littleoldlady
Member of DD Central
Running down all platforms due to age
Posts: 3,017
Likes: 1,835
|
Post by littleoldlady on Jan 27, 2021 20:50:05 GMT
States and indeed "countries" like the EU are going to fight tooth and nail for their citizens ahead of any other consideration. I wonder how the main stream press are treating this in countries like Germany, Italy and France. Do they blame the UK I wonder for their vaccine supply problems? That would suit the politicians there. Tooth and nail for a product which they have not even approved yet.
|
|
adrianc
Member of DD Central
Posts: 9,045
Likes: 4,841
|
Post by adrianc on Jan 27, 2021 21:08:35 GMT
Perhaps the best bet is for the entire world to say "OK, let's let the WHO handle global distribution and allocation"...
|
|
agent69
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,641
Likes: 4,213
|
Post by agent69 on Jan 27, 2021 21:17:27 GMT
I've been in a few situations where world supply is less than world demand. Normally, the rules are they who place the order get priority and those then that get a delivery date commitment get that first. But then finanicial force and politics get in the way. Sure going to be a bumpy ride as Boris said "lumpy". But this situation is surely not at all normal. States and indeed "countries" like the EU are going to fight tooth and nail for their citizens ahead of any other consideration. It is only one step below a war footing (generally NOT meaning eu vs uk !) and the extreme measures countries might take. I wonder how the main stream press are treating this in countries like Germany, Italy and France. Do they blame the UK I wonder for their vaccine supply problems? That would suit the politicians there. I think a lot of the current EU rhetoric is aimed at their domestic market to cover up the shortcomings of their procurement process, including:
- a 3 month delay in the EU finalising an order with AZ, while they haggled about commercial terms.
- failing to adequately fund the development and manufacture of the vaccine (compared to UK and USA)
- taking an inordinate amount of time to approve the AZ vaccine, apparently due to having to wait for all 27 member states to sign off on the deal.
Given that the amount of Pfizer vaccine coming from the EU into UK is small compared to the amount of AZ vaccine going the other way in the longer term, I can't see it is in the best interest of the EU to start a fight. One thing for certain, I bet that shipments of AZ vaccine don't get held up at EU customs points because somebody put AZ's address as UK instead of GB.
|
|
ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 10,906
Likes: 11,127
|
Post by ilmoro on Jan 27, 2021 21:26:14 GMT
Well the good news is the Pfizer Belgium plant is back at full capacity and the impact on supply appears to have been smaller than expected, only 8%
|
|
agent69
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,641
Likes: 4,213
|
Post by agent69 on Jan 27, 2021 21:29:13 GMT
Perhaps the best bet is for the entire world to say "OK, let's let the WHO handle global distribution and allocation"... I fundamentally disagree with the WHO allocation system.
Surely, you should prioritise countries which are hardest hit, rather than a system that wouldn't allow us to vaccinate more than 20% of the population until new Zealand had been given vaccine for 20% of their population.
|
|
|
Post by dan1 on Jan 27, 2021 22:40:08 GMT
European vaccine wars playing into the hands of the likes of Marine Le Pen? 52% - 48%, where have I seen that before Oh, and Le Pen leads Macron in the first round according to polling.
|
|
mrk
Posts: 807
Likes: 753
|
Post by mrk on Jan 27, 2021 22:50:18 GMT
I've been in a few situations where world supply is less than world demand. Normally, the rules are they who place the order get priority and those then that get a delivery date commitment get that first. But then finanicial force and politics get in the way. Sure going to be a bumpy ride as Boris said "lumpy". But this situation is surely not at all normal. States and indeed "countries" like the EU are going to fight tooth and nail for their citizens ahead of any other consideration. It is only one step below a war footing (generally NOT meaning eu vs uk !) and the extreme measures countries might take. I wonder how the main stream press are treating this in countries like Germany, Italy and France. Do they blame the UK I wonder for their vaccine supply problems? That would suit the politicians there. From what I've seen, they certainly don't blame the UK. At most they may "blame" AstraZeneca as a private company. And it's very much the same for Pfizer by the way: Italy asks EU to take action against Pfizer over COVID-19 vaccine delays; Sweden wants clarity on vaccine doses before paying Pfizer.
|
|
agent69
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,641
Likes: 4,213
|
Post by agent69 on Jan 28, 2021 9:09:33 GMT
But this situation is surely not at all normal. States and indeed "countries" like the EU are going to fight tooth and nail for their citizens ahead of any other consideration. It is only one step below a war footing (generally NOT meaning eu vs uk !) and the extreme measures countries might take. I wonder how the main stream press are treating this in countries like Germany, Italy and France. Do they blame the UK I wonder for their vaccine supply problems? That would suit the politicians there. From what I've seen, they certainly don't blame the UK. At most they may "blame" AstraZeneca as a private company. And it's very much the same for Pfizer by the way: Italy asks EU to take action against Pfizer over COVID-19 vaccine delays; Sweden wants clarity on vaccine doses before paying Pfizer. I was listening to the radio this morning and they mentioned Geeman newspaper coverage of the spat. It appears that their wroth is mainly aimed at the EU, rather than UK or even AZ.
You get the impression that some within the EU don't realise we have left, and still think they can tell us what to do.
|
|
|
Post by moonraker on Jan 28, 2021 10:11:48 GMT
Being over 70, I've been promised a jab by mid-February, not that I'm particularly desperate to get it. Just as well. A fortnight ago, my GP's surgery sent me a text with a link to click on to book an appointment at a surgery ten minutes' walk away, but no slots were available. Then I got a text cancelling the invitation. Today I had a letter from the NHS inviting me to book via a website. I entered my postcode - to find that the nearest site was 18 miles away, the next 21 miles away. I live in a town with a population of 170,000. The website assures me that more sites are becoming available all the time and to keep on trying.
