ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Apr 11, 2016 13:22:31 GMT
More pbl087 just released, £1.2m now available. Update added 'We are holding a reasonably large amount of this loan back and will be releasing it onto the market over the next week or two. £1m has just been released from our holdings'
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Post by supernumerary on Apr 11, 2016 15:31:37 GMT
More pbl087 just released, £1.2m now available. Update added 'We are holding a reasonably large amount of this loan back and will be releasing it onto the market over the next week or two. £1m has just been released from our holdings' ilmoro & karma police If you will recall I wrote the comment below, four days ago… This is my interpretation on what maybe going on and I'll do it by making a comparison of two loans of a similar size; DFL001 - Exeter Rydon Court Development has a loan value of £6,063,750, with currently 2007 investors. PBL087 - Unit 3, Wolsey Business Park, Watford, Herts has a loan value of £6,170,500, with currently 1465 investors. Roughly speaking, PBL087 has currently 3/4 of the number of investors that DFL001 currently has. IF AN ASSUMPTION is made, that the average amount that those Saving Stream investors currently have invested in BOTH loans is the same, then PBL087 requires roughly another approx. £1,5M needed to be funded. Just to qualify that, for the loan DFL001, £6,063,750 divided by 2007 investors equals on average £3,021.30 each. For the loan PBL087, 1465 investors multiplied by £3021.30 (DFL001 average), equals £4,426,204.50 (potentially invested in PBL087 using the assumptions made above). So for the total amount of PBL087 of £6,170,500, subtracting £4,426,204.50, equals £1,744,295.50 (still needed to be invested in PBL087 using the assumption made above). This MAY be the reason why, we have seen more money being made available in these two loans, becoming available on the Saving Stream platform...  Using rough and ready calculations; 4 days is approx. 1/5 of three weeks. 1/5 of 400 (new saving Stream investors in three weeks) = 80 80 multiplied by £3021.30 (DFL001 average) = £241,704 (The amount that has POSSIBLY been invested since posting my observation four days ago). £1,744,295.50 (the amount I estimated that still needed to be invested in PBL087 four days ago) - £241,704 equals £1.5m approx. (still requiring funding.) With Saving Stream having released £1m, MY GUESS IS, they MAY still be holding another £500K approx. BTW, everything is an approximation and the figures I have derived, are based on my own understanding on these figures, by making a FEW assumptions… 
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ben
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Post by ben on Apr 11, 2016 15:32:19 GMT
I would guess a bit of the Durham loan that has been repaid will take care of a bit of this once people notice it has been repaid
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jonbvn
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Post by jonbvn on Apr 11, 2016 16:26:31 GMT
I would guess a bit of the Durham loan that has been repaid will take care of a bit of this once people notice it has been repaid Plus the today's repayment of loans PBL016, 17 & 18 in Swansea & Cardiff.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Apr 11, 2016 16:54:39 GMT
Update added 'We are holding a reasonably large amount of this loan back and will be releasing it onto the market over the next week or two. £1m has just been released from our holdings' ilmoro & karma police If you will recall I wrote the comment below, four days ago… This is my interpretation on what maybe going on and I'll do it by making a comparison of two loans of a similar size; DFL001 - Exeter Rydon Court Development has a loan value of £6,063,750, with currently 2007 investors. PBL087 - Unit 3, Wolsey Business Park, Watford, Herts has a loan value of £6,170,500, with currently 1465 investors. Roughly speaking, PBL087 has currently 3/4 of the number of investors that DFL001 currently has. IF AN ASSUMPTION is made, that the average amount that those Saving Stream investors currently have invested in BOTH loans is the same, then PBL087 requires roughly another approx. £1,5M needed to be funded. Just to qualify that, for the loan DFL001, £6,063,750 divided by 2007 investors equals on average £3,021.30 each. For the loan PBL087, 1465 investors multiplied by £3021.30 (DFL001 average), equals £4,426,204.50 (potentially invested in PBL087 using the assumptions made above). So for the total amount of PBL087 of £6,170,500, subtracting £4,426,204.50, equals £1,744,295.50 (still needed to be invested in PBL087 using the assumption made above). This MAY be the reason why, we have seen more money being made available in these two loans, becoming available on the Saving Stream platform... Using rough and ready calculations; ibly 4 days is approx. 1/5 of three weeks. 1/5 of 400 (new saving Stream investors in three weeks) = 80 80 multiplied by £3021.30 (DFL001 average) = £241,704 (The amount that has POSSIBLY been invested since posting my observation four days ago). £1,744,295.50 (the amount I estimated that still needed to be invested in PBL087 four days ago) - £241,704 equals £1.5m approx. (still requiring funding.) With Saving Stream having released £1m, MY GUESS IS, they MAY still be holding another £500K approx. BTW, everything is an approximation and the figures I have derived, are based on my own understanding on these figures, by making a FEW assumptions… Never said you arent right, however Dfl1 was only 3mil initial tranch so maths is wrong ISTM. Possibly a bigger sum still
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Post by supernumerary on Apr 11, 2016 20:25:51 GMT
Never said you arent right, however Dfl1 was only 3mil initial tranch so maths is wrong ISTM. Possibly a bigger sum still Thanks for the posting. Interesting that you reckon it may be, "Possibly a bigger sum still." Would you hazard a guess on what that bigger sum might be? Because it would be interesting to read you thoughts on it.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2016 20:59:42 GMT
Never said you arent right, however Dfl1 was only 3mil initial tranch so maths is wrong ISTM. Possibly a bigger sum still dfl1 was £3m not £6m, that's quite an error.  Lenders should do their own due diligence before believing anything they read on a forum.
