criston
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Post by criston on Dec 7, 2021 17:46:32 GMT
I am two thirds in the holiday park and one third in the batteries and so I am really waiting for the holiday park before saying much. However: I am surprised that people do not seem to remember the number one rule of Ablrate communications, that you must at least double the timescale of positive predictions to convert from Ablrate days to Earth days. So when they say a three month holiday you know it is going to be at least six. Another three months predicted is worrying. I take some comfort from the fact that the whole of this recovery endeavour suggests that Ablrate believes the underlying businesses to be viable, including repayments, and that the issue is one of finance only. So they have not at this stage defaulted the loans, they insist on the management running the business rather than the financing, they take most of the business hostage as presumably valuable security, and they focus on repayments from the business rather than going straight to the guarantor to produce cash or assets at this stage. The guarantee is still there on these loans and, unlike the AC loans, there will still be the opportunity to obtain the pound of flesh if we need to - which I hope we do not. Also this strategy of supporting the borrowers allows the interest to be capitalised and the loans, in due course, to be traded. Personally I would prefer to rely on exit via trading rather than forcing this to asset sales and having to make do with what the vultures have left. AF's main error, with hindsight, was to rely on Greenswill, and he is in good company. I am sore with Abl about 165, but I am sure that Abl and AF will be keen to set things right, or as right as can be achieved. If we shoot Ablrate we are all stuffed. This is not Funding Suckers. Having said that, I might explode when I hear more about the holiday park loans.Prepare for detonation, possibly tomorrow, 8/12/21
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criston
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Post by criston on Dec 8, 2021 18:27:52 GMT
As a substantial investor, while this is all very worrying, I accept no other P2P platform would go to these lengths to protect investors funds.
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ptr120
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Post by ptr120 on Dec 8, 2021 19:17:08 GMT
Except I'm not sure that they are going to all that much lengths (remember, it is our money). Ablrate hasn't said that they are waving their fees to the borrower until the loan is back on its feet (they have done that with other loans in the past). Instead, they have now become a substantial shareholder in the project - under what terms, we know not as we haven't been told. There is no pledge (otherwise we'd have been told) that they and other shareholders won't take dividends from the project until our loans have been repaid. I also expect the period of no interest to be longer than stated, and potentially longer than many of the other AF related loans too.
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blender
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Post by blender on Dec 8, 2021 19:26:02 GMT
Except I'm not sure that they are going to all that much lengths (remember, it is our money). Ablrate hasn't said that they are waving their fees to the borrower until the loan is back on its feet (they have done that with other loans in the past). Instead, they have now become a substantial shareholder in the project - under what terms, we know not as we haven't been told. There is no pledge (otherwise we'd have been told) that they and other shareholders won't take dividends from the project until our loans have been repaid. I also expect the period of no interest to be longer than stated, and potentially longer than many of the other AF related loans too. Ablrate, the platform, has not become a shareholder. It will be held by a co which holds security assets on our behalf, the lenders - as I understand it. No fees either at present. All cost. I would like reassurance that the personal guarantee from AF is still in place. Of course it must be - but trust is waning. Now I will go and explode.
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blueblazer
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Post by blueblazer on Dec 8, 2021 19:35:32 GMT
So 'initially and for a short time only, the loan will remain in its current paused state' turns out to be 'loan repayments will only be able to start again....which is anticipated in late Q1 2022'.
At least another 4 months with zero payments???
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GreenZero
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The early bird may get the worm, but it's the second mouse who gets the cheese
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Post by GreenZero on Dec 8, 2021 19:42:11 GMT
No it doesn't make good reading.
Proposal to sell their business activities and as far as any repayments go, kicked down the road until at least the end of Q1. I'll be honest and say I'd be surprised if we receive any payments at all during 2022.
However I'm sure the cash raised from 165 will make sure certain people have a good Xmas.
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criston
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Post by criston on Dec 9, 2021 14:56:41 GMT
Any other platform would have seen a host of vultures with inflated charges up to £1000 per hour, with their hours stretched to the point where they were working more than 24 hours a day (but as the hours are for a number of separate liquidations, no one can really check it properly). Administrators, liquidators, consultants, estate agents, valuers, surveyors, sequestrators, lawyer's etc.
Those quick fire Rofewoper tranches earned the platform over £200k in set up fees, whereas lenders have received next to nothing from them.
It does appear though, a hell of a lot of work was done by Ablrate over those few months.
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blender
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Post by blender on Dec 9, 2021 16:23:52 GMT
Any other platform would have seen a host of vultures with inflated charges up to £1000 per hour, with their hours stretched to the point where they were working more than 24 hours a day (but as the hours are for a number of separate liquidations, no one can really check it properly). Administrators, liquidators, consultants, estate agents, valuers, surveyors, sequestrators, lawyer's etc. Those quick fire Rofewoper tranches earned the platform over £200k in set up fees, whereas lenders have received next to nothing from them. It does appear though, a hell of a lot of work was done by Ablrate over those few months. Yes, when the last Weproofer, 165, was drawn down, Ablrate took 10% of our cash, or £50,000 for allowing the borrower to draw it down on the day on which they missed their first repayment of a Weproofer tranche. Does not look good.
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Post by muttley916 on Dec 9, 2021 18:08:04 GMT
165 is an absolute disgrace.
Both parties gained from our money and not one word has been said about it.
Disgusting behaviour from all involved.
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GreenZero
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The early bird may get the worm, but it's the second mouse who gets the cheese
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Post by GreenZero on Dec 9, 2021 18:33:05 GMT
I can't help thinking those quick fire Rofewoper tranches highlighted by criston were taken out with the knowledge of what was on the horizon. The question is were abl aware and if not why not. We've been played, simple as that. |
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Dec 9, 2021 18:46:22 GMT
I think blind sided or complicit is irrelevant, neither would be in any way acceptable.
What would be useful is if people could agree what to call 4 power. The offerings to date are more confusing than helpful
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criston
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Post by criston on Dec 9, 2021 18:54:16 GMT
4close
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Dec 9, 2021 21:08:01 GMT
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Post by Ace on Dec 9, 2021 21:09:23 GMT
Fore-ower?
Edit: They've taken the P.
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Post by df on Dec 9, 2021 23:20:15 GMT
Any other platform would have seen a host of vultures with inflated charges up to £1000 per hour, with their hours stretched to the point where they were working more than 24 hours a day (but as the hours are for a number of separate liquidations, no one can really check it properly). Administrators, liquidators, consultants, estate agents, valuers, surveyors, sequestrators, lawyer's etc. Those quick fire Rofewoper tranches earned the platform over £200k in set up fees, whereas lenders have received next to nothing from them. It does appear though, a hell of a lot of work was done by Ablrate over those few months. I have to admit, at some point I've stopped reading "fees" part of documents, so might be out of date, but the highest I recall was somewhere around £600 - don't give them an idea of increasing it to 1k or stretching the day to 33h:) But I guess it doesn't really matter for us, they can stretch the length of the process until there's no funds left. I hope ABL will somehow survive the Fewoperro crisis and won't get into administration. I'd rather see AF's postponed/freezed/capitalised interest/repayment holidays/etc than see all my investments being used to feed the vultures.
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