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Post by goldservice on Feb 26, 2016 12:16:38 GMT
sunspot said "Firstly you don't take the word of an accountant in someone else's employ." I like this because virtually all accountants are not in ones own employ. So this is saying that no accountant should be trusted. And that is what I have always thought viz that you can't believe anything an accountant says (apart from any of you good people reading this of course  ) |
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Post by zzr600 on Feb 26, 2016 12:30:34 GMT
Some months ago SS did in fact pull a loan a day or two after issue based on feedback from this forum I think
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Feb 26, 2016 12:38:33 GMT
Default prefunding is something that will likely be banned when regulators eventually catch up with this market. Indeed, I don't prefund anything until I've read (or at least skimmed through) the valuation report. Default prefunding seems to me no different to the blanket approach taken by autobid and similar tools on other P2P sites, some of whom provide the equivalent mechanism as the ONLY way to invest. SS has the unique approach of allowing post-funding (even in the section of the site it refers to as pre-funding without adequately explaining what that means), where you fund your commitments AFTER you made them, rather than in advance, and if anything I'd tend to think that would be the aspect that would be more likely to attract regulator attention if it hasn't already.
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webwiz
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Post by webwiz on Feb 26, 2016 12:40:20 GMT
1. In the surveyors opinion, in the absence of the prospect of achieving planning permission for a viable alternative use, the land would have a nil value. As an aside I would quite like to acquire some land at near nil value, preferably in England, as a very long term investment - probably for my grandson. After all they are not making it any more (at least not inland) and who knows what use there might be for it in the future. Nobody predicted the value of land for mobile phone masts prior to the invention of cellular phones. And there are always road and rail possibilities.
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Feb 26, 2016 12:41:23 GMT
Some months ago SS did in fact pull a loan a day or two after issue based on feedback from this forum I think Which loan was that? I recall a couple that were pulled post-launch (but pre-drawdown) after problems emerged late in the completion legals, but I don't remember one being cancelled because of SS lender feedback.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Feb 26, 2016 12:47:08 GMT
1. In the surveyors opinion, in the absence of the prospect of achieving planning permission for a viable alternative use, the land would have a nil value. As an aside I would quite like to acquire some land at near nil value, preferably in England, as a very long term investment - probably for my grandson. After all they are not making it any more (at least not inland) and who knows what use there might be for it in the future. Nobody predicted the value of land for mobile phone masts prior to the invention of cellular phones. And there are always road and rail possibilities. I think there are some nuclear waste sites they will give you for free, as long as you insure them, and pay for the remediation works required for the next half million years. 8>. Your grandson might prefer something else though .. a forest, or agricultural land or whatever, even if it costs more initially.
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webwiz
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Post by webwiz on Feb 26, 2016 12:52:19 GMT
As an aside I would quite like to acquire some land at near nil value, preferably in England, as a very long term investment - probably for my grandson. After all they are not making it any more (at least not inland) and who knows what use there might be for it in the future. Nobody predicted the value of land for mobile phone masts prior to the invention of cellular phones. And there are always road and rail possibilities. I think there are some nuclear waste sites they will give you for free, as long as you insure them, and pay for the remediation works required for the next half million years. 8>. Your grandson might prefer something else though .. a forest, or agricultural land or whatever, even if it costs more initially. Good point, but I did say near nil value not negative value.
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sam i am
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Post by sam i am on Feb 26, 2016 13:00:54 GMT
Some months ago SS did in fact pull a loan a day or two after issue based on feedback from this forum I think Which loan was that? I recall a couple that were pulled post-launch (but pre-drawdown) after problems emerged late in the completion legals, but I don't remember one being cancelled because of SS lender feedback. PBL041 (Banbury) was pulled, I think because planning permission was due to expire and the development was unlikely to reach completion in time. Not sure if it was because of feedback on this forum though. PBL034 (Bradford) was also pulled but this was before I joined SS.
