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Post by p2pfn1 on Nov 24, 2022 13:23:33 GMT
Hi everyone, long time lurker, first time poster. I'm writing a feature on retail investors for Peer2Peer Finance News and I want to hear from you about your experience as a retail investor. In the 6 years I've been reporting on P2P, I've noticed a real shift in the investor demographic - there are obviously a lot more institutions now involved, and UHNWIs. Is it becoming harder to be a retail investor? Do you think platforms still value their retail base? I'm keen to hear any and every opinion on the retail market!
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Post by df on Nov 24, 2022 19:17:06 GMT
Hi everyone, long time lurker, first time poster. I'm writing a feature on retail investors for Peer2Peer Finance News and I want to hear from you about your experience as a retail investor. In the 6 years I've been reporting on P2P, I've noticed a real shift in the investor demographic - there are obviously a lot more institutions now involved, and UHNWIs. Is it becoming harder to be a retail investor? Do you think platforms still value their retail base? I'm keen to hear any and every opinion on the retail market! The market has shrunk so is my p2p investment. It's easier because my current portfolio requires very little management comparing to how it was some years ago. I think most of functioning platforms still value retail base. Those who don't, have already changed direction or ceased.
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Post by Ace on Nov 24, 2022 20:14:00 GMT
Is it becoming harder to be a retail investor?
No, not for me. There's a large number of platforms that have proven themselves, especially in the property secured market, to cover a very wide range of risk appetite. If anything I'm finding it easier to keep fully invested now than I did a year ago. I'm still increasing my portfolio through any organic growth that I don't need to use for income.
Do you think platforms still value their retail base?
I'm not sure. They will all say that they do, why wouldn't they? It seems that many use retail customers to get started and prove their offering then switch to paying more attention to UHNW or institutions once they become interested. Many drop retail lenders altogether once they can cope without them. Makes business sense I guess. Whether that's their intention from the start, I have no idea. There still seems to be plenty of platforms willing to use retail funding to allow lenders to have sufficient choice and diversification.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Nov 24, 2022 20:57:59 GMT
First question - what do you mean by P2P? Platforms with the specific regulatory permission or the wider altfi loan crowdfunding sector.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Nov 25, 2022 11:49:16 GMT
My retail investor experience hasn’t been fantastic, I wonder what’s the experience as UHNW and Institutional Investors?
I read one outcome statement 22 from a platform targeted to non retail investors, actual defaults rate is over 25%! 😅
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zlb
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Post by zlb on Nov 25, 2022 12:10:04 GMT
Break-even by diversifying across platforms but that's not the point is it. Shame is, it could be an fun / interesting challenge which should bring reward for work. The failure point I can see is personalities and who is running the company - which you don't get to find out until it's too late ... If it weren't for Lendy, I'd say it was OK - thankfully didn't enter into similar others. FCA interim accreditation extremely misleading to retail investors.
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billt
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Post by billt on Nov 25, 2022 12:15:38 GMT
I agree with Ace,
Is it becoming harder to be a retail investor?
I find it easy to invest in what I consider to be sites that have proven themselves overtime but as we all know the past is no guarantee for the future.
Do you think platforms still value their retail base?
Business is business, they will all use us to suit their ends, although I do think that some individual players have more ethical standards than others, I am less analytical than many other investors and tend to rely on my gut instinct, this approach has backfired on some occasions (TC,HNW & AC) and worked on others (Proplend, Loanpad, Crowd Property) Overall my experience has been positive but it has been along learning curve (10 years).
On a separate note it takes years to reduce your investment to zero in any one site, it is only then that you know the true picture,
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sqh
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Before P2P, savers put a guinea in a piggy bank, now they smash the banks to become guinea pigs.
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Post by sqh on Nov 25, 2022 23:50:45 GMT
I've invested in several P2P platforms since 2014. At first, it felt like a niche marketplace and was producing returns of over 10%. There was a huge surge in lending in 2016-18 which seemed to coincide with FCA regulation which went hand in hand with IFISA approval.
