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Post by pepperpot on Jan 3, 2014 14:17:44 GMT
Thanks, just given it a trial run and it works fine.
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Post by chris on Jan 3, 2014 14:54:05 GMT
pepperpot, you can buy it back. A few weeks ago, I listed some units for sale & entered too many in error, bought a few back a few minutes later, but was obviously charged the 0.35% fee, which does not apply anymore. Hope AC can confirm that this is still the case. This is still the case. We won't be reintroducing any fees on the secondary market in the foreseeable future - the platform is intended to be free to use for our lenders. We should have the facility to remove loan parts from sale, it's on our to do list but hasn't been seen as a priority. I'm also considering removing the expiry time from loan units that are listed for sale, it's currently trying to solve a problem we don't have.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Jan 3, 2014 16:26:28 GMT
pepperpot, you can buy it back. A few weeks ago, I listed some units for sale & entered too many in error, bought a few back a few minutes later, but was obviously charged the 0.35% fee, which does not apply anymore. Hope AC can confirm that this is still the case. This is still the case. This works only if you have a free cash balance in your account with which to buy your own units. £100 would be enough to buy parts back one at a time, but could be a pain if there are a number of parts involved. So it would be a lot easier if there was a 'Withdraw from sale' option. Another situation when withdrawal might be appropriate is if a lender is trying to raise funds to participate in a new loan by selling off some parts of loans they already have. They may have a few positions they'd consider selling, but there's no way to know which might sell the soonest. So they list them all for sale and see what goes first. Once they've sold the desired amount, they'd want to withdraw the rest of the parts from sale. Actually, the ideal solution in the above situation would be for the lender to have an option that says "When £XXX of parts have been sold, remove the remaining parts from sale." Easier said than done, I expect, but perhaps something to add to the Wish List.
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Post by mead187 on Jan 4, 2014 12:52:42 GMT
without copying FC I would like to see a simple breakdown of earnings on the dashboard - if only just a box that says "total interest earned to date" paid or accrued or both.
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mikeb
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Post by mikeb on Jan 4, 2014 19:31:54 GMT
+1 on the interest/returns breakdown, currently the only way to work out interest received (£,p) is to process the downloaded statements in a spreadsheet. Also some kind of "whole loan-book" percentage return, again, currently figuring that out by taking weighted AER's and totalling them up from my own spreadsheet manually. On the aftermarket :- There seems to be some kind of system where a large loan chunk offered is auto-split into bitesize £100 chunks. Would it be possible to arrange that to offer a mixture of £100 and £smaller parts, e.g. £100, £50, £20? Or are such small amounts considered small change?
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Post by chris on Jan 4, 2014 20:40:52 GMT
The auto-split amount is currently set on a per loan basis by the admin team. They're tending to set it to £100 at the moment, but for larger loans it can be set to a larger amount.
We could add a control to the bid screen to allow users to choose their own split amount but at present it's been omitted in the name of simplicity.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Jan 4, 2014 22:54:59 GMT
The auto-split amount is currently set on a per loan basis by the admin team. They're tending to set it to £100 at the moment, but for larger loans it can be set to a larger amount. I don't think it would be a good idea to set it higher than £100 since, AIUI, that's what controls the size of parts that are offered in the aftermarket. If it were set at say £200 -- or even £500 -- for very large loans, then when underwriters go to offer in the aftermarket the parts would be off-limits to a lender who didn't want to invest in such large chunks. I can see the advantage of larger chunks in reducing the number of loan parts the AC systems have to keep track of, but I think this disdvantage is significant and should be avoided. One way around this would be if it were possible to subdivide loan parts at the time they were offered on the aftermarket. That way, a a large lender could hold £500 chunks if they wanted to do that, but if they wanted to sell they could do that in £100 chunks and increase the number of lenders who might be willing to buy what's offered. This might be a 'best-of-both-worlds' solution for lenders, but it might not be easy to implement from the technical side. We could add a control to the bid screen to allow users to choose their own split amount but at present it's been omitted in the name of simplicity. It's probably best to keep it that way, especially if the suggestion above could be implemented, as it would seem to be better if any subdividing of parts could be done at the time of sale, as in many -- most?? -- cases it wouldn't be necessary at all. mikeb: I don't think £50 is an option, as the one time I tried to place a £50 bid the system told me I couldn't. I think loan part sizes have to be divisible by £20.
