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Post by martin44 on Nov 15, 2018 2:18:12 GMT
Just been attempting to calculate my COLL returns from my Bank Statements for the ole Tax Return, but of course it’s a mixture of Capital Returned and Interest, with no way to differentiate. What surprised me was I had forgotten how large the amounts were winging into my account every month, I’d been assiduously exiting COLL for several months and still beat myself up for not being quicker off the mark and getting caught. Guess we’ve all learned the hard way just how illiquid p2P is. And I hope The Spice Brothers get everything they deserve, while they rot in hell.Completely agree with your last point. I was even further behind you in heading for the door. I didn't like many of the development loans and could sense that the platform was in trouble raising funds but kept re-investing interest and pouring in more money whenever the previously scarce Bolton first charge came onto the SM. Told myself that when Bolton repaid I'd pull out the proceeds and just stick with bling and a few small private house bridging loans. Never got the chance. Unscrupulous collateral dealings were evident l ong before Bolton.
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Post by mrclondon on Nov 30, 2018 22:09:50 GMT
Apart from the (hopefully) few individuals that put the majority of their p2p pot into COL, I don't think this is an issue that most need to stress over, providing you can explain and justify what you've done. I don't think there are right or wrong ways of approaching this.
For most I suspect the "interest" received from COL is noise amongst the loss relief claims from other platforms. In my case the COL "interest" is equivalent to half my normal per loan investment and I have over ten new loans that qualify for loss relief elsewhere. Whilst I know the HMRC computers are super clever and are never to be underestimated, the complete inconsistency with which p2p platforms are reporting tax figures to us (and hence to HMRC) will make unravelling them pretty difficult, and I suspect known p2p lenders will be given a wider degree of latitude before an investigation is launched than those with just bank interest.
As just one example the TC tax statement contains and totalises all the loans they believe are eligible for loss relief - not just those that became elligible in 2017-18. I very nearly double claimed for the loans that went bad in 2016-17.
In the end I've included the COL "interest" calculated as the difference from the BDO statement vs net investment into the account (which was opened in 2017-18) simply because I have a huge excess of loans elligible for loss relief loans for the year so won't pay tax on it anyway.
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Dec 13, 2018 10:42:19 GMT
Significant comment on Frank from a CC member. BDO unable to provide tax statement to either lenders or HMRC. Data not available & too costly to extract it.
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archie
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Post by archie on Dec 13, 2018 10:47:51 GMT
Significant comment on Frank from a CC member. BDO unable to provide tax statement to either lenders or HMRC. Data not available & too costly to extract it. Does that mean we don't need to declare any tax?
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Post by mrclondon on Dec 13, 2018 12:18:56 GMT
Significant comment on Frank from a CC member. BDO unable to provide tax statement to either lenders or HMRC. Data not available & too costly to extract it. Does that mean we don't need to declare any tax? Anyone that included 2016-17 interest from COL in their 2016-17 tax return, really needs to consider the implications should they be selected for a full tax investigation at some point in the next 7 (?) years if they haven't noted on their 2017-18 tax return how they are handling the "interest" received from COL during 2017-18.
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archie
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Post by archie on Dec 13, 2018 13:48:46 GMT
Does that mean we don't need to declare any tax? Anyone that included 2016-17 interest from COL in their 2016-17 tax return, really needs to consider the implications should they be selected for a full tax investigation at some point in the next 7 (?) years if they haven't noted on their 2017-18 tax return how they are handling the "interest" received from COL during 2017-18. I've no idea how much interest I received, nor have BDO, nor have HMRC. It should have been fairly easy to generate a transaction list for each lender but it seems BDO aren't going to.
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Dec 13, 2018 13:53:50 GMT
Does that mean we don't need to declare any tax? Anyone that included 2016-17 interest from COL in their 2016-17 tax return, really needs to consider the implications should they be selected for a full tax investigation at some point in the next 7 (?) years if they haven't noted on their 2017-18 tax return how they are handling the "interest" received from COL during 2017-18. You have no access to your records, confirmed by the administrator The only confirmation will be the capital lost, confirmed by the statement provided of balance at administration and the amount received back I realise that cant be set off against other interest, but there must be some way to offset purely for a company in administration?
