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Post by mostlywrong on Jun 11, 2024 11:50:09 GMT
One thing that intrigued me yesterday was "an expert" on BBC the world at one saying the move right in Europe is being driven by younger voters, whereas we have exactly the opposite here. I don't have a smartphone and my only access to social media is this board, so my "news" comes from broadsheets and several TV and radio channels.
I accept that gives me a "strange" view of the world but I will live with that.
My 20-something, well educated, son lives on another planet. He has reluctantly moved home whilst he assesses his future.
His view of the country and that of the world comes from his smartphone and his mates, who appear to cover a fair portion of the world.
I am surprised to discover that he (and they) are not as dedicated to the left as I thought he would be. Very surprised.
Something is going on. Yet I cannot put my finger on it. But I will.
MW
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Post by bracknellboy on Jun 11, 2024 12:41:51 GMT
*I mean I know they completely re-defined the meaning of "oven ready" The problem is that there is only a small gap between 'oven ready' and 'half baked' You win the internet today
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 11, 2024 13:29:50 GMT
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Likes: 11,522
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 11, 2024 13:37:28 GMT
*I mean I know they completely re-defined the meaning of "oven ready" The problem is that there is only a small gap between 'oven ready' and 'half baked' Half baked must be the Labour policies ... every time the put them in the oven they take them out before they are ready. Seems plan to restore lifetime pension allowance cap is the latest to be removed
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Post by captainconfident on Jun 11, 2024 14:34:49 GMT
One thing that intrigued me yesterday was "an expert" on BBC the world at one saying the move right in Europe is being driven by younger voters, whereas we have exactly the opposite here. Our Flemish far right party has done well, but not quite as well as they thought they would. Statistically their vote is apparently made up from men, low education and young voters: Press your translate button. www.hln.be/binnenland/peiling-vooral-jonge-en-laagopgeleide-mensen-hebben-op-vlaams-belang-gestemd~a26394f6/My paper De Standard has an article "Its cool to vote hard right when you are young" yesterday made up of interviews.
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Post by bracknellboy on Jun 11, 2024 15:01:20 GMT
The problem is that there is only a small gap between 'oven ready' and 'half baked' Half baked must be the Labour policies ... every time the put them in the oven they take them out before they are ready. Seems plan to restore lifetime pension allowance cap is the latest to be removedYes, but it isn't that surprising I don't think. I read some good analysis a number of months ago about the prospects of LTA being restored. I had a particular interest as I was considering whether I should start taking at least one of my pensions/drawdown in anticipation of the LTA being restored. Their conclusion was that once you got into the details, it would be a nightmare to restore it once it had been removed. Interestingly, it wasn't just the Labour policy that was half baked. There were apparently so many pholes/problems in the legislation that HMRC (?) had been advising / suggesting that people don't take out pensions until they fixed the problems, the immediate opportunity for which has now gone because of parliamentary shutdown. So it seems like it was a half baked idea (or implementation), the revoking of which was also half baked, no doubt leaving us currently with soggy dough. Still, at least it isn't every parliamentary cycle where pensions are a political football..............
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Jun 11, 2024 15:18:41 GMT
I don’t think there’s a party willing to listen people and deliver what people want, or even try to deliver what people couldn’t imagine but succeeding leading the UK for a brighter future.
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toffeeboy
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Post by toffeeboy on Jun 11, 2024 15:58:11 GMT
Is it just me, or does this election feel like that the Parties, but particularly the Conservatives, are just making up policy on the hoof ? Depending on which way the wind is blowing on any given day. How on earth does the party in power which controls when it calls the GE, go into the campaigning period without an 'oven ready'* manifesto ? *I mean I know they completely re-defined the meaning of "oven ready" in an Orwellian double speak way, but I'm on a one person campaign to revert it's meaning to that which was once commonly accepted. I think the problem is that with it being obvious that it will be a labour majority the Tories are fighting to save as much as they can but they know they won't be in power so won't have to follow through on anything they promise so can jsut say anything to please the most people they can. As for LAbour I am not sure, maybe it is going to their heads and they think they can promise anything, surprised they are not being more safe with their manifesto knowing that they are going to walk it. I'll be honest if I was still in the UK I doubt I would vote as I wouldn't trust any of them to do anything, none of them have strong leaders in my view who could lead the UK in any direction
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michaelc
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Say No To T.D.S.
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Post by michaelc on Jun 11, 2024 16:16:20 GMT
But tell me if Farage is "extreme right" where does Nick Griffin sit on that scale? The scale measures the normal socially-acceptable political spectrum. Overt racism is not part of that. Unfortunately, the covert racism of Farridge et al is. What? Overt racism and/or fascism isn't measured on the scale? When did that happen? Extreme Right has _always_ meant the likes of Hitler, Griffin etc .
