jonno
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nil satis nisi optimum
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Post by jonno on Feb 12, 2021 15:16:21 GMT
I would think that Covid is a bit more than a handy "smokescreen" adrianc ? You think it won't get used as one when people start suggesting Brexit's not been the massive economic sunlit upland we were promised? "Oh, well, it would have been... but covid..."Oh come on..............everyone knows that the 10% drop in GDP has got nothing to do with an almost total closure of the economy for twelve months; it's all down to not being able to get hold of those damned parsnips from those bastard Europeans
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Feb 12, 2021 15:18:14 GMT
You think it won't get used as one when people start suggesting Brexit's not been the massive economic sunlit upland we were promised? "Oh, well, it would have been... but covid..."Oh come on..............everyone knows that the 10% drop in GDP has got nothing to do with an almost total closure of the economy for twelve months; it's all down to not being able to get hold of those damned parsnips from those bastard Europeans Then I'm sure we'll have absolutely no issue bouncing back from it at the same rate as all our neighbours, right? (BTW, it hasn't an "almost total closure". 90% of it's clearly been fine... Nor has it been all twelve months.)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2021 15:42:46 GMT
I see Farago is punting teaching share trading to the uninitiated..... should be a hoot.
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Feb 12, 2021 17:17:44 GMT
it's all down to not being able to get hold of those damned parsnips from those bastard Europeans
You know, the hilarious thing about Brexiteers complaining about the Europeans blocking things is that they were the ones who supported the rules in the first place.
For example UK voted for the passing of an EU law banning shellfish imports from third countries back in 2010/2011.
So Brexiteers should not act all surprised now that the EU refuses imports, given that in 2016 the UK voted to become a third-country.
Become a third country. Be subject to third country rules.
The Brexiteers could of course, agree to abide by all EU present and future regulations in shellfish. But, well, you know ... sovereignty. Well, the good news is as there isnt a ban on the import of shellfish from third countries. There is no issue with the UK importing Class A LBM, the problem lies with Class B that would need to be purificated. The problem is that there is no health certificate to permit it which the EU was supposed to be sorting in April. A ban would probably breach WTO SPS regulations & the TCA which prevent arbitrary or unjustifiable discrimination
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Feb 12, 2021 18:39:32 GMT
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Post by captainconfident on Feb 12, 2021 18:58:33 GMT
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shimself
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Post by shimself on Feb 12, 2021 19:55:03 GMT
You can understand why he would be worried
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Feb 13, 2021 8:57:54 GMT
Those stating that everything's lovely really should read this, without immediately denouncing it on principle. Everything is sourced and linked to.
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Feb 14, 2021 10:57:14 GMT
Meanwhile, the press that would otherwise be highlighting these serious issues in a more prominent way are not, because of any mix of: 1) The pandemic taking precedence. 2) US politics taking precedence. 3) Fear of Government reprisal of public service broadcasters. 4) Brexit fatigue. 5) Some people really still liking Brexit, so newspapers prefer to call this issue 'teething' or 'remoaning'. 6) It not involving really sexy pictures of huge lorry queues, that can't quite be replaced by people looking really angry at a computer Nick Cohen, on a similar theme to the above: "No one should be able to deny that Britain is in an economic and political crisis brought on by Brexit. Yet the government won’t talk about it. The opposition dare not mention it. The rightwing press won’t cover it. And broadcasters fear they will be damned as biased if they admit it. Rather than face reality, we live in an imaginary Britain, a land of make-believe, where the political class act out parts as if they are on a film set."It is a truly bizarre state of affairs. In almost any other circumstances this couldn't happen, yet everyone now has a reason not to want to talk about it. Even amongst us, even me as I write this very post, feel reticent to bother because it only (typically) sets off negative vibes - and in any case, it ain't gonna change anything. I certainly am not in the mood to point-score. I do tend to agree with the author. Though I can understand their reticence, it is something of a dereliction of duty that Labour + co are tactically ignoring the consequences. edit: Honestly, can't even tell you how close I was to binning this post
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Post by dan1 on Feb 14, 2021 11:12:21 GMT
