michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Jul 3, 2023 23:01:24 GMT
Interesting. Just because... they're British? Yes, domestic PEP should be assessed from a starting point that they are a lower risk - FSMA 2023 I struggle to see what prominent function identified in the list within the legislation AIUI Farage continues to occupy or has done within the last 12 months which is the period a previous PEP is still subject to the rules. So must be due to association with PEP that he qualifies He isn't liked by people like RM and Adrian and therefore he is denied a bank account by people like them using whatever reason they can find. I am certainly not a Farage fanboy but it is obvious that in a functioning democracy people like him or people who are totally against him should not be penalised for their views.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Jul 4, 2023 2:55:07 GMT
Yes, domestic PEP should be assessed from a starting point that they are a lower risk - FSMA 2023 I struggle to see what prominent function identified in the list within the legislation AIUI Farage continues to occupy or has done within the last 12 months which is the period a previous PEP is still subject to the rules. So must be due to association with PEP that he qualifies He isn't liked by people like RM and Adrian and therefore he is denied a bank account by people like them using whatever reason they can find. I am certainly not a Farage fanboy but it is obvious that in a functioning democracy people like him or people who are totally against him should not be penalised for their views. 1. That's an assumption on your part. No evidence to support it exists. Furthermore there's real evidence to support the corollary eg Farage palling it up with Trump, who's status has certainly changed over the last few months. 2. I'd suggest that blindly swallowing what comes out of Farage's mouth might have proven, historically at least, to be unwise.
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keitha
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Post by keitha on Jul 4, 2023 11:06:27 GMT
Blacking up is part of the border morris tradition, the one with sticks and tatter coats, not hankies and bells, which is Cotswold. It was done to disguise the dancers, so their masters wouldn't recognise them if they drank too much or got a bit rowdy, border morris being more likely to be more "robust" than Cotswold.. That's all. Nowadays some border morris sides have switched to a different style, such as masks or green or white paint instead of black, so as not to offend. waiting for someone to complain that pictures of miners in the local museum is cultural appropriation, or that the black coal dust is them "blacking up" and is offensive
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dovap
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Post by dovap on Jul 4, 2023 11:39:45 GMT
He isn't liked by people like RM and Adrian and therefore he is denied a bank account by people like them using whatever reason they can find. I am certainly not a Farage fanboy but it is obvious that in a functioning democracy people like him or people who are totally against him should not be penalised for their views. 1. That's an assumption on your part. No evidence to support it exists. Furthermore there's real evidence to support the corollary eg Farage palling it up with Trump, who's status has certainly changed over the last few months. 2. I'd suggest that blindly swallowing what comes out of Farage's mouth might have proven, historically at least, to be unwise. Seems he merely didn't have the necessary funds required to keep his Coutts account but was offered a standard Natwest acct instead.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Jul 4, 2023 12:10:57 GMT
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Jul 4, 2023 12:12:45 GMT
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Jul 4, 2023 12:29:21 GMT
He isn't liked by people like RM and Adrian and therefore he is denied a bank account by people like them using whatever reason they can find. I am certainly not a Farage fanboy but it is obvious that in a functioning democracy people like him or people who are totally against him should not be penalised for their views. 1. That's an assumption on your part. No evidence to support it exists. Furthermore there's real evidence to support the corollary eg Farage palling it up with Trump, who's status has certainly changed over the last few months. 2. I'd suggest that blindly swallowing what comes out of Farage's mouth might have proven, historically at least, to be unwise. Did I understand you correctly that you believe people who have certain views (such as Farage) should be punished for holding them? A kind of "hostile environment" ?
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Post by bracknellboy on Jul 4, 2023 14:23:32 GMT
Agreed. Interesting there was no mention of what happened to the kids. I don't think they can just be dumped on the side of the road. Seems to me the pragmatic thing to do would be for an officer to drive that bus to wherever it was going then on to the pound. I rather doubt they were kicked off and then left unattended by the side of the road. The vehicle had no MoT. Which is important for you and me, but particularly important for a large vehicle carrying kids. Also I would be surprised if many police officers are deemed qualified to drive a bus, and very unlikelhy to be licensed to drive a public service vehicle. I can just imagine the headlines: number of kids seriously injured, some with life changing injuries, and two adult pedestrians also injured, after coach with no MoT veers off road onto pavement after major mechanical failure while being driven by unqualified police officer.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Jul 4, 2023 14:56:36 GMT
1. That's an assumption on your part. No evidence to support it exists. Furthermore there's real evidence to support the corollary eg Farage palling it up with Trump, who's status has certainly changed over the last few months. 2. I'd suggest that blindly swallowing what comes out of Farage's mouth might have proven, historically at least, to be unwise. Did I understand you correctly that you believe people who have certain views (such as Farage) should be punished for holding them? A kind of "hostile environment" ?
