ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 11,329 
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Post by ilmoro on Aug 30, 2023 13:23:24 GMT
Quote: 'My daughter was disappointed but what’s made it easier is everyone is in the same situation.' Are they on earth I wonder? Well yes. Pretty sure that was the problem Clear example of levelling down, rich or poor didnt matter, noone was going up 
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 11,329
Likes: 11,544
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Post by ilmoro on Aug 30, 2023 13:25:25 GMT
Flying should just be for birds and the military  And pigs ... who be on the wing the day that statement holds true
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mogish
Member of DD Central
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Post by mogish on Aug 30, 2023 15:08:30 GMT
Mr o'Leary has a good dig at Nats.
Always an opportunity for publicity😁
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benaj
Member of DD Central
N/A
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Post by benaj on Aug 30, 2023 15:16:24 GMT
IATA estimates $126 million cost to airlines and NATS claimed the glitch has been fixed and won't happen again. Does it mean the system is still not bullet proof and there could be more unknown attack in the future?
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Nomad
Member of DD Central
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Post by Nomad on Aug 30, 2023 15:33:08 GMT
Mr o'Leary has a good dig at Nats. Always an opportunity for publicity😁 But so frustrating to have his incredibly efficient operation screwed up by the incompetence of others...
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adrianc
Member of DD Central
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Post by adrianc on Aug 30, 2023 15:37:09 GMT
NATS claimed the glitch has been fixed and won't happen again. Well, that's a VERY quick bugfix. I'm sure it's been VERY thoroughly tested, and ABSOLUTELY won't have the slightest scope for introducing any other issues... <gibber>
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mogish
Member of DD Central
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Post by mogish on Aug 31, 2023 6:47:27 GMT
Mr o'Leary has a good dig at Nats. Always an opportunity for publicity😁 But so frustrating to have his incredibly efficient operation screwed up by the incompetence of others... Indeed. Ryanair keep costs low by their efficiency, shame other companies dont have business plans in place to avoid these situations.
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adrianc
Member of DD Central
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Post by adrianc on Aug 31, 2023 8:38:55 GMT
But so frustrating to have his incredibly efficient operation screwed up by the incompetence of others... Indeed. Ryanair keep costs low by their efficiency, That very "efficiency" (= short turn-round, high utilisation) is what exacerbates the knock-on effects from problems, though, since it means that there's more flights disrupted by planes and crews not being where they should be, and less opportunity to put things right. When UK airspace is closed, to all intents and purposes, for most of one of the busiest flying days of the year - how do you suggest a business plan avoids it, except by simply cancelling flights to/through UK airspace?
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mogish
Member of DD Central
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Post by mogish on Aug 31, 2023 9:19:15 GMT
Indeed. Ryanair keep costs low by their efficiency, That very "efficiency" (= short turn-round, high utilisation) is what exacerbates the knock-on effects from problems, though, since it means that there's more flights disrupted by planes and crews not being where they should be, and less opportunity to put things right. When UK airspace is closed, to all intents and purposes, for most of one of the busiest flying days of the year - how do you suggest a business plan avoids it, except by simply cancelling flights to/through UK airspace? Adrian. I was generalising. I had the misfortune to wait in a packed baggage hall in Geneva a few years back. The reason was lack of baggage handlers to move masses of ski equipment. My point is that companies should have back up ans in ace to deal with foreseeable events. In the case of Nats perhaps back up servers or something? Not sure of the technical details. Surely airlines pay airports* (and controllers) to ensure air side operations match the demands of the customers? Ie airlines scheduled?
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agent69
Member of DD Central
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Post by agent69 on Aug 31, 2023 10:25:09 GMT
Adrian. I was generalising. I had the misfortune to wait in a packed baggage hall in Geneva a few years back. The reason was lack of baggage handlers to move masses of ski equipment. My point is that companies should have back up ans in ace to deal with foreseeable events. In the case of Nats perhaps back up servers or something? Not sure of the technical details. Surely airlines pay airports* (and controllers) to ensure air side operations match the demands of the customers? Ie airlines scheduled?It depends which airport they use
Historically some EU authorities paid Ryanair to fly to their airports, as Ryanair guaranteed to deliver a minimum number of passengers to spend money in the local economy. At the other end of the spectrum landing and take off slots at heathrow are so rare that airlines have to plan their services around their allocated slot time.
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mogish
Member of DD Central
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Post by mogish on Aug 31, 2023 10:51:18 GMT
Ryanair, easyjet or whoever, mr o'Leary never misses a chance to get free publicity. He ain't squeaky clean himself.
Ultimately the paying passengers get screwed over and left inconvenienced and out of pocket.
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Post by bracknellboy on Aug 31, 2023 10:55:32 GMT
Ryanair, easyjet or whoever, mr o'Leary never misses a chance to get free publicity. He ain't squeaky clean himself. Ultimately the paying passengers get screwed over and left inconvenienced and out of pocket.
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adrianc
Member of DD Central
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Post by adrianc on Aug 31, 2023 12:40:38 GMT
In the case of Nats perhaps back up servers or something? They had backup servers. In the case of a hardware failure, the backup servers would have done the job just fine. Trouble is, the backups were running the same software - so when the software couldn't cope with a rogue input, and shut down... guess what the backups did?
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Post by bracknellboy on Aug 31, 2023 13:06:21 GMT
In the case of Nats perhaps back up servers or something? They had backup servers. In the case of a hardware failure, the backup servers would have done the job just fine. Trouble is, the backups were running the same software - so when the software couldn't cope with a rogue input, and shut down... guess what the backups did? the oft overlooked problem with hot standby systems.....if you provide for perfect seamless switch over with no loss of data, including input, then in the event the root cause of failure is software not hardware this happens.....
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keitha
Member of DD Central
2024, hopefully the year I get out of P2P
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Post by keitha on Aug 31, 2023 13:09:11 GMT
Adrian. I was generalising. I had the misfortune to wait in a packed baggage hall in Geneva a few years back. The reason was lack of baggage handlers to move masses of ski equipment. My point is that companies should have back up ans in ace to deal with foreseeable events. In the case of Nats perhaps back up servers or something? Not sure of the technical details. Surely airlines pay airports* (and controllers) to ensure air side operations match the demands of the customers? Ie airlines scheduled?It depends which airport they use
Historically some EU authorities paid Ryanair to fly to their airports, as Ryanair guaranteed to deliver a minimum number of passengers to spend money in the local economy. At the other end of the spectrum landing and take off slots at Heathrow are so rare that airlines have to plan their services around their allocated slot time.
Another issue was and is pay, baggage handlers as big a racket as some of the other union practices. So baggage handlers in a small regional airport are paid as much as those in Manchester etc. but whereas in Manchester they would be handling 4 planes per hour those at for example Doncaster could be handling 4 flights per shift, I know someone who relocated from Manchester to Doncaster he said you'd get the stupidity that they would have a break planned after Flight 22 took off and before flight 23 landed. But if they knew 22 was late coming in they would still take the break at the given time even if the plane wasn't fully loaded delaying that flight, and if 23 was early they still took a full break leaving luggage sat on the plane. He says that sort of rigid rules would never be allowed in the big airports.
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