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goopy
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Post by goopy on Apr 12, 2016 6:52:35 GMT
There are quite a few assumptions being made. IMO there was over 3M of PBL087 unfunded at launch. See here |
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littleoldlady
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Running down all platforms due to age
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Post by littleoldlady on Apr 12, 2016 7:59:21 GMT
The problem with these loans are that they are very large and also unattractive to anyone who knows the area (I used to live in the closest residential area and my brother worked at Scammels). In my day it was purely industrial although it has since been "upgraded" to mixed office and industrial but I find it hard to believe that it can be made to work as residential without major infrastructure improvements (which, for all I know, may be planned by the local authorities). Still, I would probably have said the same about the London Docklands at the beginning, so don't let me put you off. Not for me though.
Edit: I should make it clear that my local knowledge is many years out of date and it is possible that the infrastructure has already been improved. I no longer live anywhere near it so can't check personally.
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jonbvn
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Post by jonbvn on Apr 12, 2016 17:54:27 GMT
The problem with these loans are that they are very large and also unattractive to anyone who knows the area (I used to live in the closest residential area and my brother worked at Scammels). In my day it was purely industrial although it has since been "upgraded" to mixed office and industrial but I find it hard to believe that it can be made to work as residential without major infrastructure improvements (which, for all I know, may be planned by the local authorities). Still, I would probably have said the same about the London Docklands at the beginning, so don't let me put you off. Not for me though. I would have agreed with you a few years back. However, the residential property market in London and SE England is such that projects like this have now become workable.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Apr 12, 2016 19:49:37 GMT
True but/and scary. If it's flat(ish) and in Hertfordshire (or Bucks, Beds, ... etc) and you are allowed to park people on it, it seems to be built over at 40 chicken-coops-to-the-acre faster than you can say 'little boxes'. Which is why I don't live in that part of the world any more.
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Post by supernumerary on Apr 12, 2016 20:54:38 GMT
Never said you arent right, however Dfl1 was only 3mil initial tranch so maths is wrong ISTM. Possibly a bigger sum still dfl1 was £3m not £6m, that's quite an error. Lenders should do their own due diligence before believing anything they read on a forum.
According to the Saving Stream website;
DFL001 <redacted by mod> INVESTED £6,063,750
INVESTORS SO FAR 2006
<attachment removed by mod>
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Apr 12, 2016 21:10:44 GMT
Never said you arent right, however Dfl1 was only 3mil initial tranch so maths is wrong ISTM. Possibly a bigger sum still dfl1 was £3m not £6m, that's quite an error. Lenders should do their own due diligence before believing anything they read on a forum. According to the Saving Stream website; DFL001 - INVESTED £6,063,750 INVESTORS SO FAR 2006 Thats the total value of the facility but the full sum will be released in tranches and to the best of my knowledge no further tranches have been released. The initial sum was £3188 confirmed by SS in an email and hereHmmm I agree the terminology is confusing, shame we cant see the queues anymore, maybe SS are holding the remainder on account. Ps Your post indentifies the property and therefore leads to the borrower identity
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Post by supernumerary on Apr 14, 2016 8:50:26 GMT
RE my last post: "Last Edit: 12 hours ago by mrclondon: Redacteed borrower details"
Please see amendment. Attachments:
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Apr 14, 2016 19:15:52 GMT
I think the issue is that, for any loan, the sum of the amount 'Invested' and the amount 'Remaining' always matches the loan 'Value', which is the maximum amount the borrower can borrow. In the case of DFL001, SS may have agreed with the borrower that they can borrow up to £6,063,750 as long as the work confirmed as having been done has added enough value to the project to support that loan amount without exceeding the agreed LTV -- but the loan will be advanced in stages as the development work progresses. So at this point it may be that only £3M actually has been advanced to the borrower and the remaining £3M won't be released until more work has been done. Unfortunately, the way savingstream report the amount 'Invested' in a given loan gives us no clue at all about the actual situation for development loans where the money is advanced to the borrower in stages/tranches. |
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