dave4
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Cynical is a hobby not a lifestyle
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Post by dave4 on Mar 11, 2021 10:43:42 GMT
Is the isa wrapper enough of enticement to break the current AC ££ stalemate ?
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Post by Ace on Mar 11, 2021 11:13:30 GMT
Is the isa wrapper enough of enticement to break the current AC ££ stalemate ? I doubt it, but the release of funds from RS might make a significant dent.
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jlend
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Post by jlend on Mar 11, 2021 11:25:00 GMT
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alender
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Post by alender on Mar 11, 2021 11:51:42 GMT
Is the isa wrapper enough of enticement to break the current AC ££ stalemate ? The AAs are currently in some sort of stalemate, while the SM exists no new money will enter the accounts and this will prevent any new lending of any significance and the accounts are in run down which in itself looks like it stopping some investors investing in these accounts.
Those desperate to leave have already got out so the discounts have reduced, however there are not enough people wanting to invest at these low discounts to eliminate the discounts altogether, clear the withdrawal queue and bring things back to normal.
This has now created a Catch 22 situation, no new money therefore no new investments, accounts in rundown, no new money (at least from some people) while no new investments and accounts in rundown.
The withdrawal queue is bloated due to those who do not wish to leave but want to maximise their returns by withdrawing and buying back on the SM which AC already does this for them with interest payments, so it is now impossible to know the extent of how much money is trying to get out. Recycling money at current discounts may be/or become self defeating as the discount to buy is so low you do not have to be waiting for long to lose the small % you make due to lack of interest while waiting in the queue. However from the recycling of funds it looks like quite a few people are still committed to this approach.
We can only hope that the new ISA season will break this stalemate but somehow I think it wont entirely. However it does beg the question if/when all of the discounted AAs have been sold and there is money entering the AAs at 0% discount how will AC allocate repayments, in the current SM system it will be FIOF but before the SM it was pro rata. At this point will AC remove the SM or will it be kept in place if/when required for the future and will they change to allocate pro rata for 0% discounts. If the SM goes will this add more money to the AAs as people know there is no chance of a discount which could easily increase in the future and they can play the market or will people feel their money could be trapped again and will be reluctant to add more funds or even want to remove funds as there may not be a way out in the future unless the SM is reinstated.
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iRobot
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Post by iRobot on Mar 12, 2021 19:21:44 GMT
As can be seen from the URL, the above 'article' was released on the 8th. Toward the bottom there's a comment / link: " For example, Assetz Capital has received a huge spike in transfer ins from these lenders" which takes the reader to an article titled: "Assetz eyes £100m in new IFISA money" from February. I was going to comment on the mismatch between AC being willing and able to absorb £100m of new funds and P2PFN reporting it as a huge spike, but couldn't be bothered. Today, four days later, P2PFN actually do release an 'article' titled " Assetz Capital reports spike in IFISA transfers from RateSetter investors" and, sure enough, AC quote some facts and figures supporting that headline. I don't know how P2PFN think they can justify charging a subscription fee when the their content is regurgitated tweets and advertorials....  (Hint: Incognito / InPrivate browsing is your friend when accessing P2PFN) As for the 'spike' article advertorial itself, I've no doubt AC have run it through compliance but there's too strong an emphasis on engendering 'FOMO' for my liking. And I note that in today's email to existing members, AC has retained the 'Access' part of the Quick / 30 Day / 90 Day Access Account product labels - almost certainly solely to annoy one or two here.  
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dead-money
Rocket to the Moon
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Post by dead-money on Mar 12, 2021 20:10:50 GMT
Not a single mention of liquidity or 'normal market conditions' in that marketing email either and just one 'capital is at risk' warning...  |
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dave4
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Cynical is a hobby not a lifestyle
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Post by dave4 on Mar 12, 2021 20:31:35 GMT
Out with the "old sheep" in with the new "Lambs to slaughter".
