max
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Post by max on Aug 19, 2015 4:11:45 GMT
Many people desperately wanting to invest into savingstream loans are turning into an angry mob when they find out that there are not enough loans for everyone to invest. So I started this (provocative?) thread to collect and make suggestions on how to get rid of the angry mob - It makes bad PR and turns happy investors like me depressed  |
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max
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Post by max on Aug 19, 2015 4:13:26 GMT
It seems all down to economics 1.1 rebalancing supply and demand My suggestions: 1) lift the investment limit to 1-10k - get rid of angry mob with small pockets create a market place of deep pocket investors like Thincats and Lendinvest. 1b) as above with a twist: investment limit stays only when a new loan is launched (PM) and then lifted in the SM - similar to AC model of underwriters 2) limit initial investment to £100-£1,000 in the first 24h. This seems popular with the angry mob but it might alienate deep pocket investors. Contrary to angry mob opinions, this is not the model of FS nor MT - they do not apply any filter to their property loans! Not really, unless the loan is for a shed of <100k. Perhaps they do not need because less attractive? 3) Flood the market with rubbish loans. This will eventually alienate people who are risk averse (perhaps everyone?) 4) Flood the market with good loans and reduce your margin to each loan to zero. I'm serious here and this is indeed my favourite. I believe SS business model is no longer loaning money - it's the market place they are creating. The value of the business is far from the margin SS makes from each loan now and is close to the volume of money invested in the platform and number of happy investors coming to their market. So, please savingstream forget about bread crumbs and get to 100 million invested in the platform in the next 2 months. Investors here are ready and just waiting  |
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Post by supernumerary on Aug 19, 2015 6:29:09 GMT
Many people desperately wanting to invest into savingstream loans are turning into an angry mob when they find out that there are not enough loans for everyone to invest. So I started this (provocative?) thread to collect and make suggestions on how to get rid of the angry mob - It makes bad PR and turns happy investors like me depressed Max, In reply to "...this (provocative?) thread..." Just calm down! Get some tea and watch this! Did I say calm down? Well, calm down there! Harry Enfield - The Scousers www.youtube.com/watch?v=6k2YEc6dozA
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webwiz
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Post by webwiz on Aug 19, 2015 6:40:10 GMT
It seems all down to economics 1.1 rebalancing supply and demand My suggestions: 4) Flood the market with good loans and reduce your margin to each loan to zero. I'm serious here and this is indeed my favourite. I believe SS business model is no longer loaning money - it's the market place they are creating. The value of the business is far from the margin SS makes from each loan now and is close to the volume of money invested in the platform and number of happy investors coming to their market. Surely economic theory says that in order to balance demand and supply SS should reduce the rates to borrowers and investors. There is no value to SS in creating a bigger market with no barriers to entry. If SS do not reduce rates someone else will.
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Aug 19, 2015 7:39:35 GMT
It seems its all down to economics 1.1 rebalancing supply and demand So, please savingstream forget about bread crumbs and get to 100 million invested in the platform in the next 2 months. Investors here are ready and just waiting Invested in what? If they had 100million pipeline they wouldnt have a problem, because supply would match demand. There wouldnt be an 'angry mob,' which includes some big investors by the way, as there wouldnt be a stampede. Very few platforms where supply isnt outstripped by demand, yet no angry mob. Criticism, complaints and grumbling generally arise when platforms dont work how their supposed to, which is largely the issue here.
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Post by meledor on Aug 19, 2015 7:58:18 GMT
It seems its all down to economics 1.1 rebalancing supply and demand So, please savingstream forget about bread crumbs and get to 100 million invested in the platform in the next 2 months. Investors here are ready and just waiting Invested in what? If they had 100million pipeline they wouldnt have a problem, because supply would match demand. There wouldnt be an 'angry mob,' which includes some big investors by the way, as there wouldnt be a stampede. Very few platforms where supply isnt outstripped by demand, yet no angry mob. Criticism, complaints and grumbling generally arise when platforms dont work how their supposed to, which is largely the issue here.
"Very few platforms where supply isnt outstripped by demand, yet no angry mob" - I don't think that's the case from my experience with the other platforms I'm involved with. The demand for Ablrate's aircraft loans was disappointingly low, there always seems to be lots of loans at AC that nobody wants, and TC go through periods where loans are slow to fill and bidding bonuses are offered for them to complete.
So SS is clearly providing a service which is generating a lot of demand that is not perceived as being offered on the same scale elsewhere.
Max - good thread with nicely provocative title
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Aug 19, 2015 8:12:19 GMT
So SS is clearly providing a service which is generating a lot of demand that is not perceived as being offered on the same scale elsewhere. It's easy to generate demand you can't meet.