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angrysaveruk
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Say No To T.D.S
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Post by angrysaveruk on Jun 11, 2024 16:55:42 GMT
The scale measures the normal socially-acceptable political spectrum. Overt racism is not part of that. Unfortunately, the covert racism of Farridge et al is. What? Overt racism and/or fascism isn't measured on the scale? When did that happen? Extreme Right has _always_ meant the likes of Hitler, Griffin etc . Farage is basically a moderate Thatcherite (he would be a centrist if he was in the Thatcher government). He is certainly to the left of Le Pen, Meloni and Trump*. * - Who has recently suggested he has detailed plans for a US army invasion of Mexico to dismantle the Cartels** ** - I have a pretty good idea where these plans came from
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Post by overthehill on Jun 11, 2024 19:16:09 GMT
Is it just me, or does this election feel like that the Parties, but particularly the Conservatives, are just making up policy on the hoof ? Depending on which way the wind is blowing on any given day. How on earth does the party in power which controls when it calls the GE, go into the campaigning period without an 'oven ready'* manifesto ? *I mean I know they completely re-defined the meaning of "oven ready" in an Orwellian double speak way, but I'm on a one person campaign to revert it's meaning to that which was once commonly accepted. I think the problem is that with it being obvious that it will be a labour majority the Tories are fighting to save as much as they can but they know they won't be in power so won't have to follow through on anything they promise so can jsut say anything to please the most people they can. As for LAbour I am not sure, maybe it is going to their heads and they think they can promise anything, surprised they are not being more safe with their manifesto knowing that they are going to walk it. I'll be honest if I was still in the UK I doubt I would vote as I wouldn't trust any of them to do anything, none of them have strong leaders in my view who could lead the UK in any direction
Politics used to be full of talent and integrity and character but now there is just a vacuum sucking in the self-interested, untrustworthy and dim witted (many get into the cabinet).
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mogish
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Post by mogish on Jun 12, 2024 7:26:23 GMT
It's a sad state of affairs when people are so dissalutioned that they feel it's not with voting.
The quality of potential leaders is so poor I'm not surprised folk have given up.
Liars, broken promises , failure to deliver and full of bs,
I've just had an e mail asking if I want to perform presiding officer duties at the polling in July. I'm seriously considering not doing it for the first time in years.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jun 12, 2024 8:16:29 GMT
It's a sad state of affairs when people are so dissalutioned that they feel it's not with voting. It's one reason why we need to remind people regularly that their vote counts for one thing, and one thing only. Which of those named individuals they want as their MP. I can't believe anybody can look at their local candidate list and not find at least one they find least objectionable. If people started to think that way, then we might get strong local candidates with local interests at heart, instead of party placemen. We might break the party duopoly, and start to have collaborative governments instead of simple tribal shouting-down. Meanwhile, in other news, it turns out our local RefUK candidate is not only anti-immigration, of course, but also proudly boasts of having lived in another country for years. Rank hypocrisy, or just simply logical disconnect?
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Post by bracknellboy on Jun 12, 2024 8:55:46 GMT
It's a sad state of affairs when people are so dissalutioned that they feel it's not with voting. It's one reason why we need to remind people regularly that their vote counts for one thing, and one thing only. Which of those named individuals they want as their MP. I can't believe anybody can look at their local candidate list and not find at least one they find least objectionable. If people started to think that way, then we might get strong local candidates with local interests at heart, instead of party placemen. We might break the party duopoly, and start to have collaborative governments instead of simple tribal shouting-down. Meanwhile, in other news, it turns out our local RefUK candidate is not only anti-immigration, of course, but also proudly boasts of having lived in another country for years. Rank hypocrisy, or just simply logical disconnect? making an individuals vote count will only happen if some form of proportional representation - in one of its varied forms, potentially mixed with constituency rep etc - comes into play. Until then, the majority people, or at least a very large minority, are essentially disenfranchised at MOST elections. This one has the potential to be less so than others, as many formerly safe seats become unsafe.
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iRobot
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Post by iRobot on Jun 12, 2024 8:56:23 GMT
It's one reason why we need to remind people regularly that their vote counts for one thing, and one thing only. Which of those named individuals they want as their MP. I can't believe anybody can look at their local candidate list and not find at least one they find least objectionable. If people started to think that way, then we might get strong local candidates with local interests at heart, instead of party placemen. We might break the party duopoly, and start to have collaborative governments instead of simple tribal shouting-down. Absolutely agree. And, to add, not voting or a spoiled paper achieves very, very little. Far better, imo, to vote for an independent than to either spoil your paper or, worse, vote 'tactically for the "other" party' and get your point across that way. There are good political candidates out there and it's because they have no desire to affiliate themselves with atrocious track records, lacklustre policies and frankly appalling reputations and associated goings-on of the 'main' parties that they choose to be independent. Hopefully, the independents will pick up enough of the vote to a) make the media and main parties take notice and b) not to lose their deposit and encourage them continue getting their point across that there isn't a mainstay party in which the majority of the public has confidence. But I would urge everyone to cast a vote. Apathy is exactly what these self-serving, pseudo-politicians need to keep their snouts entrenched in the trough of tax-payer-funded government (as well as the commercial and corporate 'side-benefits', which are of course the main reason the majority are in politics as a career.) Maybe this 'Independence Day' election will become known as the 'Day of the Independents'...
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