mason
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Post by mason on Aug 14, 2018 19:17:02 GMT
In case anyone's wondering, it looks like the patent was published ok (8th August) Does that mean it has been granted? It's not yet been examined. However, a prior art search has been carried out and in the first instance claims 1-7 and 14 appear to lack novelty and/or an inventive step over this granted US patent. From first glance, it appears that the specific details in claim 8 are required for novelty and if granted, it's likely it will be claim 8 and dependent claims that will be protected. Which seems fine as it is the water mist features of the device that are most important. Interestingly, they've managed to keep the detail of their technology quite vague, so hopefully the examiner won't find turn up anything that prior-arts the misting device. Having perused the description and diagrams, it isn't apparent to me why the specific design they have chosen gives an advantage that couldn't be replicated in a device that is not (for example) ring-shaped - and that's a key criterion of their patent application. Note that the claims were substantially revised on 26th February 2018 and the above claim numbers refer to the newer version of the claims lodged behind the original claim set.
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Aug 14, 2018 21:12:28 GMT
Does that mean it has been granted? It's not yet been examined. However, a prior art search has been carried out and in the first instance claims 1-7 and 14 appear to lack novelty and/or an inventive step over this granted US patent. From first glance, it appears that the specific details in claim 8 are required for novelty and if granted, it's likely it will be claim 8 and dependent claims that will be protected. Which seems fine as it is the water mist features of the device that are most important. Interestingly, they've managed to keep the detail of their technology quite vague, so hopefully the examiner won't find turn up anything that prior-arts the misting device. Having perused the description and diagrams, it isn't apparent to me why the specific design they have chosen gives an advantage that couldn't be replicated in a device that is not (for example) ring-shaped - and that's a key criterion of their patent application. Note that the claims were substantially revised on 26th February 2018 and the above claim numbers refer to the newer version of the claims lodged behind the original claim set. Thanks - useful info. I decided to take only a small mid 3 figure bite of this one as not convinced on the security. But it seemed popular. Fingers crossed it goes OK.
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Post by ladywhitenap on Nov 22, 2018 14:23:17 GMT
I see these guys are back for another 250-500k on top of the £1m borrowed 3 months ago.
I'll be interested to read the proposal when it comes out tomorrow. Unless some new unforeseen opportunity has appeared, it seems like bad planning to be wanting more cash so soon after the last lot.
Loan parts from the original loan are currently available at discount on the SM for anyone with a taste for more.
LW
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blender
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Post by blender on Nov 22, 2018 14:58:24 GMT
I see these guys are back for another 250-500k on top of the £1m borrowed 3 months ago. I'll be interested to read the proposal when it comes out tomorrow. Unless some new unforeseen opportunity has appeared, it seems like bad planning to be wanting more cash so soon after the last lot. Loan parts from the original loan are currently available at discount on the SM for anyone with a taste for more. LW You are too generous, LW. The previous request was for up to £1M, with a minimum of £250k, and they borrowed £1M! Best not to pre-judge the new unseen application, but the security proposal will be of interest.
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Nov 23, 2018 13:41:09 GMT
The dilemma is whether to invest now and take instant returns, or wait for the SM where I would predict with 95% certainty there will be healthy discounts available. Perhaps I'll do both.
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Post by ladywhitenap on Nov 23, 2018 14:15:34 GMT
Last time I looked, there was plenty on the SM from the first loan at a discount.
LW
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nick
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Post by nick on Nov 23, 2018 14:16:13 GMT
The dilemma is whether to invest now and take instant returns, or wait for the SM where I would predict with 95% certainty there will be healthy discounts available. Perhaps I'll do both. If you are looking to invest now, why not just buy the existing loan which is trading at a 2.5% discount which will get you invested and accruing interest now? The existing debt is also senior to the new issue. I can't see why anyone would buy into the new loan at par when a high ranking debt with with similar maturity is available now at a discount unless I'm missing something?
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blender
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Post by blender on Nov 23, 2018 14:18:11 GMT
The dilemma is whether to invest now and take instant returns, or wait for the SM where I would predict with 95% certainty there will be healthy discounts available. Perhaps I'll do both. Why not just buy 108 @97.5%? You will rank ahead of 112 for the security of the patent applied for. (No, I am not selling) Edit. Oops. The same thought as nick.
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Nov 23, 2018 14:19:20 GMT
The dilemma is whether to invest now and take instant returns, or wait for the SM where I would predict with 95% certainty there will be healthy discounts available. Perhaps I'll do both. If you are looking to invest now, why not just buy the existing loan which is trading at a 2.5% discount which will get you invested and accruing interest now? The existing debt is also senior to the new issue. I can't see why anyone would buy into the new loan at par when a high ranking debt with with similar maturity is available now at a discount unless I'm missing something? Extra security elsewhere - existing loan is (I think) only secured on the patent - this has other things.
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Nov 23, 2018 14:21:05 GMT
The dilemma is whether to invest now and take instant returns, or wait for the SM where I would predict with 95% certainty there will be healthy discounts available. Perhaps I'll do both. Why not just buy 108 @97.5%? You will rank ahead of 112 for the security of the patent applied for. (No, I am not selling) Edit. Oops. The same thought as nick.
If only there was an option not to buy at all.
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blender
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Post by blender on Nov 23, 2018 14:28:50 GMT
If you are looking to invest now, why not just buy the existing loan which is trading at a 2.5% discount which will get you invested and accruing interest now? The existing debt is also senior to the new issue. I can't see why anyone would buy into the new loan at par when a high ranking debt with with similar maturity is available now at a discount unless I'm missing something? Extra security elsewhere - existing loan is (I think) only secured on the patent - this has other things. Not exactly. The existing loan has a debenture over the holding company (the borrower for both loans) which has cross guarantees with the operating company. 112 has a debenture over the operating company (so how does that rank with 108?). The persons are providing the same personal guarantees for both loans (unquantified). The new security for 112 is the manufacturing company and its plant. Maybe you just have a distaste for anything second-hand.
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blender
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Post by blender on Nov 23, 2018 14:31:11 GMT
Why not just buy 108 @97.5%? You will rank ahead of 112 for the security of the patent applied for. (No, I am not selling) Edit. Oops. The same thought as nick.
If only there was an option not to buy at all. I would have liked your post, had you used the subjunctive correctly.
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elliotn
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Post by elliotn on Nov 23, 2018 14:49:30 GMT
If only there was an option not to buy at all. I would have liked your post, had you used the subjunctive correctly. Having done so well not to split their infinitve...I have had to go and unlike! (Mitigant: Fri night, getting late etc ).
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blender
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Post by blender on Nov 23, 2018 14:57:47 GMT
Idiots today are not what they used to be. The genetic pool of a modern village is not sufficiently limited - I blame incomers, brought by the railways. Soon we may have a sentence ending with a preposition.
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boundah
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Post by boundah on Nov 23, 2018 15:26:06 GMT
Idiots today are not what they used to be. The genetic pool of a modern village is not sufficiently limited - I blame incomers, brought by the railways. Soon we may have a sentence ending with a preposition. I'm not sure what all the fuss is about. Surely we have better things to fight over?
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