|
|
Post by mellbreak on Dec 30, 2017 17:58:12 GMT
Can anyone explain why Assetz Capital has created several transactions for fractions of a penny, reported in the Statement Summary like this:
Mousing over the amount in the last column produces a popup which shows the amount as "-£5.49E-18". It is not clear how to interpret the figure shown as "greater than" a negative number.
Several hundred pounds was available to invest, and this is not reinvestment of a small amount of interest received. I can't imagine that they have really invested such a tiny amount in a loan part, and it is ridiculous to show figures to 40 decimal places. I see that on mousing over amounts invested the figure is also shown to 11 decimal places, such as £474.70938535266.
I queried this with them, and the reply was:
As it didn't seem fruitful to pursue enquiries with someone who is unable to distinguish the internal workings of a computer from the presentation of results on a user interface, I wondered whether anyone else on this board has encountered this previously and knows what is going on.
|
|
|
|
Post by jevans4949 on Dec 30, 2017 20:47:46 GMT
This has been raised before, and the subject of much discussion.
The database system which Assetz uses has a data-type which accurately supports 40 decimal places.
Individuals' loan parts are held not in currency but as a fraction of the total loan.
When a loan id drawn down, it is financed by "selling" large loan parts either to wealthy underwriters or to the Quick Access and 30 day Access accounts. These then sell (some of) their loan parts at par on the secondary market to us common punters.
The secondary market system works by aggregating all the loan parts offered for sale and dividing them between those wanting to buy with free cash available - so all buyers get the fairest share possible.
That's the way it is, and most punters have by now got used to this.
|
|
drgonzo
Member of DD Central
Posts: 82 
Likes: 95
|
Post by drgonzo on Dec 30, 2017 20:54:48 GMT
Yep, can be annoying. I'm in the process of transferring funds in to the new ISA account... I really don't remember typing all those 9's!!   |
|
IFISAcava
Member of DD Central
Posts: 3,683
Likes: 3,008
|
Post by IFISAcava on Dec 31, 2017 0:51:37 GMT
Yep, can be annoying. I'm in the process of transferring funds in to the new ISA account... I really don't remember typing all those 9's!! View AttachmentRemember, 0.9999 recurring is the same as 1. So it's just a different way of writing £12000
|
|
mikeb
Posts: 1,070
Likes: 472
|
Post by mikeb on Dec 31, 2017 20:26:34 GMT
... in the same way it appears this micropennies "system" actively prevents you selling out of loans in the MLIA. Even if you set a sale target for an amount higher than you hold, to ensure every last penny-let is sold, it remains stuck there. So I have an MLIA with me "invested in" 59 loans, almost all with holdings of £0.00, accrued interest of £0.00, that won't go away. For a bonus, I have statements filled with interest payments of £0.00 and capital repayments of £0.00 It is a ridiculous paperwork ballache, and has been like that for months, since I tried to clear out the MLIA to leave only failed/defaulted loans. Reporting this, as usual, has done little to resolve the problem or reassure me that AC have a clue what is happening: I've been told - It's a known IT problem being looked into
- It's a problem with my account that needs to be investigated (result of investigation to be discovered ... )
- That it's too complex to deal with on any normal timescale, and I will receive quarterly updates on what is, or isn't happening.
- That I can use excel in the mean time to download the data and filter out all the guff.
Can't get any clarification of whether it IS just my account, or what the problem is.
|
|
|
|
Post by mellbreak on Dec 31, 2017 20:35:57 GMT
I can understand that displaying 20 or 40 places of decimals can just be attributed to sloppy programming, displaying raw data rather than rounding it to a sensible value to show in a user interface.
I don't understand why a transaction exists at all for tiny amounts. Either they are investing my money in a loan part or they are not, and if they are it must surely be for a larger amount than 10-18 pounds.
And this value does not match the figure shown at the end of the line, because £5.49x10-18 is not greater than £0.01 as stated (assuming that the negative sign indicates that money has gone from my available cash into the investment.)
|
|
star dust
Member of DD Central
Posts: 2,998
Likes: 3,531
|
Post by star dust on Dec 31, 2017 20:45:40 GMT
I have a similar problem as mikeb with a quarter of my MLIA loans with £0.00 invested in, but it's not new, at least one of them has been like that for nearly a year. I have very little left in AC and gave up wading through the 20 pages of -0.0000000000000000000000000001 (probably exaggerating here  ) statements a long time ago. I haven't even bothered contacting them, one day I guess I may get motivated enough to sell up completely and try and withdraw everything - which may be an impossibility as last I looked I had some <0.1 p's worth of suspended loans in the QAA. Meanwhile I tend to login at least once a month just to clock the dashboard totals in my toe holdings. |
|
|
|
Post by mellbreak on Dec 31, 2017 21:28:37 GMT
I've had a look at the previous discussion of this in 2015 and I have read the explanations given then by Chris. In view of that I withdraw my suggestion of "sloppy programming", and just express the opinion that the decision to display so many decimal places is not likely to be the most helpful one for most users. If anyone is worried about rounding discrepancies of a few pence, I don't think they should be investing here. Providing an option to display lots of decimals when specifically asked for should satisfy everyone.
