star dust
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Post by star dust on Mar 21, 2016 11:09:32 GMT
I think in light of the stagnant secondary market and the difficulty some experience trying to resolve their negative balance by selling loans that turn out to be not selling (or blocked due to technical difficulties) it would be a good idea for savingstream to implement a facility for sellers to withdraw their unsold parts from the SM so that they can sell something else. I'm not saying it's more important that loan origination, or due dil, etc, etc but I am saying it definitely needs doing soon. SS rarely have technical glitches of this magnitude, and they are already sorting them out and I am sure will assist any lenders who ended up with over purchases. Try a bit of DD research before you put something up for sale it's not that difficult to see what's selling and how big a Q is, that's always served me well in the dim and distant past when the SM wasn't a feeding frenzy, or loans could take weeks to sell. Things are even better now as with ilmoro and GSV3MIaC 's loan info it's even possible to work out roughly how much of what is for sale is investors or SS/underwriters. Alternatively, put up with a loss of a few days interest. It's an unnecessary luxury to me. In Edit: They are helping investors out with today's glitch as reported on another thread.
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locutus
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Post by locutus on Mar 21, 2016 11:31:50 GMT
Is changing your mind no longer a valid reason?
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Post by mrclondon on Mar 21, 2016 12:16:37 GMT
If you want a compelling reason for SS to offer it then I can offer a killer one. Namely that AC, MT and FC all offer such a facility and I wouldn't want SS to look bad in this respect. And FS
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Mar 21, 2016 12:54:29 GMT
If you want a compelling reason for SS to offer it then I can offer a killer one. Namely that AC, MT and FC all offer such a facility and I wouldn't want SS to look bad in this respect. Other platforms doing something hardly seems a compelling reason to me. I've no knowledge of MT's system, but: AC has a marketplace that operates much more slowly for buyers (due to the high complexity of their systems). FC has a fee, and a marketplace dominated by lurking "robot" buyers ready to grab anything of above-normal attractiveness the moment it is offered. AC creates dozens of small transactions for a single large purchase. FC ties the loan part size that a buyer gets to the loan part size that a seller is holding. Both have rather lower interest rates. Neither has a first-in-first-out sales queue, meaning that you not only need to worry about how much was on the market BEFORE you tried to sell yours, but also about large quantities being dumped AFTER you tried to sell yours. Which of these other aspects of their service should SS strive to copy while they're at it? Is changing your mind no longer a valid reason? Changing your mind is also adequately catered for by repurchasing the same quantity on the secondary market. One thing that could probably be done without too much hassle (although it would depend on exactly how things are implemented in savingstream 's back end) would be to have "repurchasing your own loan parts" prioritised in the aftermarket... So rather than merely ordering by date listed for sale when considering which loan parts to "buy", it would order by "is this my loan part" and then by date. This would explicitly reinforce the "repurchase to cancel" functionality, and avoid needing to create a whole new interface just for cancellations. Edit: However, if the decision to disallow cancellations was actively chosen (rather than merely not implemented), an explicit "repurchase to cancel" function would likely cause many of the same issues that may have been considered when deciding to disallow cancellation.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Mar 21, 2016 13:25:57 GMT
If you want a compelling reason for SS to offer it then I can offer a killer one. Namely that AC, MT and FC all offer such a facility and I wouldn't want SS to look bad in this respect. Other platforms doing something hardly seems a compelling reason to me. I've no knowledge of MT's system, but: AC has a marketplace that operates much more slowly for buyers (due to the high complexity of their systems). Just a quick comment on this. My personal experience is that I started on SS towards the end of May 2015, and on AC in January 2016. I have been able to invest (ie as a "buyer") on AC via MLIA far quicker than I have on SS. Though I accept that this may not always have been the case, at the moment there's good loan flow on AC. I also find their systems to be extremely straightforward, but I might be in a minority of one there .
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Mar 21, 2016 13:39:01 GMT
Adding the "Cancel" option was straightforward on MT because their lenders continue to accrue interest whilst parts are listed for sale. Doing the same would be significantly trickier on SS unless they bring their SM interest accrual policy into line with MT / FS / AC / FC / FK / LC / etc.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2016 13:48:21 GMT
Adding the "Cancel" option was straightforward on MT because their lenders continue to accrue interest whilst parts are listed for sale. Doing the same would be significantly trickier on SS unless they bring their SM interest accrual policy into line with MT / FS / AC / FC / FK / LC / etc. I hope they continue to withhold interest from the date we put it on SM and use it to fund christmas party/easter break, whatever they do with it. Paying interest whilst on SM will only lead to some people buying way more than they need/can afford and putting it straight on SM earning interest while they can.