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Post by chris on Jan 4, 2014 23:02:27 GMT
One way around this would be if it were possible to subdivide loan parts at the time they were offered on the aftermarket. That way, a a large lender could hold £500 chunks if they wanted to do that, but if they wanted to sell they could do that in £100 chunks and increase the number of lenders who might be willing to buy what's offered. This might be a 'best-of-both-worlds' solution for lenders, but it might not be easy to implement from the technical side. mikeb: I don't think £50 is an option, as the one time I tried to place a £50 bid the system told me I couldn't. I think loan part sizes have to be divisible by £20. Splitting loan units would be straight forward enough from a technical point of view, bit of a pain but doable. However I don't think it's possible from a legal point of view - at least that's the advice we've had so far. We have to follow a set procedure during the sale of a loan unit at the moment and that includes flagging the old loan unit as having been sold and then creating a new loan unit with a new reference number for the new lender. £50 isn't currently an option, as you say bids must be divisible by £20. I'm actually thinking of dropping that requirement and maybe reducing the minimum to £10 and letting you bid anything you like above that. The software will cope fine, we already have a large number of loan units per loan due to big bids being split automatically, and the only reason for the minimum is to reduce interest being rounded to whole pennies from being significant to the overall amount of interest earned (this is calculated to 20 decimal places over the life of the loan, but ultimately has to be rounded to a whole penny).
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Jan 5, 2014 3:33:32 GMT
We have to follow a set procedure during the sale of a loan unit at the moment and that includes flagging the old loan unit as having been sold and then creating a new loan unit with a new reference number for the new lender. I wonder how Zopa do it, then. If a Zopa lender who was lending in £100 chunks wants to Rapid Return one of those, Zopa don't require that the whole lot go to just one single RR recipient. It could be split into as many as ten £10 chunks and go to ten different lenders. A couple of possibilities spring to mind... - Zopa received different legal advice than Assetz did; or
- The lender just appeared to be lending in £100 chunks, and internally to the Zopa system they actually were lending in packets of ten £10 chunks.
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Post by chris on Jan 5, 2014 9:21:43 GMT
A couple of possibilities spring to mind... - Zopa received different legal advice than Assetz did; or
mikes1531 - This is most likely. There are numerous things that some of the other platforms are doing that we have been advised are either illegal, make them a collective investment scheme (a big regulatory no no), or are in probable breach of other regulations. I highly doubt that all those platforms failed to get proper advice or that they ignored the advice they've been given and if we were to talk to other advisors it's probable that we'd get conflicting advice. Much of what these platforms do operates in current gray areas which are open to interpretation. We currently employ a dedicated full time compliance officer with many many years experience in the finance industry and working with large banks (who reports directly to our chairman Paul Moore), and have a full time retained legal advisor who handles all of our loans and also provides compliance and legal advice for the business as a whole. As such we like to think we have the best advice in the industry and are best prepared for the FCA's coming regulation, which as it currently stands has almost no impact on the way we're already doing things. But that doesn't mean the opinions we receive are definitive and that others are genuinely doing it wrong - for example there may be something in the way Zopa structure their legal agreements or in the process used in the aftermarket that means that what they're doing is perfectly fine, and that we just haven't asked the right questions of our advisors or would need to restructure our lender / borrower contracts, etc. If it's a genuinely needed facility then I can raise it again with my fellow directors and ask our advisors to work out how it can be done. With auto-split and the amounts our most active lenders are investing I don't think it's currently a high priority for us. One to keep an eye on for the future though, and if I face a barrage of people on here saying how important it is for them then naturally I'll bump it's priority up a little bit
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Jan 5, 2014 10:01:01 GMT
Can we also include a facility which shows interest earned for any specific period of time minus any fees/charges (e.g. loan unit sale fees)? Thanks AKA a tax statement so that I can do my tax return. Absolutely vital and please provide by the end of the tax year if poss.
