oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Dec 23, 2013 16:19:45 GMT
Two bids (£155,000 and £65,000) did for this one. The former tried at 09:27 this morning, and was rejected so was in pole position to rebid before the auction started in my opinion. So are they (and Assetz) in a hurry to drawdown and a private underwriter brought in to make sure its all done and dusted for tomorrow? If so, watch out for loan parts quite soon. A bit different from the recent bridging loan where we were rationed from the start. PS .... nothing to do with Goldclub .... didn't get a sniff  |
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Post by batchoy on Dec 23, 2013 16:21:40 GMT
Very strange. Two pre-bids at 09.28 for 155K and 156K rejected then the very first bid(!) at 16.00 for 155k again. How does this work, and how can smaller investors stand a chance ? The first two bids were underwriters' bids which went on about 6 hours before the auction and were obviously rejected as soon as investors got a chance to bid.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Dec 23, 2013 16:25:27 GMT
because I have a full print out of the CDM regulations on my desk which I refer to from time to time. Bet you've got a full set of GE700 tucked away under the bed in case you fancy some late night reading.
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Post by oldnick on Dec 23, 2013 16:44:45 GMT
Hopefully Andrew is warming his toes by a roaring fire, and his innards with some gluhwine.
Meanwhile, back at the ranch, an auction (four 'care homes') has gone through with many of the posted questions remaining unanswered. This clearly didn't bother the lenders who brought the auction to a successful conclusion in less than one minute: but how about it Assetz?
Was the lack of answers 'because it's Christmas and you can't get anything done then', in which case, why rush it through? Or was it that you now realize there are enough punters prepared to go in blind that it doesn't really matter if the questions are answered or not?
Whilst I hope this loan is repaid successfully, I wonder how long will it be before a loan slips through that doesn't work out as planned. Without more information, and the time to gather it, some of these auctions are going to turn into lotteries, and sooner or later Assetz's reputation, and their ability to extract our money from a messy situation, will be put to the test.
It puts me in mind of the maxim that was emblazoned on the wall of a flying club in which I mis-spent my youth -
"Superior pilots don't put themselves in situations that might require them to use their superior flying skills."
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Post by mrclondon on Dec 23, 2013 16:49:33 GMT
because I have a full print out of the CDM regulations on my desk which I refer to from time to time. Bet you've got a full set of GE700 tucked away under the bed in case you fancy some late night reading. Thats perhaps a bit extreme  but googling CDM prosecutions will help explain my unease ... especially when one of the links is titled "HSE prosecution of Developer for not appointing a CDM-C" (CDM-C = CDM Coordinator). The HSE will not be blind to the late filing of this development with them.
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Post by jackpease on Dec 23, 2013 17:35:07 GMT
>>>>>>>Whilst I hope this loan is repaid successfully, I wonder how long will it be before a loan slips through that doesn't work out as planned. Without more information, and the time to gather it, some of these auctions are going to turn into lotteries, and sooner or later Assetz's reputation, and their ability to extract our money from a messy situation, will be put to the test.
I too fear that Assetz vastly superior vetting (compared to FC, say) is lulling us into a false sense of security, as is the pent up demand. And if it goes wrong everyone will turn on Assetz as they are doing on FC.
I am enjoying these exciting and rewarding early days of Assetz, I hope to goodness Andrew and the team can make sure popularity doesn't spoil it!
Jack
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Dec 23, 2013 18:17:47 GMT
I suspect the reason people were willing to dive in while so many answers still were missing was the low LTV, which means the developer has a lot to lose if they make a mess of it, and Assetz have a lot of cushion if things go pear-shaped and they have to step in. But only when a borrower default occurs will we find out how good a loan's security really is. Made a point of getting home in time for this one. Put the kettle on and the next thing you know it's all gone. Complete fiasco. I actually managed to get to the website after the bidding opened and before the loan was completely funded -- but by the time I typed in my bid amount and hit Enter the remaining amount available had vanished.  A bit different from the recent bridging loan where we were rationed from the start. That very first bid of £155k does raise some questions, and I'd really like to hear what Assetz have to say about this. Did they not know there was going to be extreme interest in this opportunity? Was it just coincidence that the big bidder got in first? Or did they have some assistance from Assetz? In the announcement regarding how the Lender Panel would operate, Assetz said " For very small loans we may cap the holding of any one lender to ensure as many lenders as possible get a slice of the loan." It's clear from the context that the Stourbridge loan wouldn't qualify as "very small", but considering what happened today it also seems clear that some sort of rationing should have been imposed. I would even go so far as to suggest that the investor involved should be persuaded to make a goodly portion of their holding of this loan available on the aftermarket. As for rationing, I think Funding Secure have come up with what might be the ideal solution -- when rationing is appropriate, offers are limited to a small percentage of the total loan in order to give smaller lenders an opportunity to participate. The limit is removed 24 hours after the opportunity goes live, so the delay in the complete funding of a loan really is minimal. |
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Dec 23, 2013 18:26:11 GMT
Was it just coincidence that the big bidder got in first? Think we all know the answer to that one!
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Dec 23, 2013 18:46:47 GMT
Was it just coincidence that the big bidder got in first? Think we all know the answer to that one! We may have our suspicions, but we won't know until Assetz tell us. And what Assetz say -- or don't say -- on this issue may tell us something about how transparent they really are.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Dec 23, 2013 19:55:00 GMT
I am a bit miffed because if we had been told in advance that when the loan auction started, only about £90K (<30% of the loan) would actually be on offer, I would probably have been somewhat more alert at 16:00:00!! As it was, at 16:01 it was all over. Clearly, some of Assetz's background big backers need some privileges so that they can be called on to chip in big at other times at short notice, but I think it should be made clear to us exactly what we are to anticipate on each launch. How many people, I wonder, transferred funds earlier today* specifically to bid on Stourbridge, and now need to take the cash out again or leave it in hold doing no better than other languishing funds on loans dating back as far as October 24th?