It has become clear that retail investors were lured into believing that P2P lending was properly regulated by the FCA, this proved to be false. The FCA warnings implied that the risks of P2P lending were dependent on each individual loan. By spreading lending across hundreds of loans the losses on loans that failed would be covered by the good loans.
What actually transpired is that the platforms are the weak point and the costs of recovering a loan book are high. This is because the rules of a company in administration don't work well for P2P platforms. This was an FCA oversight which has severely affected my view of the P2P market. The FCA still fails to recognise its failings and therefore my investor sentiment has been severely dented. I don't see a recovery until the FCA compensates the costs of platform failure and their failure to regulate platforms properly. The first step should be to insure lenders against the costs of platform failure. Instead the FCA are trying to shirk their responsibilities to retail lenders. I don't think the P2P industry will recover, and I don't think the FCA, banks or government want it to thrive.
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11025
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Post by 11025 on Nov 26, 2022 10:06:44 GMT
Agreed.
So it appears the whole setup of P2P secured lending and potential failure / wind-down is fraught with tension and contradictions , not really something that should have been pushed and heralded by government at the time and regulated by the FCA is it ?
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travolta
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Post by travolta on Nov 26, 2022 11:30:54 GMT
Mug.
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ozboy
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Mine's a Large One! (Snigger, snigger .......)
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Post by ozboy on Nov 26, 2022 17:39:48 GMT
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michaelc
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Say No To T.D.S.
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Post by michaelc on Nov 26, 2022 23:16:32 GMT
I started to invest waste my money in p2p around the start of 2017.
I thought much like stocks and shares etc the platform itself, so long as FCA regulated, was very safe. As with stocks/shares/funds/etc I knew the individual loans were very risky and I was prepared for that. I wasn't prepared for the platforms themselves going under and I lost a fair amount of money when three platforms I was invested did so.
I am not super rich and this cash was the result of a lifetime of savings.
The experience has made me question the UK financial system. Are stockbrokers safe? Are banks safe? I honestly don't know anymore. My previous view was that anything properly authorised by the FCA should be pretty safe. But three FCA regulated platforms going under? I now keep most of my savings abroad as I can't trust the UK system anymore.
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daveb
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Post by daveb on Nov 28, 2022 20:49:57 GMT
I've dabbled in 8 sites 3 I got out of after varying times with decent returns, certainly better than building societies were offering.
2 are still going (sort of) and the interest I've received is about the same as the price of the rather troubled loans left on the platform. If there's anything better than a total loss, I'll do about as well as a building society. 3 platforms failed and what money I have left in them may very well be swallowed up in fees. The losses will more than undermine the gains on the first set of platforms.
Overall I wish I had never heard of P2P
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Post by Harland Kearney on Nov 28, 2022 21:38:52 GMT
Have found almost all platforms too high risk for the return due to overwhelming platform risk as opposed to say a mutual fund on the stock market though HL (Or a REIT for example)
However, Loanpad is my only P2P holding & has been a very welcome diversification holding. For many reasons which have been posted on the Loan Pad section, it stands out from the rest. Both in returns to the risk and more importantly in history during the COVID crisis. The only platform of its type to not enter into liquidity limitations as of current. P2P has a place in a portfilio but only one platform I am willing to stake that exposure in, sad really.
I have always avoided individal loan selection like on Lendy. Not worth the time, effort or risk. I view P2P has as a place to move money I want to invest for a few months to then deploy into stocks/or other investments. Therefore blackbox accounts are prefereble for this goal. I use the term near-cash extremely loosely & disagree ppl who use that term on access accounts. More like notice access with sigfincatly more risk. Cash drag is cash drag. (Although I was involved there but exited before it ** hit the fan for good)
I also touched funding secure & got out again, before *** hit the fan. Seem to have a nat for that, I'll tell you all if I ever exit Loanpad!
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