Godanubis
Member of DD Central
Anubis is known as the god of death and is the oldest and most popular of ancient Egyptian deities.
Posts: 2,011
Likes: 1,013
|
Post by Godanubis on Jan 1, 2019 0:37:25 GMT
Stock market down 5% year on year this year is only the beginning. The stock market woes have little to do with brexit. It's a global issue caused mainly by the fat boy on the other side of the pond. Actually my USA funds are doing ok. Brexit should happen I was around when we first went into the “common market” not the current mess. Nothing wrong with change. The way things were going with lots of members nearly bankrupted. Deal or no deal there are always ways to make things better on an individual basis. There will be nothing settled for years to come as we will not have a majority parliament in the foreseeable future. Happy New Year
|
|
IFISAcava
Member of DD Central
Posts: 3,683
Likes: 3,008
|
Post by IFISAcava on Jan 1, 2019 13:01:32 GMT
Assuming you're addressing neal , then I don't really see how his point is disputable. However fervent you are about the benefits of Brexit, are you really claiming that you knew even the basics of the deal that we're going to eventually end up with, back in 2016? In fact, do you claim to do so even now? In one of your recent posts, you lamented "we scored an own goal on the day after the referendum vote by dancing to EU's tune with Article 50", so clearly it hasn't gone exactly as you've hoped. Given that you've said that, you presumably advocate a No Deal as the way forward, which is currently only one of many possible outcomes, unless you know something the rest of us don't? It depends how you view politics, for me a political statement is never the truth or a lie. It's what you believe it to be so every point is disputable. As you have highlighted i did vote to leave, and for time i was willing to let the politicians beat out a deal that i could well have found agreeable. However within a few months i was reminded of how unbelievably incompetent politicians are. I think the only logical way out is a no deal. To use the Divorce analogy the UK and the EU have agreed to a divorce but now the UK is saying can we stay in the house for maybe 2 to 5 years. EU says sure but you have to carry on paying you share of the mortgage, oh and you can't use the gas, electric, the internet the TV and you will confined to one room and you will carry on paying child maintenance but you can't see the children (other EU countries) while your in the house. In a real divorce one party would have found alternative accommodation as priority then you start to negotiate the wind-down of the family home and the future relationship with the children. TM has 'negotiated' a very weak position and i stand by what i alluded to in a previous post that we need to leave full stop before any negotiation. No, this country belongs to those who voted remain and to pragmatic leavers too, who together form the clear majority of the population and of parliament; the extreme position of a no deal exit and the utter turmoil that would unleash is simply not going to happen.
|
|
|
Post by Proptechfish on Jan 1, 2019 17:38:47 GMT
It depends how you view politics, for me a political statement is never the truth or a lie. It's what you believe it to be so every point is disputable. As you have highlighted i did vote to leave, and for time i was willing to let the politicians beat out a deal that i could well have found agreeable. However within a few months i was reminded of how unbelievably incompetent politicians are. I think the only logical way out is a no deal. To use the Divorce analogy the UK and the EU have agreed to a divorce but now the UK is saying can we stay in the house for maybe 2 to 5 years. EU says sure but you have to carry on paying you share of the mortgage, oh and you can't use the gas, electric, the internet the TV and you will confined to one room and you will carry on paying child maintenance but you can't see the children (other EU countries) while your in the house. In a real divorce one party would have found alternative accommodation as priority then you start to negotiate the wind-down of the family home and the future relationship with the children. TM has 'negotiated' a very weak position and i stand by what i alluded to in a previous post that we need to leave full stop before any negotiation. No, this country belongs to those who voted remain and to pragmatic leavers too, who together form the clear majority of the population and of parliament; the extreme position of a no deal exit and the utter turmoil that would unleash is simply not going to happen. Would you like a hug you sound a little emotional. The country belongs to everybody. I agree with much of what the remain say and certainly don't agree with everything on the Brexit side, but i respect everybody's opinion that lead them to make a personal choice based on their own beliefs. I don't believe a no deal stance is as extreme as it sounds, because a much bigger force than the EU in Europe is the combined weight of European companies (in-particular exporters). So if it went to a no-deal i think it would be very short lived as the pressure from corporate Europe would be huge for the EU to sort out the situation with a key market. I believe the EU will be seen as the problem in that senorio not the UK. So, no in the long term i don't believe a no deal scenario is preferable to anybody. However it's very powerful as a negotiating tactic, and a card we (politicians) have not played well at all. For some years (long before 2016) I watched the EU jump from crisis to crisis with a single minded focus on the future power of EU with little regard to the effects on consistent countries. For example i thought the way the EU bullied Greece over the debt crisis was disgusting, attempting to exert its 'assumed' sovereignty over a country with legertermate sovereignty was unbelievable and i think emblematic of how dangerous the EU is becoming. The EU's free movement of people principle lead to the biggest influx of migrants into Europe since the end of the war. I believe the migration crisis fundamentally flawed the principle of free movement, yet the EU refuse to recognise it as a failure and aragontly carry on like it's all fine. Now as it happens i don't think the UK really has a migration 'crisis' there are migrants but it's no crisis as the tabloid gutter press love to portray. The brunt of the strain has been taken by Spain, Italy, Hungary and Greece, all of which now facing resurgent extreme right wing politics, which i see as a direct correlation to poor EU policy. I also believe the EU is very politically unstable. Of course us brits might be forgiven for thinking it's all about us, but i think the reality is there is a significant and growing European population of EU skeptics and given the chance they may well vote the same way (Italy comes to mind). So if the EU is heading for a political collapse which i think is a serious possibility i would rather be on sidelines than in it. Point being there is whole myriad of reasons why people voted either way. Petty tribadism achieves nothing, we as a country need to find a consensus to move forward.