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Jan 5, 2014 11:18:07 GMT
A couple of possibilities spring to mind... - Zopa received different legal advice than Assetz did; or
mikes1531 - This is most likely. There are numerous things that some of the other platforms are doing that we have been advised are either illegal, make them a collective investment scheme (a big regulatory no no), or are in probable breach of other regulations. I highly doubt that all those platforms failed to get proper advice or that they ignored the advice they've been given and if we were to talk to other advisors it's probable that we'd get conflicting advice. Much of what these platforms do operates in current gray areas which are open to interpretation. We currently employ a dedicated full time compliance officer with many many years experience in the finance industry and working with large banks (who reports directly to our chairman Paul Moore), and have a full time retained legal advisor who handles all of our loans and also provides compliance and legal advice for the business as a whole. As such we like to think we have the best advice in the industry and are best prepared for the FCA's coming regulation, which as it currently stands has almost no impact on the way we're already doing things. But that doesn't mean the opinions we receive are definitive and that others are genuinely doing it wrong - for example there may be something in the way Zopa structure their legal agreements or in the process used in the aftermarket that means that what they're doing is perfectly fine, and that we just haven't asked the right questions of our advisors or would need to restructure our lender / borrower contracts, etc. If it's a genuinely needed facility then I can raise it again with my fellow directors and ask our advisors to work out how it can be done. With auto-split and the amounts our most active lenders are investing I don't think it's currently a high priority for us. One to keep an eye on for the future though, and if I face a barrage of people on here saying how important it is for them then naturally I'll bump it's priority up a little bit Compliance is a hot potato and there are goodness knows how many companies that have set themselves up as self appointed experts in this field. It's all to do with interpretation of what is, IMO, some vaguely worded regulations. Those vaguely worded regulations have often been compiled by goodness knows how many contributing committees at the FCA (was FSA) and can be interpreted in several ways. It would help if the regulations were composed using normal English. But why use one word when you can spread it out over a whole page. Consequently many of the regulations contradict each other. Section *.** contradicts section *.**. The whole thing needs to go back to square one but there's no chance of that happening. It's not helped of course by the simple fact that the shelf life of many of the staff at the FCA is not that long. So you have the new brooms etc.
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Post by chris on Jan 5, 2014 12:39:10 GMT
It's well outside my area of expertise but I'd be surprised if there were too many examples of regulation being any other way. All I can do is work within the guidance I'm given and point out how others are interpreting it. Would be nice if it were all black and white but my life is unlikely to ever be that simple!
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Jan 5, 2014 13:17:58 GMT
It's well outside my area of expertise but I'd be surprised if there were too many examples of regulation being any other way. All I can do is work within the guidance I'm given and point out how others are interpreting it. Would be nice if it were all black and white but my life is unlikely to ever be that simple! '....It's well outside my area of expertise....' - think it's outside of everyone's level of expertise apart from those being paid to lighten your wallet with their expert advice. There lies the problem though - you have to interpret the regulations. All depends on what way the wind is blowing on a particular day I suppose. We were once told by the FSA that whilst there was nothing wrong with what we were doing we were not operating within the spirit of the regulations in one particular area. It was so important I've forgotten what it was. Nope, they (the FSA) couldn't suggest an alternative as they were apparently not permitted to do so. Nothing further happened, never even got a letter, etc. They just felt the need to find something that they didn't agree with. No doubt to justify the cost of their visit. Another of those go figure moments for me.
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Post by batchoy on Jan 5, 2014 14:07:38 GMT
I deal with regulations on a daily basis (though no for the financial sector) and the biggest problem is that no-one is able to give a definitive guidance including the regulators and enforcement authorities, its all just opinions and best guesses until an issue comes to court and legal precedence is set.
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