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ablender
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Post by ablender on Mar 21, 2016 16:19:35 GMT
I think in light of the stagnant secondary market and the difficulty some experience trying to resolve their negative balance by selling loans that turn out to be not selling (or blocked due to technical difficulties) it would be a good idea for savingstream to implement a facility for sellers to withdraw their unsold parts from the SM so that they can sell something else. I'm not saying it's more important that loan origination, or due dil, etc, etc but I am saying it definitely needs doing soon. I can think of the following conditions where you might WANT to cancel a sale: 1. Technical issues are blocking sales - in this case the same technical issues would almost certainly block cancellations in a system that was properly designed. In order to creating duplicate loan parts in cases where a simultaneous cancelation and purchase occur, purchases and cancellations would almost certainly need to be processed in the same queue, so if it becomes stuck causing the purchase page to freeze, the cancellation page would almost certainly freeze in the same manner. 2. Market conditions are blocking sales - in this case the loan is easy to buy, and you can effect a "cancellation" by buying back the same amount of the loan on the secondary market. 3. You want to cheat the system by cancelling sales so you can get an extra day's interest. Which did you have in mind? What compelling reason is there for savingstream to implement it? And what about : I have changed my mind. Why can't I do that?
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dp
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Post by dp on Mar 21, 2016 16:31:07 GMT
I'd like the option to pull a sale if required.
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goopy
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Post by goopy on Mar 21, 2016 16:36:09 GMT
Adding the "Cancel" option was straightforward on MT because their lenders continue to accrue interest whilst parts are listed for sale. Doing the same would be significantly trickier on SS unless they bring their SM interest accrual policy into line with MT / FS / AC / FC / FK / LC / etc. I hope they continue to withhold interest from the date we put it on SM and use it to fund christmas party/easter break, whatever they do with it. Paying interest whilst on SM will only lead to some people buying way more than they need/can afford and putting it straight on SM earning interest while they can. Correct me if I'm wrong but as I understand it interest is not paid on loan parts which are not paid for, therefore if you have negative funds then you will not be paid interest on the negative amount. How then would you be able to claim interest on loan parts you can't afford as this would mean you would have negative funds?
IMHO if you have the funds in your account then you should be paid interest on your loan parts which are for sale....
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goopy
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Post by goopy on Mar 21, 2016 16:37:28 GMT
I'd like the option to pull a sale if required. Me too.
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spiral
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Post by spiral on Mar 21, 2016 16:47:56 GMT
Correct me if I'm wrong but as I understand it interest is not paid on loan parts which are not paid for
I don't think this is correct. AIUI you're not paid interest on loans you never pay for and are taken back by SS, but if you pay up within the allotted time, you receive full interest. I assume that this was the process in action with the 1.2m loanbook that SS eventually did take back resulting in the defined credit limits. I assume the person was buying in one account, then selling after 1 day to a spouses account thus "paying" for them, then a day later selling back to their account pocketting the interest all along. If they weren't receiving the interest, what would have been the point in doing what they were doing.
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Mar 21, 2016 17:03:37 GMT
And what about : I have changed my mind. Why can't I do that? No reason, but as mentioned in a reply to the same point made a few posts earlier, it's also adequately catered for by buying back the same amount on the secondary market. As previous post, one route to adding a "cancel sale" option if SS wish to do so would be to use buying back on the secondary market as the defined mechanism for doing this, by modifying this to prioritise "my own loan parts" above the loan parts that would otherwise be at the head of the queue. However, I'd still think it would need careful thought about additional "gaming" opportunities that could be opened up by such a feature.
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goopy
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Post by goopy on Mar 21, 2016 17:11:15 GMT
Correct me if I'm wrong but as I understand it interest is not paid on loan parts which are not paid for
I don't think this is correct. AIUI you're not paid interest on loans you never pay for and are taken back by SS, but if you pay up within the allotted time, you receive full interest. I assume that this was the process in action with the 1.2m loanbook that SS eventually did take back resulting in the defined credit limits. I assume the person was buying in one account, then selling after 1 day to a spouses account thus "paying" for them, then a day later selling back to their account pocketting the interest all along. If they weren't receiving the interest, what would have been the point in doing what they were doing. Ok I stand corrected. If what you say is correct then surely the best approach would be not to pay interest until the loan is actually paid for. I'm sure most people wouldn't mind losing a day or two's interest for the convenience of having the 48 hour grace period and if people have a problem with that they can always make sure they have money in their account before they buy.
If SS adopted this it would rule out a lot of 'gaming' then we could have a cancel button AND be paid interest on loan parts which we have up for sale.
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ablender
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Post by ablender on Mar 21, 2016 17:15:07 GMT
And what about : I have changed my mind. Why can't I do that? No reason, but as mentioned in a reply to the same point made a few posts earlier, it's also adequately catered for by buying back the same amount on the secondary market. As previous post, one route to adding a "cancel sale" option if SS wish to do so would be to use buying back on the secondary market as the defined mechanism for doing this, by modifying this to prioritise "my own loan parts" above the loan parts that would otherwise be at the head of the queue. However, I'd still think it would need careful thought about additional "gaming" opportunities that could be opened up by such a feature. No, it is not catered for. I have put for sale £50 from loan 84 to cover a -£50 balance. It is after some £60000. I want to pull this sale back and sell another £50 instead from another loan. If I do as you say and buy another £50 from loan 84 I will get a balance of -£100. If this is followed by a sale from another loan of £50 I would still have a balance of -£50. A simple cancel button would mean that I will get back my loan part and am free to sell something else. sl75, may I ask you if implementing a cancel button would take away anything from you?
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