jonno
Member of DD Central
nil satis nisi optimum
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Post by jonno on Mar 18, 2018 14:20:06 GMT
I have a significant wedge in Lendy and am as disillusioned and fed up as everyone else seems to be. However, the best (only?) chance of getting a reasonable amount of my capital back over time is to allow Lendy to pull off some of what they are promising in their "updates". The worst outcome for all of us is if the whole thing comes tumbling down (IMHO).
So, can someone explain to me the benefit for anyone with a stake in Lendy posting the type of reviews on Trustpilot that they are? Whilst it may be beneficial to those more fortunate (than us) souls who may have been considering it and are now not, please spare a thought for those of us who are reliant on Lendy as a going concern.
Maybe I am naïve, selfish, or just stupid (probably all three).
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Post by charliebrown on Mar 18, 2018 14:43:50 GMT
I have a significant wedge in Lendy and am as disillusioned and fed up as everyone else seems to be. However, the best (only?) chance of getting a reasonable amount of my capital back over time is to allow Lendy to pull off some of what they are promising in their "updates". The worst outcome for all of us is if the whole thing comes tumbling down (IMHO).
So, can someone explain to me the benefit for anyone with a stake in Lendy posting the type of reviews on Trustpilot that they are? Whilst it may be beneficial to those more fortunate (than us) souls who may have been considering it and are now not, please spare a thought for those of us who are reliant on Lendy as a going concern.
Maybe I am naïve, selfish, or just stupid (probably all three). I’m in agreement. I’m panicked that the whole platform will come crashing down. I haven’t posted a TrustPilot review, but I’ve posted negative sentiment on these pages. I think LY is just about on its knees and kicking someone when their on their knees makes no sense when we need them to stand up.
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Post by samford71 on Mar 18, 2018 14:47:17 GMT
Can you elaborate on the kinds of things you think we/they don't understand? Also, just because the received wisdom is to diversify (some say diworsify) both platforms and loans and figures like 1%-5% are bandied around, if someone wants to put 100% of his cash in one loan on one platform because he likes risk and that would have a much better expected outcome than putting it all on red why shouldn't he? Diversification in general reduces the expected gain and also reduces the variance. Some folk might prefer the higher expected gain with higher or much higher variance. Both approaches and everything inbetween are all valid and depend on one's appetite for risk. People have the right to invest 100% of their money on anything they like from loans to equities to the spin of a wheel on a roulette table. They must, however, take responsibility for the outcome of that risk taking and not blame others. This is particularly pertinent for P2P platforms because they are clearly not regulated to provide investment advice. So any investment decision is purely down to the lender. The most basic of DD would have shown any investor that SS was a platform started by two people who have no extensive background in property lending. So nobody can be surprised that SS didn't evaluate correctly the quality of some of the property deals they originated in 2015/16. Moreover, the whole front-loaded fee structure of the SS business model clearly favours "pump and dump" volume over quality. Their inability to get their accounts out on time and get FCA approval are further red flags. In terms of the underlying product, over 2015/16, SS offered bridge lending and speculative development projects where borrowers were paying often twice the typical yield. Clearly these projects are at the riskier end of the spectrum so higher default rates should be expected. Recovery data demonstrates that while senior, sub 70% LTV, loans often recover at par (or close to par), a significant minority recover at much lower levels. So no one should be surprised about the poor level of recoveries on some loans. So all the information to see that this outcome was quite likely was available in 2013-15. Nonetheless, at a 12% yield, a 35% default rate and 67% recovery on a loan portfolio will still breakeven. At a 25% default rate and 80% recovery, lenders will return 6.75% which is perfectly acceptable and within the expectations for this type of asset. So, while there are a glut of complaints, it's not clear to me that holding a portfolio of legacy SS loans from 2015/16 will actually deliver the terrible returns that many are now complaining about. Of course, if you stuck it all in one loan or a few loans then your outcome may be far better or worse but again that was a personal decision. Edit: As an aside, I have 35-40% of my net wealth in one investment so I am not against concentration risk. However, that investment is very transparent to me and I understand it's risk characteristics very well. It can't lose more than 5%, it's 90% in T-bills most of the time, the managers can liquidate the portfolio in <24 hours etc etc. I don't see P2P platforms as offering a fraction of that transparency, liquidity or stability so I size my positions in P2P accordingly.
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locutus
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Post by locutus on Mar 18, 2018 16:54:48 GMT
Edit: As an aside, I have 35-40% of my net wealth in one investment so I am not against concentration risk. However, that investment is very transparent to me and I understand it's risk characteristics very well. It can't lose more than 5%, it's 90% in T-bills most of the time, the managers can liquidate the portfolio in <24 hours etc etc. I don't see P2P platforms as offering a fraction of that transparency, liquidity or stability so I size my positions in P2P accordingly. T-bill rates don't even keep up with inflation and don't you also run FX risk too holding T-bills?
