teddy
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Post by teddy on Jan 21, 2018 18:26:36 GMT
There is currently no functioning PF. It is a marketing ploy that has never been, errr, deployed. This may change in February when it is rumoured the PF May pay interest on defaulted loans. Oh the joy of RS where the experience is seamless. That seems a little strong to me, and stands in direct opposition to public AC comments, eg here. I think it's reasonable to be cautious around expectations for the PF, and its absolutely right to be critical of what passes for "diversification" in AC accounts like GBBA, but I don't think saying that there is "no functioning PF" is justified..... It's perfectly justified. Either the PF exists and pays out, or it doesn't pay out and could arguably be said to not even exist. As it currently doesn't pay out, there is no functioning PF. AshtonDav's statement is 100% accurate.
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teddy
Posts: 214
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Post by teddy on Jan 21, 2018 18:53:14 GMT
There are lots of people out there unhappy that they can't pick and choose what to sell from a packaged account. Not unique to AC. I've dabbled with GBBA1 and GEIA and been hit pretty bad Are you saying the provision fund has failed to pay out to reimburse you for your losses? Have you contacted AC and asked why the PF has failed to pay out?
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Jan 21, 2018 19:16:29 GMT
I've dabbled with GBBA1 and GEIA and been hit pretty bad Are you saying the provision fund has failed to pay out to reimburse you for your losses? Have you contacted AC and asked why the PF has failed to pay out? No-one on AC has yet suffered any losses, since no loan has yet had a Bad Debt declared by AC. And because no-one in a PF account has yet suffered a loss, the PF has not yet needed to pay out anything to compensate them. Until AC start declaring Bad Debts on long-defaulted loans (there are several that appear rather obvious), the impasse is likely to continue.
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Post by elephantrosie on Jan 21, 2018 19:22:35 GMT
when does a defaulted loan get declared as bad debt
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teddy
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Post by teddy on Jan 21, 2018 19:50:30 GMT
when does a defaulted loan get declared as bad debt It doesn't. It's the can that gets eternally kicked further and further down the road, until such time as the lenders die and stop demanding their losses back from the mythical unicorn fund.
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teddy
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Post by teddy on Jan 21, 2018 19:55:15 GMT
Are you saying the provision fund has failed to pay out to reimburse you for your losses? Have you contacted AC and asked why the PF has failed to pay out? No-one on AC has yet suffered any losses, since no loan has yet had a Bad Debt declared by AC. And because no-one in a PF account has yet suffered a loss, the PF has not yet needed to pay out anything to compensate them. Until AC start declaring Bad Debts on long-defaulted loans (there are several that appear rather obvious), the impasse is likely to continue. So, what you're implying here is what we're all thinking, mainly that either the provision find doesn't exist, or that the clearly eatablished bad debts are so huge that they would wipe out the provision fund. In other words, Assetz Capital is a ponzi scheme and a busted flush? Why has the security not been sold to repay lenders? Why hasn't the FCA been notified of AC's refusal to declare bad debts on its platform, and its refusal to pay lenders from the advertised provision fund. Discretionary or otherwise, it has to pay out some time. I'm sure the FCA will take a very dim view of AC's conduct thus far regarding defaulted loans.
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Post by df on Jan 21, 2018 19:55:57 GMT
when does a defaulted loan get declared as bad debt I don't think there is a specific time scale.
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Post by captainconfident on Jan 21, 2018 20:40:51 GMT
when does a defaulted loan get declared as bad debt I don't think there is a specific time scale. People stop complaining when they die of old age.
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trouble
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Post by trouble on Jan 21, 2018 21:02:30 GMT
I suspect paying out under the PF for capital loss can only take place when the loan is declared irrecoverable in law, otherwise it might weaken any recovery action.
Default is not the same as bad debt
Bad debt for tax purposes is not the same as declared irrecoverable in law.
I guess as if a bad debt can be recovered down the line then no point weakening the PF in the meantime by paying out.
