ramblin rose
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“Some people grumble that roses have thorns; I am grateful that thorns have roses.” — Alphonse Karr
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Post by ramblin rose on Feb 6, 2015 9:56:58 GMT
AH! SIMPLES. You called?
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star dust
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Post by star dust on Feb 6, 2015 10:33:31 GMT
Reading the linked message, there was no suggestion of legal issues. The reason given was that SS thought it would be confusing... I guess I may have read too much into it. To be fair to SS they have released loans in the evening before now, and when they did implement a bidding cap it certainly appeared to work reasonably well, but I’m not sure it extended the loan fill time by much. I am wondering whether there is a danger of a sledgehammer to crack a nut, and whether the nut even exists – only two people posting have actually said they missed out on either / or PBL23 and 24. I like the SS model and like ramblin rose, would not want to see it get mired in unnecessary complications.
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star dust
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Post by star dust on Feb 6, 2015 10:57:59 GMT
The scale of the nut then .
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Feb 6, 2015 10:58:20 GMT
star dust I too missed out on 23 & 24. However there were loan parts available at the time as people moved their money into the later loans and I invested in these. What we must remember is that SS will continue to attract more and more lenders because of their model of high rates, instant interest and simplicity. Throttling back investments, even for 24 hours is not what I or IMHO the majority of investors want. Yes I accept that we will miss out on certain loans at times but surely the way to please the majority of loyal SS investors is to increase the flow of the loans coming on stream. This of course should be done without increasing the risk. SS is one of the few platforms that appears to be listening to us and responds to criticism even when it isn't warranted. I say leave the system as it is. There's always going to be the odd loan here and there that lenders/investors miss out on with all platforms unless you are super glued to your PC 24/7 with idle lumps of cash sitting around. That's the nature of the P2P business. Just keep it simple as once a platform introduces levels of so called sophistication then everyone suffers in my book.
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Feb 6, 2015 11:23:27 GMT
bugs4me I agree KISS works all the time. (see you managed to get in the FS boat loan). Yes I did but missed out on the previous FS loan - wasn't around. That's how it goes in P2P land and I fully accept that.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 6, 2015 17:48:31 GMT
I am wondering whether there is a danger of a sledgehammer to crack a nut, and whether the nut even exists – only two people posting have actually said they missed out on either / or PBL23 and 24. I like the SS model and like ramblin rose, would not want to see it get mired in unnecessary complications. star dust: You can increase the size of the nut by a notch -- by the time I saw PBL023 and PBL024 they both were fully funded. That probably still doesn't make it big enough to require a sledgehammer, though. I wouldn't have thought that applying a bidding limit was a big complication, but others may so I'm not about to sulk if SS change nothing. But I would like them to think about it. And lest anyone think I'm arguing in favour of a limit because it would help me personally, I'll say that it probably wouldn't, because if the poll is representative then I'm a 'larger' investor. What we must remember is that SS will continue to attract more and more lenders because of their model of high rates, instant interest and simplicity. Throttling back investments, even for 24 hours is not what I or IMHO the majority of investors want. Yes I accept that we will miss out on certain loans at times but surely the way to please the majority of loyal SS investors is to increase the flow of the loans coming on stream. The real issue is balancing investors and borrowers. There should be no problem as long as both grow at similar rates. The issues arise when there's an imbalance. If a loan appears on the website and that results in a feeding frenzy that lasts a very few minutes before the loan is fully funded, then the result will be unhappy investors and IMHO Jaydee's suggestion of "what the majority of investors want" would not be the case. But an increased flow loans certainly would help that situation. I expect that what most investors would like is an active secondary market giving them the ability to buy parts of any loan they'd like whenever they have cash to spare -- and also to be able to sell parts of any loan they'd like whenever they wish to raise cash. At the moment, the former doesn't really exist at SS but the latter certainly does. There's always going to be the odd loan here and there that lenders/investors miss out on with all platforms unless you are super glued to your PC 24/7 with idle lumps of cash sitting around. That's the nature of the P2P business. Just keep it simple as once a platform introduces levels of so called sophistication then everyone suffers in my book. I don't think investors would be too worried about missing the odd loan or two. It's when they start missing out on most loans that the disappointment sets in. While I accept that you can't invest without having funds at the ready, I don't accept that it's necessary to be glued to the internet 24/7 on all platforms in order to invest. There are a number of platforms -- AC, Z, and RS immediately come to mind and I expect there are more -- where the investor deposits their money, specifies what they wish to invest in, and the platform makes the investments for them as opportunities arise. Making this possible could be considered a level of sophistication, but I'm not convinced that everyone on those platforms suffers as a result of its existence.