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jul 4, 2023 15:02:43 GMT
2. I'd suggest that blindly swallowing what comes out of Farage's mouth might have proven, historically at least, to be unwise. Seems he merely didn't have the necessary funds required to keep his Coutts account but was offered a standard Natwest acct instead. So, basically, he's been caught red-handed lying... Again.
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Jul 4, 2023 16:49:26 GMT
Interesting. Just because... they're British? I struggle to see what prominent function identified in the list within the legislation AIUI Farage continues to occupy or has done within the last 12 months which is the period a previous PEP is still subject to the rules. So must be due to association with PEP that he qualifies Yes its even in the document registerme forwarded to me to read. He sent it to me to read but didn't read it himself? I'm still interested to see what _he_ thinks about whether people should face a hostile environment due to the views they hold (such as those held by Farage) ?
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Jul 4, 2023 18:32:22 GMT
I'm still interested to see what _he_ thinks about whether people should face a hostile environment due to the views they hold (such as those held by Farage) ? The PEP framework is designed to improve risk management around potentially high risk individuals. Could Farage have fallen under its purview? I don't think it's impossible (vis Banks, Trump, former MEP, former leader of a political party etc). I'm actually surprised by how permissive the PEP framework is, but that's another discussion... I don't think I'm wise enough to offer a definitive answer to your wider question about whether or not "people should face a hostile environment due to the views they hold (such as those held by Farage)". Partly that's because "hostile environment" is a hopelessly vague term. I guess I hold a number of different views, some of which likely conflict. * Should people be able to hold whatever views they like? As much as possible, yes. With that goes responsibility for holding them, including that one result might be that some people take offense. * Should somebody who openly supports ISIS be allowed to raise funds for them and open a UK bank account for the management of those funds? Absolutely not. * Should a hotel owner be allowed to turn away a gay couple because homosexual relationships somehow offend against their religious beliefs? I think the answer is no, but I accept that it's much more nuanced than the ISIS example above (and I don't actually know what the law says at the moment). * Should a bank be allowed to turn down the custom of the hotel owner above because the bank as an institution wants to promote a culturally progressive agenda (or because it stands to lose more business from disgruntled customers who leave because it refuses to stop dealing with the hotel owner than it would gain because it continues to deal with the hotel owner)? I don't know the answer to that. There's a real tension between allowing people and organisations the freedom to act as they wish to and upholding the provision of a minimal level of services. * If I held racist or sexist views should I face hostility for holding them? Yes, I think I should, I certainly think I should expect to. * Should British Gas / Thames Water / BT / Vodafone / EDF / Barclays be able to turn down customers? Yes. On what basis? I guess that depends, and it will vary over time. That's why we have a parliament to legislate and courts to uphold the law as it exists at any point in time. Does any of the above mean that I can't hold certain views? No, it doesn't, I just have to accept that holding certain views can have consequences. As for Farage, had he fallen foul of PEP requirements it wouldn't have been because of his views, it would have been because of his risk profile. But it's moot, because we now understand that it was nothing to do him being a PEP or otherwise.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Jul 4, 2023 18:53:31 GMT
Bloody marvelous
6 weeks of unbroken sunshine, and 2 days into Wimbledon and the heavens open. Certainly made a mess of the golf this afternoon.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Jul 4, 2023 19:10:57 GMT
Bloody marvelous
6 weeks of unbroken sunshine, and 2 days into Wimbledon and the heavens open. Certainly made a mess of the golf this afternoon. Looking forward to a bit of rain here, fed up with having to water everything.
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keitha
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Post by keitha on Jul 4, 2023 19:16:12 GMT
Bloody marvelous
6 weeks of unbroken sunshine, and 2 days into Wimbledon and the heavens open. Certainly made a mess of the golf this afternoon. Well they can send it here, we are desperate for rain, we've had some every day for a week but it's usually only spots my 6x6 green house has put less than an inch into my water butt
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