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Post by jackpease on Feb 26, 2016 13:03:47 GMT
In a way it would be good if it didn't as it would show investors aren't blinded by 12% return and do look at what they are investing in. On a selfish note I have to totally disagree with you on this point. We all need the people who don't do any DD, because without them we will never sell all the older loans, the negative loans, or the slightly iffy loans on the SM. The more people there are blinded by the 12% is actually better for those of us who are a little more picky. I'm not sure - I am seriously worried that people mopping up negative-day SM parts and a loan like this as being indicative of being blinded by 'outlier' high interest rates (this loan excepted). In the event of a shock, 12%-blinded newbies would struggle if they had filled their boots with rubbish - if they couldn't meet their commitments to SS that affects all of us (eg depletion of provision fund). And inevitably they'd bleat to the regulators that they didn't understand the risk so we'd all get clobbered with more regulation Jack P
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sqh
Member of DD Central
Before P2P, savers put a guinea in a piggy bank, now they smash the banks to become guinea pigs.
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Post by sqh on Feb 26, 2016 13:26:30 GMT
I think there are some nuclear waste sites they will give you for free, as long as you insure them, and pay for the remediation works required for the next half million years. 8>. Your grandson might prefer something else though .. a forest, or agricultural land or whatever, even if it costs more initially. Good point, but I did say near nil value not negative value. Old nuclear waste might be valuable in 20 years time. New techniques for extracting nuclear energy from nuclear waste will be available within your grandson's lifetime. Here's some weekend reading. www.world-nuclear.org/information-library/nuclear-fuel-cycle/fuel-recycling/processing-of-used-nuclear-fuel.aspx
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 26, 2016 13:29:10 GMT
Ok - lets do a sweepstake on PF allocation - anyone prepared to nail their colours to mast - nice and simple please...people will get X% 30% I got 100% of what I wanted My prediction is that everyone will receive 100% of their pre-funding amount. Whether that's what they wanted is a totally different question! 
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 26, 2016 13:38:43 GMT
In the event of a shock, 12%-blinded newbies would struggle if they had filled their boots with rubbish - if they couldn't meet their commitments to SS that affects all of us (eg depletion of provision fund). : Sorry, I don't follow. How would anyone's inability to meet their commitments to SS -- presumably by buying parts they couldn't pay for -- have any effect on the PF?
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mikes1531
Member of DD Central
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Post by mikes1531 on Feb 26, 2016 13:39:27 GMT
You misunderstand; I know that it won't be launched under the old terms, just that for the security of the SS platform I'm glad that the new T&Cs are in place. On the old T&Cs a defaulted loan could affect all investors whether you had invested in the defaulted loan or not. Unfortunately there could still be a secondary effect for all investors. If this loan (or any loan for that matter) defaults it will make it more obvious that Savingstream isn't the easy low-risk way to 12% that it may sometimes appear. This will deter some lenders making it harder to fill loans and sell on the SM in future. And a default that makes a noticeable dent in the PF will have a knock-on effect for every other SS loan, making the PF coverage less valuable. Unless, of course, SS top the PF back up to the stated 2% level. With SS withdrawing money from the PF every time a loan successfully completes, we really need to have a policy statement from savingstream regarding what they would do if the PF ever does pay out to cover the shortfall on a defaulted loan.
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boundah
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Post by boundah on Feb 26, 2016 14:14:28 GMT
I see this going one of 3 ways:
1. Fully allocated to pre-fund bidders (say 40-50% of requested prefund).
2. Big overhang of non-prefunded loan.
3. SS pull the offer.
If history is anything to go by and lenders care not a jot about risk, (1) is the most likely.
If a lot of lenders read this forum, (2) is the most likely.
If SS are paying attention, (3) is the most likely.
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Post by jackpease on Feb 26, 2016 14:19:20 GMT
In the event of a shock, 12%-blinded newbies would struggle if they had filled their boots with rubbish - if they couldn't meet their commitments to SS that affects all of us (eg depletion of provision fund). : Sorry, I don't follow. How would anyone's inability to meet their commitments to SS -- presumably by buying parts they couldn't pay for -- have any effect on the PF? Well if there was a shock and people had 'gamed' - and then saw that they would be stuck with unsellable parts - they may be unwilling or unable to cough up. Meanwhile SS might itself be short having assumed the prefunding would cover the loan - the shock would meanwhile be affecting other parts of SS (and the wider world) causing difficulties that presumably must suck in the provision fund. Everything with SS is fine and dandy for as long as there is confidence.... I will keep on worrying that all this is too good to be true and something relatively minor (eg a smelly loan goes wrong) could cause wider problems. Jack
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