|
|
IFISAcava
Member of DD Central
Posts: 3,683
Likes: 3,008
|
Post by IFISAcava on Jan 1, 2019 17:44:37 GMT
No, this country belongs to those who voted remain and to pragmatic leavers too, who together form the clear majority of the population and of parliament; the extreme position of a no deal exit and the utter turmoil that would unleash is simply not going to happen. Would you like a hug you sound a little emotional. I feel very calm; you must be projecting
|
|
travolta
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,485
Likes: 1,196
|
Post by travolta on Jan 1, 2019 18:30:38 GMT
Would you like a hug you sound a little emotional. I feel very calm; you must be projecting Just to rock your boat: My 20 acres of England belong to me and I voted to leave. As did a narrow but definite majority. If you scratch the population of Western Europe you will find the same result. I have great friends in most of these countries. We want sovereignty ,not an unrepresentative corrupt office in Brussels. Don't be scared of change....old man.
|
|
|
Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Jan 1, 2019 18:32:34 GMT
Would you like a hug you sound a little emotional. I feel very calm; you must be projecting I think it's just the way they walk. Actually as a professional (two night school classes) I would suggest you are 'reverse mirroring' each other, nothing serious.
|
|
|
Post by Proptechfish on Jan 1, 2019 18:46:07 GMT
I feel very calm; you must be projecting I think it's just the way they walk. Actually as a professional (two night school classes) I would suggest you are 'reverse mirroring' each other, nothing serious. Is that not just a mirror ?
|
|
travolta
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,485
Likes: 1,196
|
Post by travolta on Jan 1, 2019 18:52:25 GMT
All the Poles I know are really keen on the EU. I've just returned from Gdansk which boasts a premium EU funded Solidarity Centre for a few favoured switched on apparatchiks while the rest of the land is in a shite state. Rather like the EU projects in the UK which are all wind and piss, while workers languish with no incentive. Eastern Europe hopes the EU come through with funding and save them from Putin, but its a thin hope, as history and geog. indicate.
|
|
Godanubis
Member of DD Central
Anubis is known as the god of death and is the oldest and most popular of ancient Egyptian deities.
Posts: 2,011
Likes: 1,013
|
Post by Godanubis on Jan 2, 2019 2:47:15 GMT
For anyone merely offering a hug and saying that someone is emotional is in this politically crazy (I mean correct) environment cause for being accused of improper attention and If hug given improper touching and result in reprimand or visit from HR.
Good samaratins and empathic or old fashioned polite individuals have no place in the modern “hands off snowflake society “ Where hold a door open either results in a tirade of abuse saying “ I can open my own door” or just a brush past without thanks.
Interaction between individuals requires a multi page Sheldon like agreement on what is and is not acceptable.
A sexual encounter must now need a witnessed acceptance contract.
Brexit is the least of modern British society’s problems. God help us ! (Other deities are available)
|
|
carolus
Member of DD Central
Posts: 204
Likes: 191
|
Post by carolus on Jan 2, 2019 9:39:38 GMT
All the Poles I know are really keen on the EU. I've just returned from Gdansk which boasts a premium EU funded Solidarity Centre for a few favoured switched on apparatchiks while the rest of the land is in a shite state. Rather like the EU projects in the UK which are all wind and piss, while workers languish with no incentive. Eastern Europe hopes the EU come through with funding and save them from Putin, but its a thin hope, as history and geog. indicate. Yes, it is truly shocking that the EU has... checks notes... helped fund a museum and library dedicated to the history of one of the most important organisations in Poland's recent history, the formation and actions of which led ultimately to the fall of the communist regime in the country.
