adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Feb 14, 2021 13:57:26 GMT
adrianc r00lish67 I agree with you both on the uncertainties being pretty huge this far out from an election. I do still regard Starmer as effectively unelectable vs Johnson in pretty much any situation. I do reflect that on the pandemic we're pretty much top of the league tables for major economies when it comes to death rates and bottom (or not far off) on economic impact, and that's ignoring brexit, and yet the Tories are ahead in the polls (I think?). And I think we're agreed that personal morality plays little part. We're increasingly looking at the style over substance and personality over party when it comes to voting at general elections. That's not to say Starmer can't beat the likes of Gove or Raab (nor Sunak but I'm more on the fence in this face-off). I lost interest as soon as the last election was called because I saw a 50+ majority as a foregone conclusion. Primarily because Corbyn was unelectable in much the same way as Kinnock, John Smith, and Gordon Brown were. Likewise, Hague and Howard was unelectable against Blair. The unelectable argument is simplistic but a powerful predictor. I'm not sure what's going on with Labour at the moment wrt brexit stance etc but I guess they're still tearing themselves apart. Can Starmer reform the party (bring it more to the centre?) to bring it within reach at the next election? I'm not so sure... Whether Smith would have been electable is an interesting question - we never got the chance to find out. He took the reins of the Labour party after Kinnock lost to Major in 1992, and died in 1994. If he'd led the Labour party into 1997, he probably would have won, simply because the Tories were toxic by then, after 18 years of power. If he'd led them into 1992...? <shrug> I'm certainly a bit underwhelmed with Starmer so far... Is he simply giving Johnson enough rope to let the Tories eat him once Covid's out the way? And who would replace Johnson? Sunak could well be the obvious choice, but for the minor issue of being the wrong shade for the party membership... and tarred with the cost of Covid.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2021 14:15:25 GMT
The Johnson family are hardly pure Anglo-Saxons..
Just a bit from wiki
Johnson's paternal great-grandfather was the Ottoman journalist Ali Kemal who was of Turkish and Circassian origin,[626][627][628] and a secular Muslim. Johnson's paternal grandfather, Wilfred Johnson – Ali Kemal's son, was an RAF pilot in Coastal Command during the Second World War.[629] His father's other ancestry includes English, German and French; one of his German ancestors was said to be the illegitimate daughter of Prince Paul of Württemberg and thus a descendant of King George II of Great Britain.[630] This would make him and Elizabeth II sixth cousins twice removed. Through Mary of Teck's connection to Duke Frederick II Eugene of Württemberg, they would in that case also have a closer genealogical link as fifth cousins twice removed. Johnson's mother is the granddaughter of Elias Avery Lowe, a palaeographer, who was a Russian Jewish immigrant to the US,[631] and Pennsylvania-born Helen Tracy Lowe-Porter, a translator of Thomas Mann.[632] In reference to his varied ancestry, Johnson has described himself as a "one-man melting pot" – with a combination of Abrahamic religious great-grandparents.[633] Johnson was given the middle name "Boris" after a Russian émigré his parents had once met.[11] An episode of Who Do You Think You Are? explored the German origins of his middle name Pfeffel.[6][634][635] Through this family line, Boris Johnson is a descendant in the seventh generation of Anna Catharina Bischoff, whose mummified corpse was found in 1975 and identified in 2018.[636][637]
Sunak struggles with being a jolly sort of fellow, which is why we see him trying to smile all the time. Too much consultant in him. But amongst the rest of cabinet he stands out by knowing how to do his job. The rump of the ultra-brexiteers are toxic and stupid to a man or woman. I listened to a man with no anti-virus training trying to explain why pubs should open this week. To think that anyone voted for him.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Feb 14, 2021 14:42:58 GMT
Is this the same Irish government that is preventing cars from crossing the border, in an attempt to keep the Kent variant out?
