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Post by queenvictoria on Jul 2, 2019 21:52:17 GMT
N-u-L was noticeably absent from the string of updates today.
4 months now since the last proposed opening date and nearly 5 months since the last update of any real substance. Meanwhile it is more that 14 months since interest was last received and all suggestions that interest might be paid have dried up. The last time refinance was mentioned was in February 2019. If there is light in the tunnel we are not being told about it.
I don't really see what action lenders can take other than complain to MT. Can anyone else who has money invested in this loan see any action that might be open to us?
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Post by quidsaveblue2003 on Jul 2, 2019 22:39:47 GMT
There are enough complain here and I believe MT notice all of them but still keep quiet, although they said they are taking the right options.
They are pushing the lenders who have been trapped in this loan to the cliff edge of taking some drastic measures against this.
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robski
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Post by robski on Jul 3, 2019 7:42:42 GMT
I think we just need to hold our nerve and see it out.
I cannot see how any kind of rushed measures would get us to a better situation, in fact I think we would be in no different situation now had we had action a year ago.
For the investors getting this over the line, is the best hope to me that we will see a satisfactory outcome. For me thats unfortunately now defined as only a small capital loss. Thats what I am prepared for.
A fire sale of the building will see a significant loss IMO. I think we are in this one for the long haul.
If you look at even good projects (such as Scotland) getting refinanced capital now is tricky, a project like this... I see it being 12 months of SUCCESSFUL trading before anyone would touch it personally. 12-24 months ago this would probably have been snapped up by another P2P lender, using the same description, now I see zero chance.
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Post by queenvictoria on Jul 3, 2019 8:41:09 GMT
I think we just need to hold our nerve and see it out. I cannot see how any kind of rushed measures would get us to a better situation, in fact I think we would be in no different situation now had we had action a year ago. For the investors getting this over the line, is the best hope to me that we will see a satisfactory outcome. For me thats unfortunately now defined as only a small capital loss. Thats what I am prepared for. A fire sale of the building will see a significant loss IMO. I think we are in this one for the long haul. If you look at even good projects (such as Scotland) getting refinanced capital now is tricky, a project like this... I see it being 12 months of SUCCESSFUL trading before anyone would touch it personally. 12-24 months ago this would probably have been snapped up by another P2P lender, using the same description, now I see zero chance. I don't disagree with you but I think you are guessing as am I. I have investments elsewhere and I monitor progress. I've had a career in management and have always monitored progress. In many situations you really just have to sit on your hands and let things play out so I'm not unused to that. What is different about this loan in particular (and more this loan than this platform, I think) is there is very little information with which to monitor progress and then when there is it is incomplete, contradictory and often suggests events to come that then do not come to pass.
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james21
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Post by james21 on Jul 3, 2019 8:53:02 GMT
I think we just need to hold our nerve and see it out. I cannot see how any kind of rushed measures would get us to a better situation, in fact I think we would be in no different situation now had we had action a year ago. For the investors getting this over the line, is the best hope to me that we will see a satisfactory outcome. For me thats unfortunately now defined as only a small capital loss. Thats what I am prepared for. A fire sale of the building will see a significant loss IMO. I think we are in this one for the long haul. If you look at even good projects (such as Scotland) getting refinanced capital now is tricky, a project like this... I see it being 12 months of SUCCESSFUL trading before anyone would touch it personally. 12-24 months ago this would probably have been snapped up by another P2P lender, using the same description, now I see zero chance. A good summary. MT are doing the right think sitting back and giving time because the alternative of default/receiver/auction will be a much worse outcome. But it might end up that way, I am in from the start but did not really think about the business model which I now think is a poor one, the building is not special, parking poor, in a not very good area. I am a better judge now. It will be expensive to convert the building to apartments which is the only use I can think for it so for a new purchaser the buying has to be low and a major loss to inverters
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keystone
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Post by keystone on Jul 3, 2019 8:55:23 GMT
I think we are in this one for the long haul. The site was purchased by the borrower for £3.54m, 12 years ago, we have only been involved for not even 2 years, I think we have a looooooooooooooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggggggggggggggg wait ahead of us.
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Jul 3, 2019 9:26:15 GMT
I think we are in this one for the long haul. The site was purchased by the borrower for £3.54m, 12 years ago, we have only been involved for not even 2 years, I think we have a looooooooooooooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggggggggggggggg wait ahead of us. [img src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/embarrassed.png" class="smile" alt=" "] It won’t be that long. Something will happen either way in this tax year.
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Post by quidsaveblue2003 on Jul 3, 2019 9:44:01 GMT
The site was purchased by the borrower for £3.54m, 12 years ago, we have only been involved for not even 2 years, I think we have a looooooooooooooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggggggggggggggg wait ahead of us. 12 years? then the site price should be at least doubled?
