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Post by webbski9 on Dec 5, 2021 0:56:23 GMT
Fellow sufferers, sorry to be a Dummy,but I can't find the update on the F****** Loans .I understand its the Docs section but which one is it please ? Thanks in advance
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markyg61
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Post by markyg61 on Dec 5, 2021 7:49:42 GMT
It'll be the one that starts "202112...."
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KoR_Wraith
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Post by KoR_Wraith on Dec 5, 2021 9:22:54 GMT
As far as I am concerned the update is a complete negative disaster. At least if there had been some actual additional security I might have been slightly reassured. I’m now exiting ABLrate completely. Have seen this story too many times in P2P already. Completely understand what you're feeling and I was tempted to take the same action. However, upon reviewing my tradable holdings, the underlying risk profile for many of my loans is extremely favourable even in default. Whilst the primary deficiency in Lendy/FS (and to a much lesser degree MT) was completely unrealistic valuations of development projects, I don't feel this to be the case with Ablrate (at least not with the loans I've selected). Additionally, Lendy & FS had massive corporate governance issues and outright fraud at the highest levels. Call me foolish but I trust Ablrate not to be tarred by that particular brush.
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GreenZero
Member of DD Central
The early bird may get the worm, but it's the second mouse who gets the cheese
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Post by GreenZero on Dec 5, 2021 9:50:59 GMT
Additionally, Lendy & FS had massive corporate governance issues and outright fraud at the highest levels. Call me foolish but I trust Ablrate not to be tarred by that particular brush. And so did I, until I observed a few things happen. 1. Loan 94, DD didn't pick up on the incorrect air operator’s licence causing Bulgarian authorities to ground the aircraft and then the loan defaulted back in April 2019. Then, in reality, 3/5ths of F*@# all has been done with the two rusting aircraft to recover the debt. 2. abl started to receive part ownership in companies who were in default - to whose benefit? 3. Loan 165 - say no more 4. ASMX – whilst working on introducing the love child that is ASMX, they seemed to take their eye off theit main business and then the mentionof the introduction of a future charge for secondary market trades. I was not involved in the container loan, so can't comment. So yes, I used to trust abl 100%, however, after experiencing the above it has slipped and their communication or lack thereof is not helping.
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criston
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Post by criston on Dec 5, 2021 10:06:44 GMT
Ablrate should have undertaken a market test of the Rofewoper assets as they stand, without future development, to assure us that 75% of the assets & existing securities would be in excess of the £5.7m owed to lenders, rather than a valuation when the development is completed.
The extra security using the excess of 25% on 111 & 50% on 113 over & above the current security, has been used to offset the security of the remaining loans.
I am unsure whether to be positive or negative as it currently stands.
Hope for a more positive outcome on the Bellweing loans; and the others.
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Post by webbski9 on Dec 5, 2021 11:13:40 GMT
Thank you gentlemen,I have found said updates.All I would add is that F*******r is at least in one of the best sectors which is attracting investment from the institutions .However,I do agree that ABLRATE most definately took their eyes off the prize(s) when "bigging up" the exchange.And what has happened to the main man's video updates??? Communication in todays World is key and,as far as Ablrate is concerned ,is sadly lacking.
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blender
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Post by blender on Dec 5, 2021 13:07:10 GMT
I am two thirds in the holiday park and one third in the batteries and so I am really waiting for the holiday park before saying much. However: I am surprised that people do not seem to remember the number one rule of Ablrate communications, that you must at least double the timescale of positive predictions to convert from Ablrate days to Earth days. So when they say a three month holiday you know it is going to be at least six. Another three months predicted is worrying. I take some comfort from the fact that the whole of this recovery endeavour suggests that Ablrate believes the underlying businesses to be viable, including repayments, and that the issue is one of finance only. So they have not at this stage defaulted the loans, they insist on the management running the business rather than the financing, they take most of the business hostage as presumably valuable security, and they focus on repayments from the business rather than going straight to the guarantor to produce cash or assets at this stage. The guarantee is still there on these loans and, unlike the AC loans, there will still be the opportunity to obtain the pound of flesh if we need to - which I hope we do not. Also this strategy of supporting the borrowers allows the interest to be capitalised and the loans, in due course, to be traded. Personally I would prefer to rely on exit via trading rather than forcing this to asset sales and having to make do with what the vultures have left. AF's main error, with hindsight, was to rely on Greenswill, and he is in good company. I am sore with Abl about 165, but I am sure that Abl and AF will be keen to set things right, or as right as can be achieved. If we shoot Ablrate we are all stuffed. This is not Funding Suckers. Having said that, I might explode when I hear more about the holiday park loans.
