james
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Post by james on Apr 21, 2015 12:18:20 GMT
What do you make of bondora's latest email and blog campaign "Try Bondora Portfolio Managers without the risk of losing money"?
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JamesFrance
Member of DD Central
Port Grimaud 1974
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Post by JamesFrance on Apr 21, 2015 14:28:42 GMT
Reading the details, they say
It seems that they will reduce the principal amounts of defaulted loans being repaid by interest received on any good loans and even worse they will deduct all the future interest payments of the good loans even though they may well default later and may have been rescheduled.
We will probably end up considerably worse off if we choose to accept this scheme, than if we just keep the defaulters and hope for some recovery.
Have I misunderstood what they are proposing? It seems to be a desperate attempt to fool people into using the Portfolio Manager.
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duck
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Post by duck on Apr 21, 2015 15:24:30 GMT
so many things wrong with that headline before you even start to consider the effect of re-scheduling.
I shall be declining the offer.
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Post by reeknralf on Apr 21, 2015 16:02:22 GMT
I'm tempted to buy a bunch of HR loans. Several will not make a single payment, so Bondora will get them back. Any that make a payment I dump on the second market at a nice premium. Might get caught by a couple that make partial repayments so are neither sellable nor defaulted. Don't suppose I'll bother.
The increasing amount of loans on the primary market and the desperate nature of this campaign must surely mean the portfolio managers are being rejected by a good proportion of investors. Here's hoping for an imminent u-turn.
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jay
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Post by jay on Apr 26, 2015 22:16:03 GMT
It's probably like james said, another attempt to lure us to use their portfolio full of juicy spanish and finnish loans(they removed slovakia right?) .First thing i did today was withdrawing the little money repaid, in case they get desesperate enough to activate the new portfolio on everyone by mistake. You never know what can happen with them nowadays .
Still no recovery from spain and slovakia worse investment i made ever in my life.
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duck
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Post by duck on Apr 27, 2015 5:42:11 GMT
..... Still no recovery from spain and slovakia I've got 10 Spanish loans making small (but regular) payments and 3 fully paid off which is a big improvement over the last couple of months.
I've even got 2 Slovakian defaults that have made payments after default.
Whilst recoveries take a long time to take place I have noticed an improvement recently, they even raised my overall return by 0.18% last month!
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jay
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Post by jay on Apr 28, 2015 15:00:32 GMT
..... Still no recovery from spain and slovakia I've got 10 Spanish loans making small (but regular) payments and 3 fully paid off which is a big improvement over the last couple of months.
I've even got 2 Slovakian defaults that have made payments after default.
Whilst recoveries take a long time to take place I have noticed an improvement recently, they even raised my overall return by 0.18% last month!
Amongst all of my slovakia loans i got one who paid in full after default, was some young woman and travel purpose. I suppose her parents or relatives paid for it .Gotta watch all of them very carefully to see if theres repayment, very time consuming and ultimately disapointing .
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Post by patright on Oct 15, 2015 5:44:38 GMT
I am waiting for this in about 6 weeks because sure enough...most of mine have gone bad
That’s correct! On November 30, 2015 Bondora will propose to buy the campaign bids in defaulted loans for the compensation amount equaling the total defaulted principal of campaign bids, less the total of received and scheduled interest.
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james
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Post by james on Oct 15, 2015 10:49:49 GMT
I am waiting for this in about 6 weeks because sure enough...most of mine have gone bad That’s correct! On November 30, 2015 Bondora will propose to buy the campaign bids in defaulted loans for the compensation amount equaling the total defaulted principal of campaign bids, less the total of received and scheduled interest. Best hope that they don't literally enforce the purchase price and demand the payment that you may owe them. Two reasons for that: 1. The total of all future interest payments on the undefaulted loans may exceed the total capital at default on the defaulted ones. If it does the price to be paid by Bondora to buy them off you is negative. Say if you got lots of HR loans with 80% interest rates and five year terms that haven't defaulted yet. The interest due on each could cover perhaps twice as much value of capital in loans that have defaulted. 2. Bondora gets to decide whether a loan is in default or not and could adjust some to ensure that they make a profit on the deal. For example, they could make payment arrangements to avoid using default. A double win for Bondora. Not only do they not have to count the capital owed as defaulted, they get to count all of the future interest payments on these loans against the purchase price of the basket of loans. Have you noticed a decrease in loans going into default status recently? I have. And an increase in arrangements, whether it's suspended payments or interest only. Anecdotal, I haven't analysed the whole loan book or the loans that are relevant to this specific offer vs loans either side of it. I don't have any loans from the relevant periods myself.