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Feb 6, 2015 18:25:49 GMT
mikes1531 - I don’t feel the comparisons with Z, RS and AC are relevant. In the case of Z (since the ending of the RP), you are effectively at the mercy of TGLA and the lending speed comes and goes. The level of control is zero whereas with RS you can set your own rate and the funds will either fly out the door or there may be a few days wait - all depends what level of return you require but at least there exists an element of control. With AC, you do need to keep funds within the platform and set your target(s). You may be lucky but acquiring a ‘slice of the action’ is very much down to an element of luck IMO - you need someone to be willing to sell. Both FS and SS have managed to introduce an IOU deposit system which does seem to work very well. Unfortunately AC have not managed to do so as according to their compliance team it would breach FCA regulations and obviously they must be guided in this area. I feel though that this may eventually work against them especially if the current loan famine continues. What I do not understand is I’m equally certain that any institutions involved and/or U/W’s do not have to physically deposit the funds until drawdown so obviously a type of IOU system is in place somewhere I would have thought. Also SS have introduced a SM which is something lacking with FS. Without an SM I think this will may have a detrimental effect on FS especially as their financial level of loans increases. The biggest threat though to the private lender/investor is the involvement of institutions. They are in a position to simply step in and sweep up a whole loan without the platform even bothering to list it in the first place. I know there have been assurances made by certain platforms but I suspect in many cases they would prefer to deal with just a few institutions funding their requirements rather than have the privateers floating around. I feel at least one platform has already adopted this approach - just a feeling on my part but all the evidence seems to point that way. Hopefully others won’t follow but it wouldn’t surprise me in the least.
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Grezza
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Post by Grezza on Feb 6, 2015 19:19:01 GMT
I'm just going to throw in a plea here, in case SS are intending to try one/some of the suggestions being thrown up at the moment. Whatever you do, PLEASE retain the simplicity. So now we know......SIMPLY A BIGGER SCRUM @ 18:00 on ??/??/ ? On your marks, get set.........!!!!
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 6, 2015 19:43:43 GMT
mikes1531 - I don’t feel the comparisons with Z, RS and AC are relevant. bugs4me: I don't disagree with any of your observations about the advantages/disadvantages/differences between the various platforms. But I was disagreeing with the statement that an investor had to be glued to the internet 24/7 in order to avoid missing loans on all platforms.
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ramblin rose
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“Some people grumble that roses have thorns; I am grateful that thorns have roses.” — Alphonse Karr
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Post by ramblin rose on Feb 6, 2015 19:44:48 GMT
I'm just going to throw in a plea here, in case SS are intending to try one/some of the suggestions being thrown up at the moment. Whatever you do, PLEASE retain the simplicity. So now we know......SIMPLY A BIGGER SCRUM @ 18:00 on ??/??/ ? On your marks, get set.........!!!! Hmm. Not sure I'm keen on that development - definitely will develop a scrum mentality. If it has to be this way (and I guess we'll just have to see how it goes), I'd suggest that varying the time might be best. Not everybody goes to work during the day time, not everyone who does work during the daytime will be home by 6pm etc, etc. Varying the start time on different loans might give more people more opportunities? Certainly having some notice will help many; I did OK under the existing system as I'm often around and keep a frequent eye out. If it works, it works, and if it doesn't then I guess they'll stop.
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Post by duncandive on Feb 6, 2015 19:50:44 GMT
Does any one else think that the 18:00 Scrum could result in rather a Big Crash....
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ramblin rose
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“Some people grumble that roses have thorns; I am grateful that thorns have roses.” — Alphonse Karr
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Post by ramblin rose on Feb 6, 2015 19:53:34 GMT
Does any one else think that the 18:00 Scrum could result in rather a Big Crash.... Well, the FS site no longer does that; web site ought to be able to cope without crashing. Whether the accounting will cope correctly with overpurchased loans is another matter - there is no sign that that problem has been resolved, and with so many trying to purchase at once something might give.
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Post by duncandive on Feb 6, 2015 20:00:34 GMT
Does any one else think that the 18:00 Scrum could result in rather a Big Crash.... Well, the FS site no longer does that; web site ought to be able to cope without crashing. Whether the accounting will cope correctly with overpurchased loans is another matter - there is no sign that that problem has been resolved, and with so many trying to purchase at once something might give. I guess it will just add to the excitement then... On another subject, it seems a rather large chunk of PBL015 just went on the SM... it was over £130,000.00
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star dust
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Post by star dust on Feb 6, 2015 20:02:39 GMT
I suspect it may affect the pattern of AM sales too, with more re-financiers starting to sell at the 24 hour notice point, or the morning to avoid losing a day's interest. Not sure if that would be a good / bad or indifferent change though, I have picked up AM loan parts when new ones go live, so I quite liked the concentrated time- frame, we shall see.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 6, 2015 20:08:20 GMT
Does any one else think that the 18:00 Scrum could result in rather a Big Crash.... Not necessarily. FS used to have a problem like that, but solved it when they redesigned their website and increased the bandwidth at their server end. Now, FS loans become available at the appointed time and nearly a hundred investors place bids within the first minute or so, seemingly without any problems. I see no reason why SS can't do as well. They might find their website is under-resourced the very first time, but their website provider ought to be able to sort that in a hurry. AFAIK, the principal problem savingstream have now is dealing with the last parts of a loan that are available, wherein it is possible for one person to buy the last bit and another person to buy it as well. I presume that's because the system doesn't update its database of available parts quickly enough to recognise that by the time of the second 'purchase' the part is no longer available. This issue has been around for a while, and I haven't a clue whether it persists because no attempt has been made to fix it, or whether any attempted fixes have not worked. Hopefully, SS will take this opportunity to organise an effective patch.
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