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Post by mrclondon on Dec 13, 2018 14:10:17 GMT
Just to clarify my earlier post - what I was implying was that those individuals that will have been notified to HMRC by COL in respect of interest for 2016-17 should really be saying something on their 2017-18 tax return in relation to COL interest for 2017-18. That something might be "I haven't a clue how much interest I received from COL in 2017-18, the administators haven't provided me with a tax statement, and I'm unable to generate a meaningful estimate. If further information comes to light, I will adjust this return at a future date."
Saying nothing is risking HMRC action beyond a simple claim for late paid tax (with added interest) should they discover what they believe was an attempt to hide income.
None of this should be construed as advice, just the musings of someone who is the aquaintance of someone who has endured a HMRC investigation into their affairs.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2018 15:45:31 GMT
I just noted that COL were in administration so no figures available.
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blink
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Post by blink on Dec 13, 2018 16:10:33 GMT
I just noted that COL were in administration so no figures available. Same, I completed my return in may to offset Moneything defaults and said I would update when informed by administrators
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capucino
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Post by capucino on Dec 13, 2018 16:13:31 GMT
I myself just asked my accountant to add a note saying Collateral was pushed in administration by the FCA, interest was earned but unknown how much, no loss is being claimed on this return regarding collateral. Total amount invested xxxxx£.
she will probably word it slightly differently, planning to submit it just before Christmas.
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Post by charliebrown on Dec 17, 2018 13:49:18 GMT
Any interest I earned was always reinvested.
i’m declaring COL funds as a total wipeout capital loss as I’ve seen no evidence that this will not be the final outcome. People who keep saying we might expect a decent or full return are either joking or dreaming.
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Dec 17, 2018 13:53:45 GMT
Any interest I earned was always reinvested. i’m declaring COL funds as a total wipeout capital loss as I’ve seen no evidence that this will not be the final outcome. People who keep saying we might expect a decent or full return are either joking or dreaming. If you're offsetting your declared "capital loss" against other capital gains you've made in the year, I think you'll be on very shaky ground justifying that to HMRC. The COL Administrators have given no indication whatsoever that a total capital loss is a reasonable assumption.
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ilmoro
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Post by ilmoro on Dec 17, 2018 13:55:15 GMT
Any interest I earned was always reinvested. i’m declaring COL funds as a total wipeout capital loss as I’ve seen no evidence that this will not be the final outcome. People who keep saying we might expect a decent or full return are either joking or dreaming. Presumably against CGT as you cant claim loss relief against income tax as it doesnt qualify under SAIM12000 - not authorised platform, not treatable irrecoverable as borrowers not in legal recovery, hasnt become irrecoverable as platform hasnt declared it as such.
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Post by p2psavvy on Dec 18, 2018 15:18:04 GMT
Just spent 30 mins on call with an HMRC inspector and this was the advice given: If you can make an estimate of interest received then declare this. If you don't or can't, as and when the information is available and you do declare it, interest will be charged as late payment. It does not matter whether you know what you owe or not, interest is always charged. I was unable to get a clear answer on any potential losses. This will be very much down to how BDO word any disbursement to lenders. The best I could get is that P2P losses can be declared for up to four years and are deemed as the amount of the original loan less any interest and repayments received less the capital repaid. I am confused about the interest received as this will, most likely, already have been declared. Based on my own records, I am able to estimate the interest received so will, begrudgingly, declare that for 2017-18. I will add a note to this effect in the additional information section of the return. Monetus , it could be massively beneficial if and when BDO get to issue disbursements that the documentation issued states repayment/partial repayment of specific loans. It would seem that any chance of claiming losses would be unlikely to succeed if the distribution is generalised. One glimmer of hope is that there appears to be a grey area regarding Capital Gains. If a loss does not fit under the P2P category, it may be possible to use Capital Gains instead. I was directed to this page on the HMRC site by the inspector; www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/savings-and-investment-manual/saim12210I was also advised to write a letter to HMRC providing the full details of the Collateral company. The amount invested. The administration process as known at this time. And that I will update them as soon as I have more information available. This must be a written letter sent by post as it is logged against your file. It cannot be just notes on the return. Very antiquated! I am not giving any tax advice here, I am only passing on the gist of what an inspector said to me.
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