I'm posting this by way of observation, not complaint.
|
|
registerme
Member of DD Central
Posts: 6,233
Likes: 6,038
|
Post by registerme on Jan 28, 2021 10:17:05 GMT
You get the impression that some within the EU don't realise we have left, and still think they can tell us what to do. I still don't know how this will play out, but that may be unfair. I'd be willing to accept that the EU is playing to the gallery to deflect from its poor rollout of vaccines to date but this, if correct about the contract stipulating that two production sites in the UK were to be considered "primary", would give substance to their ire.
|
|
ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 10,906
Likes: 11,127
|
Post by ilmoro on Jan 28, 2021 11:11:05 GMT
You get the impression that some within the EU don't realise we have left, and still think they can tell us what to do. I still don't know how this will play out, but that may be unfair. I'd be willing to accept that the EU is playing to the gallery to deflect from its poor rollout of vaccines to date but this, if correct about the contract stipulating that two production sites in the UK were to be considered "primary", would give substance to their ire. The problem the EC has got is that its biggest players, Germany, France, Italy were negotiating a contract with AZ early doors but the EC stepped in & took over negotiations on a collective basis resulting in a delay. The EC has therefore got nowhere to hide for its failings. It doesnt help that they turned down an extra 500m Pfizer doses becuase the French didnt want Sanofi being disadvantaged by Pfizer supplying a large percentage of the EU vaccine. The EMA was slow to licence Pfizer & Sanofi vaccine (300m) ordered then ran in to trouble, with the result that the EC was late placing a Pfizer top up order. Throw in the production issues and EU has a supply shortage largely of its own making. The EC role in CV19 response has been largely been peripheral with the nation states taking the lead. The current row is very much looks like a 'you had one job and you f***** it up' crisis As opposed to the UK govt which has many of these but seems have got this one right.
|
|
|
Post by bracknellboy on Jan 28, 2021 11:25:40 GMT
Being over 70, I've been promised a jab by mid-February, not that I'm particularly desperate to get it. Just as well. A fortnight ago, my GP's surgery sent me a text with a link to click on to book an appointment at a surgery ten minutes' walk away, but no slots were available. Then I got a text cancelling the invitation. Today I had a letter from the NHS inviting me to book via a website. I entered my postcode - to find that the nearest site was 18 miles away, the next 21 miles away. I live in a town with a population of 170,000. The website assures me that more sites are becoming available all the time and to keep on trying.
I'm posting this by way of observation, not complaint.
Feel lucky. I'm also in the group promised a jab by mid February. I've not yet received any invitation for an appointment. This also is not a complaint.
|
|
|
Post by bracknellboy on Jan 28, 2021 11:33:32 GMT
one other snippet I read. True or not, I read that the EU did in fact provide funds to Azn specifically to contribute to investment in the UK manufacturing site. If so, and if the contract specifically calls out the UK site as a 'primary' and the european ones as 'secondary', then I would say they do have some right to be partially miffed. But none of us know what was in the contract, and there will obviously be posturing going on.
|
|
registerme
Member of DD Central
Posts: 6,233
Likes: 6,038
|
Post by registerme on Jan 28, 2021 11:55:52 GMT
It doesnt help that they turned down an extra 500m Pfizer doses becuase the French didnt want Sanofi being disadvantaged by Pfizer supplying a large percentage of the EU vaccine. The EMA was slow to licence Pfizer & Sanofi vaccine (300m) ordered then ran in to trouble, with the result that the EC was late placing a Pfizer top up order. Throw in the production issues and EU has a supply shortage largely of its own making. The EC role in CV19 response has been largely been peripheral with the nation states taking the lead. The current row is very much looks like a 'you had one job and you f***** it up' crisis As opposed to the UK govt which has many of these but seems have got this one right. I don't disagree with any of that. However, if the contract signed does actually stipulate that the UK manufacturing facilities would be considered "primary" for the purposes of meeting the volumes requested you can understand why they'd be miffed if they subsequently found out that this wasn't going to be the case. They thought they'd hedged their bets to an extent and then had the rug pulled out from under them. Time will tell. I have no idea how authoritative that comment in the BBC article is... It doesn't excuse any of the other failings in the EU wrt to vaccinations etc.
|
|
|
Post by bernythedolt on Jan 28, 2021 12:06:14 GMT
But this situation is surely not at all normal. States and indeed "countries" like the EU are going to fight tooth and nail for their citizens ahead of any other consideration. It is only one step below a war footing (generally NOT meaning eu vs uk !) and the extreme measures countries might take. I wonder how the main stream press are treating this in countries like Germany, Italy and France. Do they blame the UK I wonder for their vaccine supply problems? That would suit the politicians there. From what I've seen, they certainly don't blame the UK. At most they may "blame" AstraZeneca as a private company. And it's very much the same for Pfizer by the way: Italy asks EU to take action against Pfizer over COVID-19 vaccine delays; Sweden wants clarity on vaccine doses before paying Pfizer. BBC reporting same: "Pfizer has not been able to supply the 12.5 million vaccines it promised the EU by the end of 2020, saying last week it was delaying shipments for the next few weeks because of work to increase capacity at its Belgian processing plant." - www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-55822602
|
|