Meanwhile, the press that would otherwise be highlighting these serious issues in a more prominent way are not, because of any mix of: 1) The pandemic taking precedence. 2) US politics taking precedence. 3) Fear of Government reprisal of public service broadcasters. 4) Brexit fatigue. 5) Some people really still liking Brexit, so newspapers prefer to call this issue 'teething' or 'remoaning'. 6) It not involving really sexy pictures of huge lorry queues, that can't quite be replaced by people looking really angry at a computer Nick Cohen, on a similar theme to the above: "No one should be able to deny that Britain is in an economic and political crisis brought on by Brexit. Yet the government won’t talk about it. The opposition dare not mention it. The rightwing press won’t cover it. And broadcasters fear they will be damned as biased if they admit it. Rather than face reality, we live in an imaginary Britain, a land of make-believe, where the political class act out parts as if they are on a film set."It is a truly bizarre state of affairs. In almost any other circumstances this couldn't happen, yet everyone now has a reason not to want to talk about it. Even amongst us, even me as I write this very post, feel reticent to bother because it only (typically) sets off negative vibes - and in any case, it ain't gonna change anything. I certainly am not in the mood to point-score. I do tend to agree with the author. Though I can understand their reticence, it is something of a dereliction of duty that Labour + co are tactically ignoring the consequences. edit: Honestly, can't even tell you how close I was to binning this post I hate to break this to you but it's only gonna get worse As the economic reality of our response to the pandemic starts to bite I expect a further lurch to the right. It's no coincidence that the new venture GB News is right leaning (putting it politely) as opposed to left leaning (a CNN style channel with the balls to call a lie a lie). The call of nationalism has rarely been more powerful in this country. From where we stand at present I put the probability of a Labour majority at the next election at 0%, and perhaps an optimistic 5% for a hung parliament. We're in this for the long haul.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Feb 14, 2021 11:24:38 GMT
From where we stand at present I put the probability of a Labour majority at the next election at 0%, and perhaps an optimistic 5% for a hung parliament. We're in this for the long haul. I don't think we can easily predict what the spring of 2024 is going to bring. Will Scotland and NI be voting for Westminster? Will the "blue wall" Northern seats have the same "But Corbyn" impetus to vote against ingrained generational habits? Who, indeed, will be the incumbent PM? I'd lay odds on it not being Johnson...
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Feb 14, 2021 11:25:04 GMT
I hate to break this to you but it's only gonna get worse As the economic reality of our response to the pandemic starts to bite I expect a further lurch to the right. It's no coincidence that the new venture GB News is right leaning (putting it politely) as opposed to left leaning (a CNN style channel with the balls to call a lie a lie). The call of nationalism has rarely been more powerful in this country. From where we stand at present I put the probability of a Labour majority at the next election at 0%, and perhaps an optimistic 5% for a hung parliament. We're in this for the long haul. In my view, it's about as easy to predict the outcome now of the UK general election on May 2nd 2024 as it is the exact weather on that day. We have three more years of twists/turns, crises etc, and then in any case our fate will be decided by something like Boris Johnson eating a veggie burger and dripping some mayonnaise on his tie. edit: and whether that means he wins or loses will possibly depend on whether the burger was ethically sourced or not.
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Feb 14, 2021 11:31:31 GMT
From where we stand at present I put the probability of a Labour majority at the next election at 0%, and perhaps an optimistic 5% for a hung parliament. We're in this for the long haul. I don't think we can easily predict what the spring of 2024 is going to bring. Will Scotland and NI be voting for Westminster? Will the "blue wall" Northern seats have the same "But Corbyn" impetus to vote against ingrained generational habits? Who, indeed, will be the incumbent PM? I'd lay odds on it not being Johnson... I agree, it's just basically too far off. Which is another good reason why, in my view, Labour should be taking the hit now of being accused as 'Remainers' to do what's actually right and point out in public that the consequences of our current policies are damaging peace in N.Ireland and our trade, regardless of whether anyone still perceives it as a good idea overall. There is a point to that, beyond winning elections. This Government can on occasion be pestered into doing things better e.g. Marcus Rashford and his school dinners to take a somewhat simpler example. It's ridiculous to have an opposition ignoring huge damage being done to the economy when it is directly because of Government policy. Note I'm not advocating them suggesting we rejoin at all, just to point out the various disasters and insist the Government do something about it.
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Post by dan1 on Feb 14, 2021 12:41:54 GMT
adrianc r00lish67I agree with you both on the uncertainties being pretty huge this far out from an election. I do still regard Starmer as effectively unelectable vs Johnson in pretty much any situation. I do reflect that on the pandemic we're pretty much top of the league tables for major economies when it comes to death rates and bottom (or not far off) on economic impact, and that's ignoring brexit, and yet the Tories are ahead in the polls (I think?). And I think we're agreed that personal morality plays little part. We're increasingly looking at the style over substance and personality over party when it comes to voting at general elections. That's not to say Starmer can't beat the likes of Gove or Raab (nor Sunak but I'm more on the fence in this face-off). I lost interest as soon as the last election was called because I saw a 50+ majority as a foregone conclusion. Primarily because Corbyn was unelectable in much the same way as Kinnock, John Smith, and Gordon Brown were. Likewise, Hague and Howard was unelectable against Blair. The unelectable argument is simplistic but a powerful predictor. I'm not sure what's going on with Labour at the moment wrt brexit stance etc but I guess they're still tearing themselves apart. Can Starmer reform the party (bring it more to the centre?) to bring it within reach at the next election? I'm not so sure...
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Post by bernythedolt on Feb 14, 2021 13:01:45 GMT
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