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Post by loadsamoney on Aug 26, 2018 12:50:07 GMT
From time to time I hop over to 4th way to read their reviews/ratings of various platforms. Generally speaking, I have been reassured that the options I have chosen have been appropriately conservative (I refrain from using the term 'safe'!)
However, in a number of cases lately, my gut is urging caution, while 4th Way's ratings remain 'Excellent' or 'Exceptional'.
Simple question: what credence do investors here give 4th Way ratings? Are there any other ratings that investors here have confidence in? Orca Money seem to share, in some cases, 4th Way's views insofar as they concern me. Trustpilot is worse than useless ...
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Post by Proptechfish on Aug 26, 2018 23:19:23 GMT
I scan 4thway now and again as well as Orca Money, take them with a pinch of salt. Useful for an introduction and a generally overview as part of a much more in-depth analysis of a site before committing. I rate Lawrence at Financialthing too. I blog myself but its literally a personal commentary on my own portfolio experiences, I'm not sure I would have the gumption and commitment to rank sites myself. |
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Post by loadsamoney on Aug 27, 2018 6:18:22 GMT
Thanks Proptechfish. Yes, I forgot Financialthing, but I do peek there too. Where do you blog? |
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benaj
Member of DD Central
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Post by benaj on Aug 27, 2018 7:03:26 GMT
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Post by Proptechfish on Aug 27, 2018 13:37:42 GMT
Thanks Proptechfish . Yes, I forgot Financialthing, but I do peek there too. Where do you blog?
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Post by loadsamoney on Aug 28, 2018 4:09:51 GMT
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Post by GentlemansFamilyFinances on Aug 29, 2018 10:14:04 GMT
I'm surprised that something like Funding Circle or ThinCats is not rated on 4thway.
Some of the other ones, I'd not heard of before but get glowing recommendations (and I'm sure with caveats in the small print)
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Post by markaldrich on Aug 30, 2018 17:02:40 GMT
I put quite a lot of store in their recommendations. Particularly ref proplend where it’s 1k per loan so hoping this not misplaced!
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Post by samford71 on Aug 30, 2018 18:47:37 GMT
To be blunt, I always found it hard to take 4thWay seriously. I suppose a P2P comparison website is always going to be positively biased toward P2P but 4thWay just seems way over the top. Of the 15 platforms it ranks, 12 get "exceptional" 3 star rating, 3 get the "excellent" 2 star rating and precisely zero get the "average" 1 star rating. Clearly every P2P platform they review is just brill then ... They also recommend that people put 50% of their investments into P2P link. It might fit the objectives of a small minority but we're talking about a signficant overweight position in an asset class that is untested, where platforms and their management are untested given the very benign credit conditions of recent years, and where many platforms have weak balance sheets. I just can't see how 50% is your starting point, probably 10% is, and the FCA now seem to agree with me. The also try to use the classic tactic often seen in the P2P industry of using loan data derived from bank portfolios and then extrapolating that to P2P portfolios. The problem is that the borrowers who use P2P are not the same as the ones who get their loans from a bank; because if you could get it from a bank you would since it's considerably cheaper. It's sort of "bait and switch". |
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Post by bracknellboy on Aug 30, 2018 20:28:43 GMT
well on one level I supposed I shouldn't comment as i've not read 4thway stuff. However if the following is correct:
"12 get "exceptional" 3 star rating, 3 get the "excellent" 2 star rating and precisely zero get the "average" 1 star rating..... "
How does that work then ? Now, we can argue till the cows come home whether "average" was meant to mean (no pun intended), the mean, median or modal. But lets assume it was meant to be the "mean" as that is what is commonly understood by that misused term "average"; however on that basis is ain't going to fit any of them.
"They also recommend that people put 50% of their investments into P2P..".
Do they ? I would have thought that the best 'spin' you could put on that is that it is naive and misguided; the other spin might be that it is not entirely unaligned with "links" they might have with P2P. But that would be pure speculation. And I tend to lean towards the 'over enthusiastic' model rather than the less pleasant alternatives.
Still, I understand that 4thWay Risk Scores were created by a "senior credit specialist" [no idea who they were senior, or indeedjunior to] and a senior quantitative risk modellor, who "helps banks improve their lending": so no risk there then, all is well in the jungle.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Aug 30, 2018 21:26:50 GMT
Of the 15 platforms it ranks, 12 get "exceptional" 3 star rating, 3 get the "excellent" 2 star rating and precisely zero get the "average" 1 star rating. Clearly ever P2P platform they review is just brill then ... They also recommend that people put 50% of their investments into P2P link. This is what I found on their website www.4thway.co.uk/candid-opinion/think-put-half-savings-p2p-lending/#Why_50_in_P2P_lendingWhy 50% in P2P lending? Here are the key reasons why I think 50% of most people's investment pot should be in P2P lending. They are the same reasons why I co-founded 4thWay, by the way. No suggestion of recommending people putting 50% money into p2p lending. www.4thway.co.uk/compare/The 4thWay PLUS Ratings are indicators, not guarantees, I don't think they are rankings. I think it's more about comparison of different p2p platforms, in terms of risks and returns.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Aug 31, 2018 7:24:19 GMT
benaj .. that post could benefit from quote marks around the bits 4th way say, rather than you. I think 50% is plumb insane for most people, and comparisons where everything is above average are equally misleading ( unless you are the US president who wanted everyone to have an above average income).
4thway are clearly cheerleaders, not referees.
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JamesFrance
Member of DD Central
Port Grimaud 1974
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Post by JamesFrance on Sept 1, 2018 10:31:01 GMT
Of the 15 platforms it ranks, 12 get "exceptional" 3 star rating, 3 get the "excellent" 2 star rating and precisely zero get the "average" 1 star rating. Clearly ever P2P platform they review is just brill then ... They also recommend that people put 50% of their investments into P2P link. This is what I found on their website www.4thway.co.uk/candid-opinion/think-put-half-savings-p2p-lending/#Why_50_in_P2P_lendingWhy 50% in P2P lending? Here are the key reasons why I think 50% of most people's investment pot should be in P2P lending. They are the same reasons why I co-founded 4thWay, by the way. No suggestion of recommending people putting 50% money into p2p lending. www.4thway.co.uk/compare/The 4thWay PLUS Ratings are indicators, not guarantees, I don't think they are rankings. I think it's more about comparison of different p2p platforms, in terms of risks and returns. That is interesting. I inherited some shares in 1994 and immediately sold the lot. Deeciding what to do was quite easy. It seemed to me that the best investment was Investment Trusts all based on income producing shares so that any poor performers would be sold off to maintain the income stream. They all produced about 4% income each year which was preferable to messing about with buy to let. i still have all of them today The income from then was 2097 per annum and is now 8599 pounds and they cost 988000 and are worth 235000 today after giving me an income of 151753 all withdrawn.
When 4th way began I was contacted by Neil who asked me if I would join his panel, I think someone suggested me because I wrote a guest article for Claus Lehman of P2P-Banking at his request. I was extremely flattered as I had only done P2P for 18 months then but wrote a lot on the Bondora forum and agreed. I seem to be only one of 2 still but still keep an eye on it. I am now 80 years old and still watch it but the photo is rubbish.
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