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hazellend
Member of DD Central
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Post by hazellend on Dec 5, 2021 13:30:07 GMT
I am two thirds in the holiday park and one third in the batteries and so I am really waiting for the holiday park before saying much. However: I am surprised that people do not seem to remember the number one rule of Ablrate communications, that you must at least double the timescale of positive predictions to convert from Ablrate days to Earth days. So when they say a three month holiday you know it is going to be at least six. Another three months predicted is worrying. I take some comfort from the fact that the whole of this recovery endeavour suggests that Ablrate believes the underlying businesses to be viable, including repayments, and that the issue is one of finance only. So they have not at this stage defaulted the loans, they insist on the management running the business rather than the financing, they take most of the business hostage as presumably valuable security, and they focus on repayments from the business rather than going straight to the guarantor to produce cash or assets at this stage. The guarantee is still there on these loans and, unlike the AC loans, there will still be the opportunity to obtain the pound of flesh if we need to - which I hope we do not. Also this strategy of supporting the borrowers allows the interest to be capitalised and the loans, in due course, to be traded. Personally I would prefer to rely on exit via trading rather than forcing this to asset sales and having to make do with what the vultures have left. AF's main error, with hindsight, was to rely on Greenswill, and he is in good company. I am sore with Abl about 165, but I am sure that Abl and AF will be keen to set things right, or as right as can be achieved. If we shoot Ablrate we are all stuffed. This is not Funding Suckers. Having said that, I might explode when I hear more about the holiday park loans. Why would any company finance a business that has needed 6 months of default forgiveness?
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Post by overthehill on Dec 5, 2021 18:58:11 GMT
How does interest capitalization work for the lender ? When they add the accrued interest to the outstanding loan capital, does each lender's stake in the loan increase by the same percentage ?
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Post by Ace on Dec 5, 2021 19:39:09 GMT
How does interest capitalization work for the lender ? When they add the accrued interest to the outstanding loan capital, does each lender's stake in the loan increase by the same percentage ?
Yes. E.g. if 5% interest is owing, each lender's outstanding capital increases by 5%.
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blueblazer
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Post by blueblazer on Dec 6, 2021 16:32:46 GMT
Must admit, along with many others on here, to being very disappointed with the progress and responses so far.
Possibily, hopefully even, the 'security' thing is useful in the long term but can't help but feel that, in the short term, any kind of token repayment would have inspired much more belief and trust that anything that has been done so far.
Still hopeful that this loan and the other AF loans can somehow recover but then as Greg Lake sang 'I believe in Father Christmas' and there aren't any disguises to see through.
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Post by overthehill on Dec 6, 2021 17:38:54 GMT
Capitalizing interest condemns the loans to large discounts for the foreseeable future so exit is not going to be a realistic option for a lot of people.
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Post by df on Dec 6, 2021 18:33:58 GMT
Capitalizing interest condemns the loans to large discounts for the foreseeable future so exit is not going to be a realistic option for a lot of people. Yes, when (if they ever do) AF loans rejoin ASMX they will be offered at a substantial discount. I don't think I will be purchasing...
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Post by df on Dec 6, 2021 19:27:38 GMT
Must admit, along with many others on here, to being very disappointed with the progress and responses so far.
Possibily, hopefully even, the 'security' thing is useful in the long term but can't help but feel that, in the short term, any kind of token repayment would have inspired much more belief and trust that anything that has been done so far.
Still hopeful that this loan and the other AF loans can somehow recover but then as Greg Lake sang 'I believe in Father Christmas' and there aren't any disguises to see through.
I liked his work with King Crimson and ELP, so this song was a disappointment for me, but I understand that number two Xmas is much more profitable. I sympathise with the "token payment" sentiment, but I don't think one off repayment would have much of an impact on the overall lenders' behaviour.
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groon
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Post by groon on Dec 7, 2021 11:26:25 GMT
Greg Lake sang 'I believe in Father Christmas'
He also sang 'Epitaph'
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