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Post by Harland Kearney on Mar 13, 2021 3:01:22 GMT
Got my 1% bonus, withdrawn the loan repayments & big payouts. I don't intend to hold any future investments in the AA's, I have concerns about the sustainbility of the loanbook over the future.
Not that I don't think AC will pull something off, but that the current interests rates don't warrant the risk for my fancy. I'll throw the money in more longer term funds on the market or even interest baring funds for a similar return with a far less risk for near enough same reward.
I also hold a certain level of personal contempt, its hard to put my finger on. Just has been one too many "oppsie" moments from AC that make me feel like my money is in a Seedrs (I guess it is right, all the risk, little reward unless your a shareholder, nothing stopping me!) project than a professional authorised FCA regulated firm (for what its worth, but think Fundsmith, Lindsell, Hargreaves)
I still hold Peer to Peer loans on one other platform (Loanpad), but thats all I want to swindle in this cow boy industry, for 5%.
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dead-money
Rocket to the Moon
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Post by dead-money on Mar 13, 2021 9:12:43 GMT
"missed opportunity to apologise" - Yep that's the main one. Arrogance and Gaslighting investors. Particularly around the timing of interest rate cuts and how that was communicated.
Oh and 'Bug Fixes' which fundamental change system functionality, without announcement or any change history. Treat investors like grown-ups who understand how these things work please!
Basically, lots of room to improve their investor communications, focus on that rather than P2PFinance News spin articles.
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alender
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Post by alender on Mar 13, 2021 9:53:57 GMT
I have some reservations on how well AC are running the loan book and great reservations on how they have treated investors (especially the larger ones) at least up to now but the increased repayments could well be a result of pressure from the FCA or they have finally figured out that putting access back (at least as much as can be reasonable achieved) into the access accounts is a way to gain investors confidence and therefore start to attract new money to these accounts. I believe the lenders in AC were not saved by AC but by government support without which we would all be nursing substantial loses, however AC will try to take credit for this. The real test will come when all government support is removed and then we will see if AC can stand on it's own feet in a less benevolent market than before covid. I hope to out completely by then.
It is interesting that there are people willing to buy at a 0.1% discount but not at par, you will lose this 0,1% quickly through lack of interest, would these same people buy in if AC raised the rates by 0.1% which they would make back in the first year and be better off thereafter. This is an effect of creating the SM which gives people the idea that you can make more money by waiting for a 0.1% discount, this makes no sense but is an understandable human reaction.
While you can get your money back with just a 0.1% loss which is more than coved by the extra interest and bonus received I feel I can not trust AC the next time things go wrong to not keep changing the rules. I have more confidence in Growth Street if it was to restart, although I would have preferred they found a better way which enabled them to survive (perhaps change of rules after lenders vote) but they stuck to the rules and that gives me confidence, from what I can see there are a number of other investors who feel the same. I lost some interest from GS in the run off but was far better off than with AC as I got my money quicker, reinvesting some in equities which have given a return of over 50% and got better interest rate and bonuses before the run off. Also they kept me better informed during the process. An asset management company who invests some of my funds in a mixture of ETFs other funds and equities have performed better than AC since the Covid with never any chance of blocking access. I am off back into equities which over the years have given me a better return that P2P and I seem to understand better or at least be luckier. I will not allow my money to be in danger of being locked in again, one thing I have learnt is that you can make a lot of money or at at the very minimum mitigate your losses but having full access to your funds during a crises. I am investing the P2P funds in a mixture of equities some of which are specialist REITs which pay good dividends. Only time will tell if this is better than staying with P2P but my the track record of over 40 years including the covid period is saying you are better out of P2P. However I wish everyone who sticks to P2P good returns.
PS
From the regular overnight repayments (just after 1am) looks like you will be able to exit at par, over 4.5% (for me) has been retuned in the last 3 days since the large payout. I wonder if is the new money coming in, if so AC is paying back pro rata at 0% discount not FIFO as would be expected under to SM rules.