|
|
registerme
Member of DD Central
Posts: 6,533
Likes: 6,329
|
Post by registerme on Jan 2, 2019 10:19:49 GMT
All the Poles I know are really keen on the EU. I've just returned from Gdansk which boasts a premium EU funded Solidarity Centre for a few favoured switched on apparatchiks while the rest of the land is in a shite state. Rather like the EU projects in the UK which are all wind and piss, while workers languish with no incentive. Eastern Europe hopes the EU come through with funding and save them from Putin, but its a thin hope, as history and geog. indicate. Yes, it is truly shocking that the EU has... checks notes... helped fund a museum and library dedicated to the history of one of the most important organisations in Poland's recent history, the formation and actions of which led ultimately to the fall of the communist regime in the country. I spent a lot of time in Wroclaw, Poland, setting up an office where we hired technical talent graduating out of their excellent local universities. We got better graduates for a fifth of the price of those we could have hired in the UK. Wroclaw itself was a dynamic and fun city, I used to really enjoy going there. I enjoyed it so much I applied for a job there (didn't get it though).
|
|
r00lish67
Member of DD Central
Posts: 2,692
Likes: 4,048
|
Post by r00lish67 on Jan 2, 2019 10:35:11 GMT
Yes, it is truly shocking that the EU has... checks notes... helped fund a museum and library dedicated to the history of one of the most important organisations in Poland's recent history, the formation and actions of which led ultimately to the fall of the communist regime in the country. I spent a lot of time in Wroclaw, Poland, setting up an office where we hired technical talent graduating out of their excellent local universities. We got better graduates for a fifth of the price of those we could have hired in the UK. Wroclaw itself was a dynamic and fun city, I used to really enjoy going there. I enjoyed it so much I applied for a job there (didn't get it though). I first visited my girlfriend (now wife) in Poland in 2005. When I first visited, there were still a surprising number of Trabant (or Trabant style) cars and a slightly grim atmosphere, even in Warsaw. Now, it's all gleaming 5* hotels and modern cars. Grim looking communist cafeterias replaced by Sushi bars. The economic progress in just about every area has been astonishing, much of it thanks to being part of the EU. Totally agree about Wroclaw, lovely city. Also Poznan, Gdansk, Torun, Krakow, Rzeszow, Zakopane - all beautiful places to visit.
|
|
travolta
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,485
Likes: 1,196
|
Post by travolta on Jan 2, 2019 20:36:26 GMT
I spent a lot of time in Wroclaw, Poland, setting up an office where we hired technical talent graduating out of their excellent local universities. We got better graduates for a fifth of the price of those we could have hired in the UK. Wroclaw itself was a dynamic and fun city, I used to really enjoy going there. I enjoyed it so much I applied for a job there (didn't get it though). I first visited my girlfriend (now wife) in Poland in 2005. When I first visited, there were still a surprising number of Trabant (or Trabant style) cars and a slightly grim atmosphere, even in Warsaw. Now, it's all gleaming 5* hotels and modern cars. Grim looking communist cafeterias replaced by Sushi bars. The economic progress in just about every area has been astonishing, much of it thanks to being part of the EU. Totally agree about Wroclaw, lovely city. Also Poznan, Gdansk, Torun, Krakow, Rzeszow, Zakopane - all beautiful places to visit. My point exactly. The EU funding is great for those who are able to employ it and leaves the rest of the land completely in limbo. Great for the families whose fingers are already in the fat pie. My taxi driver was a graduate mechanical engineer, but the only job that paid him money was driving around the great and the tourist. Sound similar to the UK ? You are dead right! Try visit to Preston or Redcar and then walk through the suburbs of Gdansk. You need to get out and about a bit . Skip the dialogue and hang out in a take away in Craven Arms . We don't want an art installation by someone's daughter. Its rigorous training for unskilled youth that's required followed by realistic employment with a recognisable end product . Sushi sucks and will give you IBS . PS The Solidarity Building is populated by the usually suspects and their coterie. Polish version of champagne socialists of the Tate Gallery Resturants, dont be fooled that it represents anyone else
|
|
travolta
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,485
Likes: 1,196
|
Post by travolta on Jan 2, 2019 20:47:19 GMT
Yes, it is truly shocking that the EU has... checks notes... helped fund a museum and library dedicated to the history of one of the most important organisations in Poland's recent history, the formation and actions of which led ultimately to the fall of the communist regime in the country. I spent a lot of time in Wroclaw, Poland, setting up an office where we hired technical talent graduating out of their excellent local universities. We got better graduates for a fifth of the price of those we could have hired in the UK. Wroclaw itself was a dynamic and fun city, I used to really enjoy going there. I enjoyed it so much I applied for a job there (didn't get it though). Great , you could get them cheaply! That's despicable.
|
|
Godanubis
Member of DD Central
Anubis is known as the god of death and is the oldest and most popular of ancient Egyptian deities.
Posts: 2,011
Likes: 1,013
|
Post by Godanubis on Jan 2, 2019 22:27:24 GMT
Gone very quiet on the Brexit front . Not a cheep out of JC Junior. Perhaps he is making a post Christmas Humble Pie which will choke old TM after the meaningful vote..
|
|