This is a different question, though, from setting up loan parts and transactions for trivially small amounts and retaining these when the balance is essentially zero.
|
|
|
|
Post by valerieb on Dec 31, 2017 21:33:08 GMT
I have the same experience, dozens of loans with £0.00 invested, regularly paying out £0.00 capital and £0.00 interest with £0.00 and £0.00 transferred into the QAA. More annoyingly, my total investment as shown on the dashboard is permanently some £40 less than my total investment as shown on the balance statement. I raised this with AC who confirmed the higher figure was the correct one but I was apparently wrong in assuming the dashboard would change. However, I decided to put my perfectionist tendencies on hold and just live with these minor irritations.
|
|
jonah
Member of DD Central
Posts: 2,031
Likes: 1,113
|
Post by jonah on Dec 31, 2017 21:35:28 GMT
To get out of a loan on mlia... first put in a sell order for slightly more than you have. Assuming the loan isn’t suspended and that there is more demand than units selling, you parts will go. Once you have sold all the parts, delete the sell order. At That point, once any remaining accrued interest is paid, it should drop from the “your loans” list.
Personally I don’t delete the sell order though. A minus 1p order reminds me I’ve left a loan. A minus £10 order is for a loan I’ve left and never want to consider returning under any circumstances.
|
|
star dust
Member of DD Central
Posts: 2,998
Likes: 3,531
|
Post by star dust on Dec 31, 2017 23:13:52 GMT
To get out of a loan on mlia... first put in a sell order for slightly more than you have. Assuming the loan isn’t suspended and that there is more demand than units selling, you parts will go. Once you have sold all the parts, delete the sell order. At That point, once any remaining accrued interest is paid, it should drop from the “your loans” list. Personally I don’t delete the sell order though. A minus 1p order reminds me I’ve left a loan. A minus £10 order is for a loan I’ve left and never want to consider returning under any circumstances. I went and had a look and there were a couple with 'outstanding' sell orders, but certainly not the case for all of them. Where they existed I deleted the sell orders, which made no difference, but it usually takes a while for the AC system to recognise or act on a change in those so I'll have a look next year (  ) to see if they've dropped out. In Edit: Next Year - it's made no difference yet, so I think lynnanthony may be correct.
|
|
|
|
Post by lynnanthony on Jan 1, 2018 8:48:02 GMT
To get out of a loan on mlia... first put in a sell order for slightly more than you have. Assuming the loan isn’t suspended and that there is more demand than units selling, you parts will go. Once you have sold all the parts, delete the sell order. At That point, once any remaining accrued interest is paid, it should drop from the “your loans” list.My experience is that loans remain in "your loans" until the loan itself is finished, paid off. It surely would not be difficult for Assetz to hide zero holdings / zero accrued interest loans, both from "your loans" and from the various statements.
|
|
|
|
Post by beeje13 on Jan 1, 2018 10:26:54 GMT
I have a similar problem as mikeb with a quarter of my MLIA loans with £0.00 invested in, but it's not new, at least one of them has been like that for nearly a year. I have very little left in AC and gave up wading through the 20 pages of -0.0000000000000000000000000001 (probably exaggerating here ) statements a long time ago. I haven't even bothered contacting them, one day I guess I may get motivated enough to sell up completely and try and withdraw everything - which may be an impossibility as last I looked I had some <0.1 p's worth of suspended loans in the QAA. Meanwhile I tend to login at least once a month just to clock the dashboard totals in my toe holdings. I'm sure that you can still sell out of QAA with the suspended loans - I think everyone has those showing as a holding.
|
|
mikeb
Posts: 1,070
Likes: 472
|
Post by mikeb on Jan 7, 2018 19:58:16 GMT
To get out of a loan on mlia... first put in a sell order for slightly more than you have. Assuming the loan isn’t suspended and that there is more demand than units selling, you parts will go. Once you have sold all the parts, delete the sell order. At That point, once any remaining accrued interest is paid, it should drop from the “your loans” list. I said: "Even if you set a sale target for an amount higher than you hold, to ensure every last penny-let is sold ..." -- as I am well aware of the inability to clear the last micro-pence when selling on AC. I agree, it should. It doesn't. Hence my post!  As to the suggestion that loans stay in your "Invested in" list when you are not invested in them, but the loans still exist, that's not true either: I managed to get the list down to these "stuck" 59 loans from far higher. Once the loans were sold, and accrued interest paid, most of them did drop out (so within a month). These other loans are sold, there is no holding, no accrued interest to come, they are not downgraded/defaulted/late. There is no reason to show them as "invested in" (I'm not) or to keep spamming my statement with £0.00 amounts on loans I don't hold.
|
|
) statements a long time ago. 
) to see if they've dropped out.