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Jul 3, 2019 9:48:21 GMT
The site was purchased by the borrower for £3.54m, 12 years ago, we have only been involved for not even 2 years, I think we have a looooooooooooooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggggggggggggggg wait ahead of us. [img class="smile" alt=" " src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/embarrassed.png"] 12 years? then the site price should be at least doubled? Why? 12 years ago was the peak of a property boom right before a crash, which some areas have still not recovered from
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Post by queenvictoria on Jul 3, 2019 9:49:12 GMT
The site was purchased by the borrower for £3.54m, 12 years ago, we have only been involved for not even 2 years, I think we have a looooooooooooooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggggggggggggggg wait ahead of us. [img src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/embarrassed.png" class="smile" alt=" "] It won’t be that long. Something will happen either way in this tax year. What is the significance of the tax year?
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Jul 3, 2019 9:50:54 GMT
It won’t be that long. Something will happen either way in this tax year. What is the significance of the tax year? No significance just giving a rough timeline
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robski
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Post by robski on Jul 3, 2019 10:03:44 GMT
I think we just need to hold our nerve and see it out. I cannot see how any kind of rushed measures would get us to a better situation, in fact I think we would be in no different situation now had we had action a year ago. For the investors getting this over the line, is the best hope to me that we will see a satisfactory outcome. For me thats unfortunately now defined as only a small capital loss. Thats what I am prepared for. A fire sale of the building will see a significant loss IMO. I think we are in this one for the long haul. If you look at even good projects (such as Scotland) getting refinanced capital now is tricky, a project like this... I see it being 12 months of SUCCESSFUL trading before anyone would touch it personally. 12-24 months ago this would probably have been snapped up by another P2P lender, using the same description, now I see zero chance. I don't disagree with you but I think you are guessing as am I. I have investments elsewhere and I monitor progress. I've had a career in management and have always monitored progress. In many situations you really just have to sit on your hands and let things play out so I'm not unused to that. What is different about this loan in particular (and more this loan than this platform, I think) is there is very little information with which to monitor progress and then when there is it is incomplete, contradictory and often suggests events to come that then do not come to pass. Ive also had a career in management, both project management and as finance director so I agree its nice to be able to monitor things, however sometimes unless you can directly see the output the monitoring is next to worthless.The coder is is always "just a few hours off being finished" good luck monitoring that one. The architect who is almost done calculating the loads in order to spec the steel you need to order who has been saying that for 2 weeks. I don't want false promises on this one, once there is something worth knowing MT have always communicated. There are professionals seemingly involved, so we should let them do their thing, I am sure MT are communicating with them. I remember many years ago as a relatively green project leader complaining I was spending more time giving project updates than working on them and telling senior management that of they let me get on and deliver the project it would be on time but if they insisted on daily updates and weekly meetings on progress then it would be late. They didnt relent on the requests, in fact it got worse as they agreed to less updates but then queried the less frequent updates for more detail It was delivered on time btw
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dovap
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Post by dovap on Jul 3, 2019 10:31:34 GMT
It was 'near-complete' almost two years ago when launched. Baffling to think it needs a bit more time or further to trade 'successfully' and that this particular borrower has shown any aptitude or ability to deliver on this wishful thinking.
oh well soon be gearing up for the xmas rush.........
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stokeloans
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Post by stokeloans on Jul 3, 2019 11:07:38 GMT
I think we just need to hold our nerve and see it out. I cannot see how any kind of rushed measures would get us to a better situation, in fact I think we would be in no different situation now had we had action a year ago. For the investors getting this over the line, is the best hope to me that we will see a satisfactory outcome. For me thats unfortunately now defined as only a small capital loss. Thats what I am prepared for. A fire sale of the building will see a significant loss IMO. I think we are in this one for the long haul. If you look at even good projects (such as Scotland) getting refinanced capital now is tricky, a project like this... I see it being 12 months of SUCCESSFUL trading before anyone would touch it personally. 12-24 months ago this would probably have been snapped up by another P2P lender, using the same description, now I see zero chance. A good summary. MT are doing the right think sitting back and giving time because the alternative of default/receiver/auction will be a much worse outcome. But it might end up that way, I am in from the start but did not really think about the business model which I now think is a poor one, the building is not special, parking poor, in a not very good area. I am a better judge now. It will be expensive to convert the building to apartments which is the only use I can think for it so for a new purchaser the buying has to be low and a major loss to inverters I disagree with you. Nothing wrong with the original business model, it's widely used in the antiques trade. There is a large on site car park. There is nothing wrong with the area, it's a 5 minute walk from the town centre. The only problem is the borrower !!!
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robski
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Post by robski on Jul 3, 2019 11:21:06 GMT
Thats my view as well These sorts of projects are all about the last 1% Its fine getting to 75%, then 85% but the last 15% includes the snagging etc The last 1% is horrible. People without experience don't realise this. All the final sign offs, quite possibly no even understanding half the things they will need to get done.
And from experience (as an observer) if you get on the wrong side of these sorts of people, inspectors, they don't let go.
I suspect the borrower is in this area now, trying to get all sorts of issue resolved. Its where a decent experienced project manager (or team if the project is that big) is the key in getting it across the line. Underestimating things that can go wrong, taking comfort from "updates" etc. Just look at crossrail....
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