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ashtondav
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Post by ashtondav on Mar 13, 2021 10:17:54 GMT
As can be seen from the URL, the above 'article' was released on the 8th. Toward the bottom there's a comment / link: " For example, Assetz Capital has received a huge spike in transfer ins from these lenders" which takes the reader to an article titled: "Assetz eyes £100m in new IFISA money" from February. I was going to comment on the mismatch between AC being willing and able to absorb £100m of new funds and P2PFN reporting it as a huge spike, but couldn't be bothered. Today, four days later, P2PFN actually do release an 'article' titled " Assetz Capital reports spike in IFISA transfers from RateSetter investors" and, sure enough, AC quote some facts and figures supporting that headline. I don't know how P2PFN think they can justify charging a subscription fee when the their content is regurgitated tweets and advertorials.... (Hint: Incognito / InPrivate browsing is your friend when accessing P2PFN) As for the 'spike' article advertorial itself, I've no doubt AC have run it through compliance but there's too strong an emphasis on engendering 'FOMO' for my liking. And I note that in today's email to existing members, AC has retained the 'Access' part of the Quick / 30 Day / 90 Day Access Account product labels - almost certainly solely to annoy one or two here. For Gawd’s sake. It’s £10 per £10,000 to get out INSTANTLY. If you want out, Get out!
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Post by Harland Kearney on Mar 13, 2021 12:39:40 GMT
Basically, everything you typed @deees The fundamental factor though is that the interest rate does not match the risk-reward, and it's impossible for AC to rectify this in the current environment by raising them of course. So I exit. However, the risk is being increased exponentially by platform risk. Let alone all the issues you listed and the still questionable future of the AA's. alender also hit the nail on the head, liquidity is extremely critical. There just isn't any reason not to just put your money into funds which are liquid, over betting the house (cause that's the losses when it goes wrong) on 4.1% P.A. I see funds as far lower risk the P2P, but still extremely risk alligned of course. I think some investors may confuse a restoring of liquidity, passing money from one investor to the other with a reduction of all risk, (Like the old QAA days). The horse is out of the stable on that one. I'm happy to pass this risk on. |
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Post by drphil on Mar 13, 2021 13:24:21 GMT
Not a single mention of liquidity or 'normal market conditions' in that marketing email either and just one 'capital is at risk' warning... This is proof that AC have completed ignored our pleas to be a little less misleading and show no signs of maybe being a little less arrogant in their overall attitude. Very disappointing.
in fact, (and this depends somewhat on the mail targets) this is worse because it actively promotes a product without describing it properly. Imagine the furore from the audience, regulators and ASA and others, if one of the high street banks sent out an email promoting a 'quick access' product without qualifying that quick access requires payment of a fee!
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alibaba
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Post by alibaba on Mar 16, 2021 10:53:25 GMT
Thought it may be of interest to share my experience of the last twelve months
On the 15/03/2020 changed settings on the site to withdraw all
QAA 100K
MLA 8K
GBBA1. 16K
GEA. 14K
GBBA2 48K
Total 186 k
Situation 16/03/2021
QAA 41K
MLA 5K
GBBA1 7K
GEA. 7K
GBBA2 35K
Total 95k
accrued interest 11k
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cb25
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Post by cb25 on Mar 22, 2021 15:43:44 GMT
Just received an email from AC, which includes
"As a result of our progress to normalise the Access Accounts, we’re now pleased to announce we will be recommencing new retail lending next month."
Also mentions the idea of an Exit Account, which will enable AA lenders to NOT participate in any new lending "More information on the Exit Account will follow in the coming days but, in summary, it is a means for someone who does not wish to remain in the Access Accounts and participate in new lending to exit with their loan holdings into an individual account which has the same broad characteristics except no new lending and no diversification"
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(Hint: Incognito / InPrivate browsing is your friend when accessing P2PFN)
