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Post by bracknellboy on May 14, 2023 17:51:19 GMT
Here's hoping, with fingers crossed, that the ballot boxes have Erdogan losing, and that Kemal Kilicdaroglu gets >50% in the 1st round.
Turkey has been a democracy on an increasing march to an autocracy for far too long, and I fear that this may be the last chance to stop that becoming a full and final step for many years.
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rscal
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Post by rscal on May 14, 2023 18:33:36 GMT
Here's hoping, with fingers crossed, that the ballot boxes have Erdogan losing, and that Kemal Kilicdaroglu gets >50% in the 1st round. Turkey has been a democracy on an increasing march to an autocracy for far too long, and I fear that this may be the last chance to stop that becoming a full and final step for many years. Why? Relatives in Turkey? It's a sovereign process.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 14, 2023 19:06:44 GMT
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on May 14, 2023 19:17:30 GMT
All I care about is the new president's attitude to the Ukraine war. Erdogan has been pretty good on that front I would say.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on May 14, 2023 19:27:22 GMT
Better the devil you know?
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 14, 2023 19:28:04 GMT
All I care about is the new president's attitude to the Ukraine war. Erdogan has been pretty good on that front I would say. Shame about Syria and the Kurds.
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on May 14, 2023 19:40:21 GMT
All I care about is the new president's attitude to the Ukraine war. Erdogan has been pretty good on that front I would say. Shame about Syria and the Kurds. Do you have a deep understanding of the region? That is what it would take to form a sensible view. I think you just don't like his hardman image partially cultivated by the news outlets you likely watch.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 14, 2023 19:56:16 GMT
For "hardman image", read "corrupt authoritarian verging on dictator".
And, no, I don't like those much. Do you?
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Post by bracknellboy on May 14, 2023 20:22:47 GMT
All I care about is the new president's attitude to the Ukraine war. Erdogan has been pretty good on that front I would say.I struggle to see how that statement aligns with reality. The support they have given has been balanced by the support they have not given (economic sanctions wise). . Erdogan considers Putin to be friend and fellow traveller. Which is not really surprising, as he has been taking a similar road to ultimate autocracy as Putin took. Gradually capturing the various separate powers of state so they are no longer separate. Erodgan's actions have been ambivalent and there is a strong element of trying to play both sides to his own advantage.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on May 15, 2023 6:05:53 GMT
At least Turkey has a general election, the PMs invited to the Coronation Ceremony, a number of them are not really elected.
The debate for the next General election in the UK, would you vote for someone so that conversative party will lose or someone competent for the MP post?
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 15, 2023 7:36:24 GMT
At least Turkey has a general election ...even if there are already allegations of shenanigans in many polling stations in opposition-supporting areas. Plus, of course, almost all their media is controlled by Erdogan. <considers average current Tory MP> Sorry, was that a choice or just a restatement of the same thing?
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james100
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Post by james100 on May 15, 2023 9:33:59 GMT
A brief note on Erdogan's definition of democracy:
In the last GE, Erdogan's party did deals with remote villagers for the village "leader" to collect ballot papers and if the AKP got enough votes they would provide the village with a big fridge or freezer. After the attempted military coup of 2016, if was commonplace - on request of the AKP - for people to report neighbours they didn't like on suspicion of being "anti-Erdogan dissidents" which, under national emergency "anti-terrorism" legislation got them taken away for questioning and frequently stripped, whipped and imprisoned for an arbitrary period of time. People were encouraged to report those who did not participate in pro-Erdogan marches in the immediate aftermath of the coup...everyone got text messages via the emergency alert service telling them to take to the streets to "defend their country" and that all public transport system gates were lifted, i.e. free of charge for this explicit purpose. A common feature of the marches were fire sticks...these were very long, thick loo rolls containing a fuel source. I myself held one, briefly, as I was accosted on leaving Marks & Spencers after an underwear shopping trip. Having recently had prison vans rounding up teachers and lawyers in my part of town, it was an ironic miracle that I didn't wet my pants. But it was a close thing!
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keitha
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2024, hopefully the year I get out of P2P
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Post by keitha on May 15, 2023 9:37:02 GMT
At least Turkey has a general election, the PMs invited to the Coronation Ceremony, a number of them are not really elected. The debate for the next General election in the UK, would you vote for someone so that conversative party will lose or someone competent for the MP post? Looks like Erdogan will win the Parliament, Surprised no-one has mentioned the Thai election, now that's a garbage system, 2 houses but the 250 members of the senate are military appointments, so to force their PM through the opposition need about 375 MPs to beat the 125 military supporting and the 250 members of the senate, all of whom will vote for the military approved candidate.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on May 15, 2023 9:41:17 GMT
Forgot to mention I did not check the election result when I posted my previous post. I care more about the UK voters can do better in the future election.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on May 15, 2023 10:08:11 GMT
According to the Economist Erogan got 32 hours of coverage on state owned TV last month. Kilicdaroglu got 32 minutes.
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