snowmobile
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Post by snowmobile on Jul 15, 2019 11:54:41 GMT
Would be nice to see a cost-free exit option. There is already such a thing - selling on the SM Who is going to buy though under the new terms? It's hardly cost free if significant discounts have to be offered. My remaining investments are already listed at a small loss and have not sold under the old terms. Why should I be forced to sell at a significant loss in order to avoid the new fees. I don't believe they can force these changes on existing investors who do not accept the new terms
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Jul 15, 2019 11:57:27 GMT
The email says that investors are "deemed" to have accepted the new T&Cs if they use the platform on or after 5th August. Does anyone know what the legal perspective is for those of us who reject the changes? I'd be happy if they froze my account and allowed me access solely to sell existing holdings. I guess you are still using the platform even if you don’t login.
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Post by scepticalinvestor on Jul 15, 2019 12:02:39 GMT
The same. I've sent them a message asking what my options are if I do not accept the new T&Cs. I'm assuming they won't just say "don't login to your account from 5 August"! I hope they have to go investors like us some option to sell our investments past August 5. I rather suspect the answer will be to sell on the SM The 18 days from 18 July to 4 August are going to see a proper fire sale on the SM!
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bigfoot12
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Post by bigfoot12 on Jul 15, 2019 12:06:46 GMT
I rather suspect the answer will be to sell on the SM The 18 days from 18 July to 4 August are going to see a proper fire sale on the SM! A good chance to earn the 6% rebate for placing bids!
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daveb4
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Post by daveb4 on Jul 15, 2019 12:16:09 GMT
Not happy, another fee increase, properties decreasing in value, dividend reductions.
I do get it but not what I originally signed up for and due to get hit on a number of properties in London.
Happy to go the term with exiting portfolio as tax wise suits me, but no more as risk/reward depleting.
Have asked today for funds awaiting to be invested in properties to be returned as I did not invest them based on these new rules. Will be interested in response.
Will keep an eye for any bargains though!
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Jul 15, 2019 12:34:36 GMT
There is already such a thing - selling on the SM Who is going to buy though under the new terms? It's hardly cost free if significant discounts have to be offered. My remaining investments are already listed at a small loss and have not sold under the old terms. Why should I be forced to sell at a significant loss in order to avoid the new fees. I don't believe they can force these changes on existing investors who do not accept the new terms good luck!
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snowmobile
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Post by snowmobile on Jul 15, 2019 12:53:43 GMT
Who is going to buy though under the new terms? It's hardly cost free if significant discounts have to be offered. My remaining investments are already listed at a small loss and have not sold under the old terms. Why should I be forced to sell at a significant loss in order to avoid the new fees. I don't believe they can force these changes on existing investors who do not accept the new terms good luck! The SM is supposed to be a convenient way to exit before the original end date. Selling at a loss is accepted in exchange for the convenience of having early access to funds if needed. The SM should not be the only way that investors can avoid new terms being imposed. The investment length was 5 years (less if purchased on the SM) and I agreed to invest for that time under the old terms. I did not agree to have to sell at a loss after two years. The only way full property value can be achieved is by (hopefully) holding for the 5 years and then opting to sell.
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Post by scepticalinvestor on Jul 15, 2019 12:59:36 GMT
The SM is supposed to be a convenient way to exit before the original end date. Selling at a loss is accepted in exchange for the convenience of having early access to funds if needed. The SM should not be the only way that investors can avoid new terms being imposed. The investment length was 5 years (less if purchased on the SM) and I agreed to invest for that time under the old terms. I did not agree to have to sell at a loss after two years. The only way full property value can be achieved is by (hopefully) holding for the 5 years and then opting to sell. I'm drafting a complaint to PP (with the intention of taking it to the FOS following their response, if unsatisfactory), please do so as well. I've looked up a few FOS upheld complaints against investment providers re: changes in fees and in all of them the expectation appears to be that investors who don't accept the new T&Cs are given a chance to exit cost free. I don't know how exactly it will be when applied to the PP scenario (given that there will be access to the SM for a few weeks before the new T&Cs) and the specific T&Cs we've signed up to, but I guess there's nothing to lose by making a complaint and then taking it to the FOS in the event of an unsatisfactory response. While I do agree that changes in their charging structure is a commercial decision, they should not be allowed to get away with effectively bouncing dissenting customers into accepting the new structure under pain of forced losses. If enough of us complain about it, they *might* consider being more reasonable with respect to giving us a way to exit the platform without being forced to sell within a short period. From the FOS website "Under the current arrangements, businesses that have 25 cases or fewer referred to us in a year don't pay any case fees. For the 26th complaint and each one after that, we charge a fee of £550 when the complaints is resolved."
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Post by george on Jul 15, 2019 13:22:03 GMT
From the email notifying of the change: This would seem to help. You'll have ~6 months to shift them rather than 2 weeks.
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Post by scepticalinvestor on Jul 15, 2019 13:48:56 GMT
From the email notifying of the change: This would seem to help. You'll have ~6 months to shift them rather than 2 weeks.
Thanks George, I completely missed that! That definitely makes it a more reasonable time frame to exit the platform. I'll still be pushing for a waiving of the monthly fee as well for that period.
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snowmobile
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Post by snowmobile on Jul 15, 2019 14:18:40 GMT
From the email notifying of the change: This would seem to help. You'll have ~6 months to shift them rather than 2 weeks.
Yes I had spotted that but I can't see it making much difference. Any buyers will expect bigger discounts than currently available in order to offset the increased fees.
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travolta
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Post by travolta on Jul 15, 2019 15:10:44 GMT
So-o: They want the little guys (I have £12,000 invested approx.) to flood the SM with their fragments that some big fish can snap up cheaply. What's to do? I hate them all(again).
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Post by easterbunni on Jul 15, 2019 15:59:07 GMT
Bloody ridiculous. So short sighted. Their fees will eat up 30% of my net yield. Just need to wait for the 5 year mark now and sell. 39% off what I get a month now (not including suspensions, dividend decreases and the money I have put in on pending properties) (OR VAT) (OR the AUM). I was slowly building up my portfolio, this will just stop that.
Sod you PP.
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travolta
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Post by travolta on Jul 15, 2019 16:05:20 GMT
SM frozen till Thursday
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Jul 15, 2019 16:08:48 GMT
I’ve just sent the following in reply. Will report back on their response.
“I write formally to notify Property Partner that I DO NOT ACCEPT these new Terms and Conditions, given that they are proposed to be applied retroactively to investments I made in good faith under the T&Cs applicable at the time. I most certainly will not be investing any further funds via Property Partner and will be withdrawing all cash as and when it becomes available.
Please can you clarify exactly what you mean by “You will be deemed to have accepted these new terms by continuing to use our platform on and after 5 August 2019”. Specifically:
A) how will I be able to withdraw payments of interest and capital each month without being deemed to have accepted these new terms?
B) if my holdings are offered for sale on the Secondary Market prior to 5th August, will they be removed from sale on that date or will they remain there?”
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