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Post by patright on Oct 15, 2015 14:33:12 GMT
yes I have, and in fact I was stupid at first and I've put too much money on the platform. I have decided just a few days ago that enough was enough and now I will withdraw some but it will take years since i have some 5 years loan
45% of my loan book is either late or in default so really that's worrisome lol
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james
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Post by james on Oct 15, 2015 15:33:05 GMT
Best to check the lates at the end of the month, that way you won't see so many of those who are just short term late.
You can expect to need to check your Bondora account fifteen years from now if Bondora is still in business. Debt collection can take a long time.
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parisingoc
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Post by parisingoc on Oct 15, 2015 15:41:20 GMT
45% of my loan book is either late or in default so really that's worrisome lol 45% late/default is an immense proportion! Is that by value or number or both (i.e. you have put the same amount into every loan)? I have been fretting lately becuase I believe that overdues are rising after my own book overdues bottomed by number last month at 5% of my total book but have doubled over the month at about 10%. With defaults now at 20% of my overall book by number, I take comfort that I have earned about 2200 Euro more interest than the value of my defaults, but it has required huge amounts of time keeping the lid on it and looks like I will have to renew my efforts on this to come out of Bondora with my start money.
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duck
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Post by duck on Oct 16, 2015 4:07:33 GMT
........ Have you noticed a decrease in loans going into default status recently? I have. And an increase in arrangements, whether it's suspended payments or interest only. Anecdotal, I haven't analysed the whole loan book or the loans that are relevant to this specific offer vs loans either side of it. I don't have any loans from the relevant periods myself. As I wrote earlier in this thread I 'declined' this offer and have no loans from this period. I have been withdrawing payments for over 6 months now.
Yes I have noticed a drop in defaults over the last 3 months, in my case by 30% upwards (in cash terms) and by number of loans a very rough 45%. Now this is obviously influenced by the lack of new loans (and those early defaults) so I have not been able to establish a definitive cause. That said over the past two days I have been going over all my 'lates' and there has been a noticeable lack of those with 2 or three missed payments which suggests your suspicion of a spot of 'manipulation' has been going on ...... What has 'surprised' me is the vast number of loans that I have that are up to date on capital but late on interest. In many cases the lack of full interest repayment (or in some cases zero) has been going on for many months.
On the 'up' side I have noticed (as posted elsewhere) that recovery on my defaults has increased in the last month but with a total of 8K Euros in default it is going to take a lot more to make a meaningful dent in this amount even if I'm paying the recovery fees!
Currently I should be ahead when I finally exit (I have stabilised this over the last couple of months). If you take out the £/Euro exchange rate (£ has been dropping for the best part of a week now  ) the big winner from this has been the UK Tax man. Even being a basic rate tax payer has meant 65.2% of all interest payments received in the past couple of years has been paid over .......
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Post by patright on Oct 16, 2015 4:59:46 GMT
45% of my loan book is either late or in default so really that's worrisome lol 45% late/default is an immense proportion! Is that by value or number or both (i.e. you have put the same amount into every loan)? I have been fretting lately becuase I believe that overdues are rising after my own book overdues bottomed by number last month at 5% of my total book but have doubled over the month at about 10%. With defaults now at 20% of my overall book by number, I take comfort that I have earned about 2200 Euro more interest than the value of my defaults, but it has required huge amounts of time keeping the lid on it and looks like I will have to renew my efforts on this to come out of Bondora with my start money. yes it's by value , it's several thousand euros , as an exemple I have 300 loans on stage 1 , 95 on stage 4 and only 5 on stage 5 so yes James is right, 15 years from now it might still go on lol
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Post by patright on Nov 9, 2015 8:30:47 GMT
I am still not hearing anything from Bondora on this..the date is approaching
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) the big winner from this has been the UK Tax man. Even being a basic rate tax payer has meant 65.2% of all interest payments received in the past couple of years has been paid over .......