* not me, I hasten to add - so I'm not on the grump myself regarding that.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Dec 23, 2013 20:30:02 GMT
How many people, I wonder, transferred funds earlier today specifically to bid on Stourbridge, and now need to take the cash out again or leave it in hold doing no better than other languishing funds on loans dating back as far as October 24th? I did, and I am miffed. I now have a four-figure sum in my account doing nowt! For Assetz to say that their new Lender Panel operating procedure means every loan will have " at least £250k being available for open auction" and then to let today's opportunity go the way it did, leaves a bad taste. But we ought to wait to hear Assetz's side of the story. PS. To add insult to injury, I note that by the time the email announcing that "A New Auction Started" was sent -- 16:01:10 according to the header on my copy -- the auction was already over.
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Post by andrewholgate on Dec 23, 2013 20:40:59 GMT
Hopefully Andrew is warming his toes by a roaring fire, and his innards with some gluhwine. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, an auction (four 'care homes') has gone through with many of the posted questions remaining unanswered. This clearly didn't bother the lenders who brought the auction to a successful conclusion in less than one minute: but how about it Assetz? Was the lack of answers 'because it's Christmas and you can't get anything done then', in which case, why rush it through? Or was it that you now realize there are enough punters prepared to go in blind that it doesn't really matter if the questions are answered or not? Whilst I hope this loan is repaid successfully, I wonder how long will it be before a loan slips through that doesn't work out as planned. Without more information, and the time to gather it, some of these auctions are going to turn into lotteries, and sooner or later Assetz's reputation, and their ability to extract our money from a messy situation, will be put to the test. It puts me in mind of the maxim that was emblazoned on the wall of a flying club in which I mis-spent my youth - "Superior pilots don't put themselves in situations that might require them to use their superior flying skills." I'm not quite by a roaring fire and I hate gluhwein. Im working my my way through these posts and will answer questions (although I am technically on holiday, albeit still in the UK, but what with the foul weather I have a tin pan on my head and under the kitchen table with a good whisky). I did did call into the office today and was told all questions were being dealt with and answered. I will ensure that any remaining questions are answered forthwith. To say we would let investors rush in blind, I take a certain amount of umbrage at. We delayed this auction several times due to not having the right level of information to launch. I sincerely hope that I never have to use the 5 years worth of experience in bad debt management ever again. However, I do know that should such a situation arise, I and the team have the skills to deal with it. Whilst one can take all steps to ensure you don't end up in a spot of bother, it is always the, as Donald Rummsfeld once said, the unknown unknowns that do for you. a
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Post by andrewholgate on Dec 23, 2013 20:43:05 GMT
>>>>>>>Whilst I hope this loan is repaid successfully, I wonder how long will it be before a loan slips through that doesn't work out as planned. Without more information, and the time to gather it, some of these auctions are going to turn into lotteries, and sooner or later Assetz's reputation, and their ability to extract our money from a messy situation, will be put to the test. I too fear that Assetz vastly superior vetting (compared to FC, say) is lulling us into a false sense of security, as is the pent up demand. And if it goes wrong everyone will turn on Assetz as they are doing on FC. I am enjoying these exciting and rewarding early days of Assetz, I hope to goodness Andrew and the team can make sure popularity doesn't spoil it! Jack Unfortunately, you can't please everyone. A few months back people complained it was too hot, now it is too wet. Brits will moan in paradise itself. What at I can say is that we do listen and we do make changes where necessary. A
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Post by andrewholgate on Dec 23, 2013 20:56:42 GMT
Think we all know the answer to that one! We may have our suspicions, but we won't know until Assetz tell us. And what Assetz say -- or don't say -- on this issue may tell us something about how transparent they really are. Ok, the first bid was for a large investor who has supported AC from the very first loan we did. This loan has taken almost 6 months to come about during which time the investor has had funds sitting waiting to deploy on it. 6 months ago we struggled to fill loans, but now we don't at a certain size. Again in I was in a difficult position that I had been sitting on the full monies for some time and could have privately placed the loan to the one investor. I had to make a decision to not let him keep the full amount but it would have been unfair to say you can't have anything given he had underwritten this one 6 months previously. The stability and growth of the platform has come from support of people like him. To build a better platform for the other lenders, I've had to make some decisions that haven't gone down too well with all lenders. However, the strength of AC is there to be seen and proves that those decisions, whilst tough, have given us stability and a growing market share. In hindsight, communication could have been better on this one. The he second bid was from another investor I know and he has been chomping at the bit to get a slice of the loan since it previewed. It seems he was able to. We do have more loans coming and I believe we can satisfy demand. We listened and made changes to the way the larger lender panel works, communication could have been better on this one, and we do have a full pipeline of loans to come. i will never be able to satisfy 100% of lenders 100% of the time! but I listen and I make changes where necessary. Andrew (from what feels like the apocalypse, somewhere near Stockport)
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andy2001
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Post by andy2001 on Dec 23, 2013 21:11:20 GMT
Maybe a max bid size on the rest of the bids could have been used, which could be removed after x amount of time if the loan is not filled.
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but googling CDM prosecutions will help explain my unease ... especially when one of the links is titled "HSE prosecution of Developer for not appointing a CDM-C" (CDM-C = CDM Coordinator). The HSE will not be blind to the late filing of this development with them. 
