be telling porky's, but i prefer to believe that Lendy will sort this all out in good time, as soon as they have gotten through the support tickets. Basically, Lendy have to pay mega £ to a front man to bat away (spin  ) awkward questions like this rather than give a straight answer themselves; if the actual "experienced" loan management team won't answer coherently we certainly won't get it from "Lendy support".
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Oct 10, 2017 21:25:03 GMT
There was one thing that came up when I reread the Lendy Overdue Loans policy that really struck me as worth noting, but I didn't want to mention it in my previous posting because it would have been a distraction. I'll mention it now, though. The final point in the policy is... Perhaps that's just a standard clause in situations like this, but what that means to me is that Lendy have a policy, but if they don't want to stick to it they're under no obligation to do so. The bottom line is that there's no point in trying to argue that Lendy aren't doing what they said they would, because they've said they can do anything they like.  |
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GeorgeT
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Post by GeorgeT on Oct 10, 2017 23:11:53 GMT
On a basic level it seems to me to be somewhat absurd that trading in certain loans has been suspended because they are non performing but at the same time Lendy tell us they have not defaulted.
Non performing but not in default seems to me to be contradictory.
This exercise in smoke and mirrors seems to me to be little more than an attempt to make the default numbers look better than they are at a time when the platform is coming under some external scrutiny.
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Post by webbski9 on Oct 11, 2017 6:26:30 GMT
Well said all the above investors.Clearly L will not be changing their stance anytime soon so.........
LENDY...change the SM now....we want to be able to trade ,with a discount or premium.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Oct 11, 2017 11:57:21 GMT
On a basic level it seems to me to be somewhat absurd that trading in certain loans has been suspended because they are non performing but at the same time Lendy tell us they have not defaulted. Non performing but not in default seems to me to be contradictory. This exercise in smoke and mirrors seems to me to be little more than an attempt to make the default numbers look better than they are at a time when the platform is coming under some external scrutiny. : You and I may think those loans are non-performing, but Lendy do not! (That's how they keep their percentage of the loan book that's non-performing down.)
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Post by Lendy Support on Oct 11, 2017 14:48:53 GMT
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Oct 11, 2017 15:24:02 GMT
Lendy Support: Thanks for the link. To save others the trouble of going looking for it, here is the relevant part... ISTM that DFL001, DFL002, and PBL155 all meet at least the first three of the criteria, so there's no question in my mind that these loans are non-performing by the P2PFA's definition. AIUI, Lendy are not members of the P2PFA, so they're free to define non-performing any way they wish.
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Post by trentenders on Oct 11, 2017 15:39:06 GMT
I'm confused. Do Lendy share the same definition of 'non-performing' then? I thought that only yesterday you stated that Lendy doesn't use the P2PFA's definitions, as they would be misleading for your platform (you don't consider 'defaults' to be 'capital losses', but P2PFA consider them one and the same). Are your stats also reported on a 12 monthly calendar basis (Jan to Dec), so perhaps not taking any recent defaults or non-performers into consideration?
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Oct 11, 2017 22:13:27 GMT
Lendy Support : Thanks for the link. To save others the trouble of going looking for it, here is the relevant part... ISTM that DFL001, DFL002, and PBL155 all meet at least the first three of the criteria, so there's no question in my mind that these loans are non-performing by the P2PFA's definition. AIUI, Lendy are not members of the P2PFA, so they're free to define non-performing any way they wish. I was bored with a copy of excel to hand, and i reckon that under the P2PFA's terms there are £57.2m of Lendy loans that could be considered NPL from their £183.4m active loanbook. That's 31.1% non-performing loans. I'm sure we can all come up with slightly different figures, but I bet everyone trying that out by applying the rules in a)-e) above will come up with a figure closer to the Telegraph's figure than Lendy's. This said, I do think there are a few loans there which are perhaps a bit hard done by in being called NPL, but nothing that could bring it down to anywhere near 13% NPL.
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Oct 12, 2017 7:17:58 GMT
RM01 has appeared on part of the security for DFL002, receiver appointed 11/09, appears on filing as of 6/10 ... unclear if delay on part of CH or SSSH.
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) awkward questions like this rather than give a straight answer themselves; if the actual "experienced" loan management team won't answer coherently we certainly won't get it from "Lendy support".