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Post by westcountryfunder on Mar 18, 2018 18:01:04 GMT
somebody has just left a five star review, pretty much parroting the Lendy line about following the advice not to put all your eggs in one basket and reading the valuation reports carefully. It looks like someone may be doing a bit of trolling or Lendy staff are working from home over the weekend desperately fighting a rearguard action trying to hang onto their jobs. It wasn't me but if I was to write a review there it wouldn't be very much different. I'm approching 4 years with lendy, XIRR 12.46%, currently in a few negative day loans but expect minimal losses even if they eventually default. Much improved comms compared to 12 months ago IMO. It's a lot of hard work, but doing my own due dilligence has enabled me to avoid many (but obviously not all) disasters. Biggest disaster for me in the last 12 months has been loan 330 on AC (42% capital loss after recovery of the secured asset), and prior to that I've had a few 100% capital losses on secured loans on TC, and a 30% capital loss on some modern art on FS. Yes, I've also been 4 years with Lendy and find I tend to agree. Simple interest return of 13.6%, and even after notionally writing off the two Exeter loans and taking the probable hit on IOW, I get a simple interest yield of 9.28%. OK there will probably be some other bad debts, but there's a long way to go before I would be making less than 'safe' alternatives. That said, I'm pretty heavily into AC, in which I have greater confidence and sleep more easily at night! But please don't let us talk ourselves into a crisis.
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brianlom1
Member of DD Central
He's not the Messiah, he's a very naughty boy!
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Post by brianlom1 on Mar 18, 2018 18:36:50 GMT
I have a significant wedge in Lendy and am as disillusioned and fed up as everyone else seems to be. However, the best (only?) chance of getting a reasonable amount of my capital back over time is to allow Lendy to pull off some of what they are promising in their "updates". The worst outcome for all of us is if the whole thing comes tumbling down (IMHO).
So, can someone explain to me the benefit for anyone with a stake in Lendy posting the type of reviews on Trustpilot that they are? Whilst it may be beneficial to those more fortunate (than us) souls who may have been considering it and are now not, please spare a thought for those of us who are reliant on Lendy as a going concern.
Maybe I am naïve, selfish, or just stupid (probably all three). TBH, I consider my TrustPilot review to be a fair assessment (and I still show my more positive review from a couple of years ago). But, to answer the question, I think that going public with our concerns is the lesser of two evils: Option 1 - Confront Lendy with our concerns in the hope they take action to regain investor trust (but at the risk that no-one will be prepared to buy either new or SM loans) Option 2 - Keep quiet about our concerns in the hope of finding a 'greater fool' to buy our SM loans (which all but guarantees that Ly will do nothing to regain investor trust)
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Post by loftankerman on Mar 18, 2018 19:20:26 GMT
I suspect that Lendy's position seems to be so weak at present that anyone owing them a large amount of money probably has the upper hand and can run them ragged. They won't admit it to lenders, so their chosen option is to bluster it out. I haven't posted a review on Trustpilot as I feel that anyone bothering to read those already there before pitching in will have had enough warnings spelt out for them. I can't bring myself to give them a good review even if much of the messing about we are getting isn't directly down to them.
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Mar 18, 2018 22:27:03 GMT
Firstly I am always very skeptical of the posts on Trustpilot, Trip Advisor, Revoo, etc as I’m aware that in addition to many genuine posts, the reviews can also be manipulated either by the business being reviewed or a competitor.
Having made that point, I agree with many of the points made in this thread and LY have for whatever reason, be it naive when loaning investors funds, arrogance, ineptitude in managing projects, etc - the simple fact remains that at this stage it’s in no ones interests for anything detrimental to happen to the platform.
The easiest way out of this is for LY to simply come clean. Face facts, in many cases they’ve screwed up and investors can accept that undesirable truth. What investors cannot accept is the continual BS or the silent treatment.
LY obviously monitor comments made on the forum so my advice would be to simply make a clean start. We may go off at the deep end but it will soon calm down and the business can start making progress again rather than the stall situation we all find ourselves in.
How about it Liam and Tim.
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Mar 18, 2018 22:39:05 GMT
What would you have them say?
There are a lot of Lendy investors who have not been in any of the bad loans who might still be investing away.
I think the col debacle has had a more negative effect than anything else, although I do find Lendy to have by far the worst communication skills than any other platform.
The major red flag is the field the tried to push on investors recently. At least they didn’t go ahead.
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Mar 18, 2018 22:58:14 GMT
What would you have them say? There are a lot of Lendy investors who have not been in any of the bad loans who might still be investing away. I think the col debacle has had a more negative effect than anything else, although I do find Lendy to have by far the worst communication skills than any other platform. The major red flag is the field the tried to push on investors recently. At least they didn’t go ahead. I'm not suggesting for one moment they suddenly pop up on the forum and engage in some form of self-flagellation. But direct communication via a confidential e-mail with investors that are directly affected by some of their loans - defaulted or non-performing wouldn't go amiss in my book. At least investors would feel they were not being simply being left in the dark.
LY boast they have over 20,000 registered investors. Are they all active - of course not so what's the point of blowing that trumpet when the number of investors per loan opportunity is reducing. Clearly some folks feel they're being taken for granted and the point about the field is just one good example.
I agree that COL has had an effect but also it presents an opportunity for platform(s), possibly AC excepted, to treat investors in a more professional way.
Just my ramblings.
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