bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Oct 30, 2014 21:00:42 GMT
Due to go live tomorrow 12% max LTV 50% - sounds okay but I think I'll give this one a miss. I wish fundingsecure would develop their platform to allow a SM facility at least with these larger loans. Even if they had to operate it initially manually it shouldn't be too much effort at this stage surely. |
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Post by Duane Dibley on Oct 31, 2014 9:09:57 GMT
I think I'll be giving it a miss too. It's not like we're short of property loans to invest in, so I'll wait and see how they manage when a property loan defaults.
Assetz are still plodding along with their defaulted loans, one from Saving Stream has just over-run but at least with them you can bail out via the secondary market before it's due, but how Funding Secure will act we don't know.
It's one thing auctioning off a couple of old watches and a bag of diamonds if a loan defaults, not so easy with a house or a plot of land.
Play it cool on this one. Play it cool.
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Post by davee39 on Oct 31, 2014 9:38:39 GMT
Oh dear, from watches and rings to houses, another P2P gets infected.
With property the only game in town I am pulling back to Zopa, RS and FC (Non property).
Sometime the music will stop, it always does.
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Post by brettb on Oct 31, 2014 9:52:21 GMT
Another watch has just gone on there if you're quick. Property loans are OK if the property can be sold... but that all takes time of course. I'm more worried about the potential of fraud. In 2007 I got evicted from a rental property as the landlord obtained the mortgage fraudulently and ran off with my rent. He never made a single mortgage repayment  . These bridging loans worry me. |
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jjc
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Post by jjc on Oct 31, 2014 13:47:19 GMT
Amazing. A couple of hours in & already nearly half the loan gone.
Despite no sight of a VR, or even the basis for the 300k. GDV? wooah, that can shift the LTV...
Btw who "valued" it anyway?
Other wee things that spring to mind, who decides & on what basis when the next tranche is paid out? Are there steps in the development build-out that need to met to trigger this? Have/Will FS appoint a Monitoring Surveyor to check on this? If so who is he / what track record does he have?
Seems the developer is experienced, good. But seems we also have to take FS' word on this (less good). I'd prefer things to be more transparent (it's good also for the developer I think, gets his name noted for future deals & a bit of free advertising never did anyone any harm). Also even experienced developers can run into trouble on individual deals. How much cash has he got now, is he using other borrowed funds too & how much does he need to complete the development? Will the FS funding cover this comfortably, or is there a risk there could be a further shortfall & if so can this be dealt with eg downspeccing finishings a touch without impacting GDV or could we's be in a spot of bother? Any possibility of other developments he's working on (coz they're running over-budget etc) impacting this one?
At what stage exactly is the development of the 4 houses & when is completion expected? What likelihood if the loan rolling over? Any terms on the PP we as lenders should be aware of? Who's a gonna sell em?
Where (town, county, or if it's a state secret even region?) is the property located. Heck some lenders might just want a whiff of an idea to get a feel for property price risk on LTV.
So many questions, so little info oh deary me.
(Ofcourse I'm not expecting answers on every single one of them, this level of detail is not always provided for property loans issued by experienced specialists on other platforms. That said, there's usually enough beef to enable you to read between the lines on them, & get a feel for the various elements of risk if not put an actual number against each one. That is sadly lacking here.)
I like FS & this I hope is a helpful nudge. It may well be they're testing lenders' response, the type of funding they can raise, at what speed & on what types of deals - all perfectly legitimate. What I don't like - as a lender - is shooting in the dark.
So call me a dummy (I probably am) but my view is P2P is still a boutique biz in the larger scheme of things & for the mo I'll go to the butchers for my meat, the mongers for my fish & the fruit & veg stall for my greens. Even when there's a nice looking bit of salmon hidden amongst his lemons.
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Post by mrclondon on Oct 31, 2014 16:10:52 GMT
A lot of good points in the post from jjcAfter 24 hours deliberating about this one, I've concluded that without knowing the basis of the valuation ("as is" vs GDV vs ?), where in the country it is, or the status of the marketing effort, this one really is a step too far for me. fundingsecure, the speed with which recent large funding requests have filled should have given you the confidence to delay the listing until the valuation report was available. For the sake of the reputation of FS, I think you need to take a step back and think through the implications of some of the concerns raised in this thread and the thread for the earlier property loan. |
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Post by mrclondon on Nov 13, 2014 20:22:49 GMT
For the benefit of those that were brave enough to bid on this one, the valuation report is now attached to the loan listing.
Not the best example of its type.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Nov 13, 2014 22:00:53 GMT
jjc: The valuation report may give some clues as to the answers to some of your questions. For instance, the valuer is identified and is based in N. Yorks., so the property is probably somewhere around there. Of course, this new info is rather late because the loan is fully funded now. This is where not having a secondary market really makes a difference. If there was one, then anyone who bid before and now is feeling uncomfortable could exit. And someone who didn't bid before and now is feeling more inclined to participate would have a chance of getting in. Perhaps fundingsecure secure could help their lenders feel more comfortable by offering them a chance to cancel their bids once the valuation is released. That would allow some lenders to exit and give new lenders a chance to take part in this loan.
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Nov 13, 2014 22:58:16 GMT
Of course, this new info is rather late because the loan is fully funded now. This is where not having a secondary market really makes a difference. If there was one, then anyone who bid before and now is feeling uncomfortable could exit. And someone who didn't bid before and now is feeling more inclined to participate would have a chance of getting in. Perhaps fundingsecure secure could help their lenders feel more comfortable by offering them a chance to cancel their bids once the valuation is released. That would allow some lenders to exit and give new lenders a chance to take part in this loan. It's not going to happen mikes1531. In reality the platform needs a bit of an overhaul hence the need to simply announce a new loan coming tomorrow without any time. Too many bidders at once and the platform cannot handle it. It would help if there was a facility to pre-bid but that's also firmly on the back burner (if at all). ATM if I'm around then I'll bid the odd £50 or £100 but if not then..... I was hoping that the platform would have 'matured' by now but I think what we see is what we've got. So apart from the odd high value loan it is what it is and I expect my involvement will gradually wind down as I haven't got the time or the inclination to sit in front of a PC screen. Probably FS feel they have enough registered lenders now that there is not a requirement in their eyes to develop further.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Nov 17, 2014 4:31:26 GMT
Probably FS feel they have enough registered lenders now that there is not a requirement in their eyes to develop further. If all FS were doing was the sort of 'pawnbroker' loans they started out with, then I'd agree with you. But they've started branching out into higher-value loans, and that requires a larger and more confident lender supply. I suspect that they may be being lulled into complacency by the speed with which even their large loans are being funded. But I suspect this first wave of funding will not continue much longer. Lenders will put only so much into a platform with problems, and then they will tighten up the purse strings, sit back, and wait to see how things develop. At that point FS will find loans not funding so quickly, and they'll wish they had more lenders on board. There are supposed to be further tranches coming of their two 'live' loans and it will be interesting to see how quickly -- or not -- they are funded. Watch this space.
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sqh
Member of DD Central
Before P2P, savers put a guinea in a piggy bank, now they smash the banks to become guinea pigs.
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Post by sqh on Jan 23, 2015 16:23:33 GMT
It's interesting to read the cautionary tales in this thread. A new 2nd charge on the same property for £50k released today, sold out in less than 10 minutes. More tranches to come so don't feel left out if you missed it.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2015 16:33:47 GMT
Still struggling with the idea of a luxury yacht at £22k with its rubbing wood taken off. Not so sure about property, I'll dable but I don't want much in a pawn-broker  |
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. These bridging loans worry me.