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jlend
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Post by jlend on Jan 21, 2018 21:06:15 GMT
No-one on AC has yet suffered any losses, since no loan has yet had a Bad Debt declared by AC. And because no-one in a PF account has yet suffered a loss, the PF has not yet needed to pay out anything to compensate them. Until AC start declaring Bad Debts on long-defaulted loans (there are several that appear rather obvious), the impasse is likely to continue. Yes, I haven't suffered a realised loss, although I am not optimistic.  I'm being pragmatic, I might get something recovered from these loans but it could be a multi-year process. The AC PF doesn't seem to be designed/funded to handle large failures, so how this is handled will be key to maintaining my interest in these convenient account types. I think as with all the P2P platforms, the one thing lenders want is clarity of process and then consistency when that process is enacted. My main bugbear is more the structural flaw in these accounts which exposes each lender to a massive loss from one loan, which surely is against the ethos of hands-off investing where you want the risk automatically diversified as best as possible. How GBBA2 handles this better will be interesting indeed. Agree it would be good to get some early insight on on how the new diversification will work, ideally before it is implemented. There are many different ways of doing it that the various platforms that use PF funds have implemented. For example RS shares any loss equallly across all investors pro rata based on their total investment rather than their investment in specific loans. It will be interesting to see how AC handle it for both new and existing investments.
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jlend
Member of DD Central
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Post by jlend on Jan 21, 2018 21:14:44 GMT
No-one on AC has yet suffered any losses, since no loan has yet had a Bad Debt declared by AC. And because no-one in a PF account has yet suffered a loss, the PF has not yet needed to pay out anything to compensate them. Until AC start declaring Bad Debts on long-defaulted loans (there are several that appear rather obvious), the impasse is likely to continue. So, what you're implying here is what we're all thinking, mainly that either the provision find doesn't exist, or that the clearly eatablished bad debts are so huge that they would wipe out the provision fund. In other words, Assetz Capital is a ponzi scheme and a busted flush? Why has the security not been sold to repay lenders? Why hasn't the FCA been notified of AC's refusal to declare bad debts on its platform, and its refusal to pay lenders from the advertised provision fund. Discretionary or otherwise, it has to pay out some time. I'm sure the FCA will take a very dim view of AC's conduct thus far regarding defaulted loans. You are free to make an official compliant. All the p2p platforms have a complaints process that includes the FOS if needed. For AC the process is described here www.assetzcapital.co.uk/complaintsBased on experience I know FOS complaints are taken seriously by financial service providers and are given due consideration by all parties
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daveb4
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Post by daveb4 on Jan 21, 2018 21:49:49 GMT
Based on experience I know FOS complaints are taken seriously by financial service providers and are given due consideration by all parties Not going to disagree with your thought process as FSP''s are concerned but someone who works for a big 4 bank dealing daily with FOS most of them struggle to understand what a loan/mortgage is let alone understand P2P, so that side of your point could be interesting? 😀
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Post by elephantrosie on Jan 22, 2018 0:55:20 GMT
if a loan has defaulted but not defined as bad debt yet, what is the implication on tax declaration?
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Post by davee39 on Jan 22, 2018 10:06:00 GMT
After reading this thread I had a look at some of the loans suspended from sale.
The obvious candidates for a write off are the plumber and the optical company, once receivership/liquidation has exhausted the assets and bankruptcy has voided the personal guarantee, it is time to move on and declare a bad debt, I hope this will happen at the next updates.
Most of the other loans are subject to various forms of recovery and are not yet ready to be written off.
The big Scottish estate is not non performing. Interest is being accrued backed by assets. The loan suspension means it is not available for instant access.
Overall Assetz have a good record for both recoveries and communication, however the PF needs less fudge, more clarity, and activation once recovery is complete.
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Post by misterp2p on Jan 22, 2018 10:32:01 GMT
So in my GBBA 1..the losers and percentages held
#389 5% Suspended
#388 6% Suspended
#227 10% Suspended
#336 20.85% "monitoring event"..not looking hopeful ( I find it hard to believe the purpose of this loan was even considered but heyho )
42% of my GBBA1 in trouble, not really acceptable
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