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Feb 14, 2021 14:58:26 GMT
Nick Cohen, on a similar theme to the above: "No one should be able to deny that Britain is in an economic and political crisis brought on by Brexit. Yet the government won’t talk about it. The opposition dare not mention it. The rightwing press won’t cover it. And broadcasters fear they will be damned as biased if they admit it. Rather than face reality, we live in an imaginary Britain, a land of make-believe, where the political class act out parts as if they are on a film set."It is a truly bizarre state of affairs. In almost any other circumstances this couldn't happen, yet everyone now has a reason not to want to talk about it. Even amongst us, even me as I write this very post, feel reticent to bother because it only (typically) sets off negative vibes - and in any case, it ain't gonna change anything. I certainly am not in the mood to point-score. I do tend to agree with the author. Though I can understand their reticence, it is something of a dereliction of duty that Labour + co are tactically ignoring the consequences. edit: Honestly, can't even tell you how close I was to binning this post I hate to break this to you but it's only gonna get worse As the economic reality of our response to the pandemic starts to bite I expect a further lurch to the right. It's no coincidence that the new venture GB News is right leaning (putting it politely) as opposed to left leaning (a CNN style channel with the balls to call a lie a lie). The call of nationalism has rarely been more powerful in this country. From where we stand at present I put the probability of a Labour majority at the next election at 0%, and perhaps an optimistic 5% for a hung parliament. We're in this for the long haul. Betfair has it at about 3/1. If you really think its so slim you could make a lot of money betting against..... Personally, I think Starmir is probably the first electable personality (yes people vote on personality more than policy I think) Labour has had since Blair. Unfortauntely for them he comers with a huge amount of Brexit Baggage so will not win the so called red wall. There are other things as he did in his past life as DPP which annoyed some. So I do think the odds of a labour majority a definitely longer than 3/1 but not quite zero.
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starfished
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Post by starfished on Feb 14, 2021 15:49:49 GMT
I hate to break this to you but it's only gonna get worse As the economic reality of our response to the pandemic starts to bite I expect a further lurch to the right. It's no coincidence that the new venture GB News is right leaning (putting it politely) as opposed to left leaning (a CNN style channel with the balls to call a lie a lie). The call of nationalism has rarely been more powerful in this country. From where we stand at present I put the probability of a Labour majority at the next election at 0%, and perhaps an optimistic 5% for a hung parliament. We're in this for the long haul. Betfair has it at about 3/1. If you really think its so slim you could make a lot of money betting against..... Personally, I think Starmir is probably the first electable personality (yes people vote on personality more than policy I think) Labour has had since Blair. Unfortauntely for them he comers with a huge amount of Brexit Baggage so will not win the so called red wall. There are other things as he did in his past life as DPP which annoyed some. So I do think the odds of a labour majority a definitely longer than 3/1 but not quite zero. Given that baggage it is no surprise to me that he is not attacking current Brexit consequences. It gains him nothing and potentially costs him a lot. I also still don't think it (yet) gains the country a benefit to do so. People still feel too entrenched about their brexit positions. Right or wrongly, emotionally no one likes being told "I told you so". As I have said before I don't know many people who voted for Brexit (being a soft londoner) but those that I do, still believe Brexit was the correct thing to do and an economic price for it can be tolerated. While things are not where they thought they would end up, (i.e. a higher economic price) they more blame the EU for being stubborn rather than the Tories. The optimist in me thinks, things will get better in the mid-term (both Brexit and Pandemic). How quickly they do so, will determine the Tories fate...
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Post by dan1 on Feb 17, 2021 16:01:54 GMT
This site is like a gift that keeps on giving (my red boxes, as if this wasn't evident).... ![](https://i.imgur.com/OXsfGIx.png) and the footer... ![](https://i.imgur.com/cVyklfB.png) I had to visit www.trees-online.co.uk for myself.... ![](https://i.imgur.com/vL58EgV.png) I may even put in an order I wonder what'll happen to their orders... plummet or rocket?