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j
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Penguins are very misunderstood!
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Post by j on Aug 19, 2015 8:21:29 GMT
Many people desperately wanting to invest into savingstream loans are turning into an angry mob when they find out that there are not enough loans for everyone to invest. So I started this (provocative?) thread to collect and make suggestions on how to get rid of the angry mob - It makes bad PR and turns happy investors like me depressed A little drastic don't you think?! Many of the issues raised are very succinct & valid. Some might have worded their views a bit too strongly but, they are entitled to their opinions & entitled to voice them. At the end of the day if some don't like SS's methods, they will take their money elsewhere but, you cannot help but feel it might bite SS in the proverbial sooner or later. Having said that, both sides are entitled to do what they feel best suits them, even if the other doesn't agree with it.
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Post by xyon100 on Aug 19, 2015 8:31:56 GMT
I think what we are seeing is a lot of (understandable) frustration followed by an awful of lot of sour grapes and cutting off of noses to spite faces. It IS frustrating trying to get funds in to SS, no doubt about it. It's particularly galling to see you managed to wrest away a little chunk from the incredibly dedicated loans page refreshers only to find it gone in the morning. It's just amusing to see people upset at not being able to invest who then predict the whole thing is going to go belly up. Why were they trying to invest then?
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sqh
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Before P2P, savers put a guinea in a piggy bank, now they smash the banks to become guinea pigs.
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Post by sqh on Aug 19, 2015 9:13:22 GMT
Hopefully this will make the angry mob feel better.
There was £1,355,000 made available yesterday to about 4150 lenders. That's 326.50 each. So if you missed out your losing £3.26 per month.
Right now, your £326.50 could be invested at 10% in equally secure loans where there is a Trust structure. That gives you £2.72 per month.
Now your only missing out on 54p per month, that's 1.8p per day.
If you are still angry you need a doctor.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Aug 19, 2015 9:42:42 GMT
The other thing that surprises me is that there seem to be some people who think that a riskless, effortless, guaranteed, always available 12% return should actually exist.
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Post by xyon100 on Aug 19, 2015 10:18:07 GMT
Hopefully this will make the angry mob feel better. There was £1,355,000 made available yesterday to about 4150 lenders. That's 326.50 each. So if you missed out your losing £3.26 per month. Right now, your £326.50 could be invested at 10% in equally secure loans where there is a Trust structure. That gives you £2.72 per month. Now your only missing out on 54p per month, that's 1.8p per day. If you are still angry you need a doctor. I'm curious as to which site you are referring? Still very new to this game.
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am
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Post by am on Aug 19, 2015 10:24:01 GMT
Hopefully this will make the angry mob feel better. There was £1,355,000 made available yesterday to about 4150 lenders. That's 326.50 each. So if you missed out your losing £3.26 per month. Right now, your £326.50 could be invested at 10% in equally secure loans where there is a Trust structure. That gives you £2.72 per month. Now your only missing out on 54p per month, that's 1.8p per day. If you are still angry you need a doctor. I'm curious as to which site you are referring? Still very new to this game. FC (sometimes) offer bridging loans at 10%. AC have WT loans at 10%. (AC also have bridging loans at more than 10%, but historically several have run into problems.) There may be other platforms with similar offers.
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j
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Penguins are very misunderstood!
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Post by j on Aug 19, 2015 11:13:39 GMT
Really sensible comments by sqh and registerme. People are getting way too overexcited by the SS product. True, it's been very good thus far but the track record on property loans isn't very long. I remember similar enthusiasm for AC in late 13 and TC in late 12. There is too much focus here on the instant 12% and the current illusion of liquidity and nowhere near enough focus on the risks, especially the platform risks. If you really believe 12% unsecured is better than 10% or 11% secured then rethink. It's a very marginal excess return given you're are risking up to par. If you are treating this like a 12% instant access account then rethink. The liquidity currently looks good but in most fixed-income credit products (which this is) you'll find the door on the way in is far wider than the door on the way out. What I find most interesting here is the sheer risk appetite of the lenders for SS, especially on this forum. People seem to be taking quite a lot of risk with a relevant fraction of their net worth. After almost 20 years of investing in global fixed income professionally, I don't even have a fraction of the risk appetite you guys do! Another post by samford71 that puts things into real perspective for everyone concerned!
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Post by yorkshireman on Aug 19, 2015 11:30:57 GMT
Whilst I acknowledge the effect of supply and demand on SS, what really hacks me off is the performance of the website when loans go live.
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