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travolta
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Post by travolta on Feb 17, 2021 16:34:26 GMT
Dont worry guys . Johnson will get bored with it all soon and throw a sickie . THEN WE CAN HAVE GOVE.................
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Feb 17, 2021 16:41:23 GMT
This site is like a gift that keeps on giving (my red boxes, as if this wasn't evident).... ![](https://i.imgur.com/OXsfGIx.png) and the footer... ![](https://i.imgur.com/cVyklfB.png) I had to visit www.trees-online.co.uk for myself.... ![](https://i.imgur.com/vL58EgV.png) I may even put in an order I wonder what'll happen to their orders... plummet or rocket? We've been thinking of buying a tree or two. Now I know where they'll come from.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Feb 17, 2021 16:51:35 GMT
This site is like a gift that keeps on giving I guess that's one way of looking at it.
Possibly, just a bitter and twisted remainer, who can't accept that the vote didn't go their way. Far better to spend every waking moment complaining about it rather than trying to resolve whatever problems exist.
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Post by dan1 on Feb 17, 2021 16:53:52 GMT
This site is like a gift that keeps on giving I guess that's one way of looking at it.
Possibly, just a bitter and twisted remainer, who can't accept that the vote didn't go their way. Far better to spend every waking moment complaining about it rather than trying to resolve whatever problems exist.
hahahaha I knew you'd take that well! Perhaps they just want to run their business as they were promised. Remember this mega-lie... "there will be no non-tariff barriers to trade"
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2021 16:58:32 GMT
Possibly, just a bitter and twisted remainer, who can't accept that the vote didn't go their way. Far better to spend every waking moment complaining about it rather than trying to resolve whatever problems exist. Or maybe a desperate person watching their business and livelihood being destroyed by Brexiteer stupidity and lies.
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Feb 17, 2021 17:00:02 GMT
I guess that's one way of looking at it.
Possibly, just a bitter and twisted remainer, who can't accept that the vote didn't go their way. Far better to spend every waking moment complaining about it rather than trying to resolve whatever problems exist.
hahahaha I knew you'd take that well! Perhaps they just want to run their business as they were promised. Remember this mega-lie... "there will be no non-tariff barriers to trade" Maybe just twigged there is a market for viewpoints and has another branch selling British oak trees for British soil. I'm sure you will get to the root of it if you check the address.
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jlend
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Post by jlend on Feb 17, 2021 17:04:50 GMT
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Feb 17, 2021 17:08:32 GMT
I guess that's one way of looking at it.
Possibly, just a bitter and twisted remainer, who can't accept that the vote didn't go their way. Far better to spend every waking moment complaining about it rather than trying to resolve whatever problems exist.
hahahaha I knew you'd take that well! Perhaps they just want to run their business as they were promised. Remember this mega-lie... "there will be no non-tariff barriers to trade" God, Dan, can't you just get a grip and renegotiate that Northern Ireland protocol to resolve this? post-haste!
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Feb 17, 2021 17:24:07 GMT
Also in that article: 'Mike Harvey, director at Maelor Forest Nurseries in Wales, which sells about 32m trees a year, said it too had had to stop selling to Northern Ireland, with a recent order for 1,000 oaks about to be cancelled. But what enrages Harvey is not so much the ban on movement of trees to Northern Ireland but the continued importation of trees from Ireland for forestation projects. He said Brexit gave the UK an opportunity to close the border to EU trees and give the country a fighting chance of stopping the “drift of disease from south-east Europe to the north-west”.
The diseases, which some put down to climate change, include ash dieback and the Xylella disease, which has come into the UK via olive trees and can affect several species of broadleaved trees. “It’s typical that the EU puts these restrictions in place and applies them rigorously in Northern Ireland but we leave the borders open to trees coming in from the EU including Ireland and the Netherlands,” Harvey said. “If we want to control disease and give ourselves a chance, it’s actually a good thing to stop these transportation of trees between our islands.” '
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