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Post by Ton ⓉⓞⓃ on Apr 11, 2016 20:49:49 GMT
Only just joined but have been investing in P2P for a while. A question: Z+, how do I know what rate I am actually achieving? If I understand the information displayed correctly I can see the 'blended' rate of the various loans I have made and I can see the projected return after the anticipated defaults. How do I know what rate I am actually achieving? If I'm really lucky I could get close to the 'blended' rate (I wish) or if unlucky I could get lower than the projected rate. Either way seems to me to be quite important to know just how well or badly I'm doing. Hi and Welcome to the Forum. I think you will be achieving the average or blended rate until your first default. After that I don't know... but I'd hope that defaults are taken out of the calculation, then we might well ask at what point will Zopa take Late Payments out of the calculation. So I'm hoping the figure will change as things develop. Is this what you're asking? Or have I got the wrong end of the stick? Time for a spreadsheet me thinks.
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Post by retired on Apr 11, 2016 21:29:17 GMT
Only just joined but have been investing in P2P for a while. A question: Z+, how do I know what rate I am actually achieving? If I understand the information displayed correctly I can see the 'blended' rate of the various loans I have made and I can see the projected return after the anticipated defaults. How do I know what rate I am actually achieving? If I'm really lucky I could get close to the 'blended' rate (I wish) or if unlucky I could get lower than the projected rate. Either way seems to me to be quite important to know just how well or badly I'm doing. Hi and Welcome to the Forum. I think you will be achieving the average or blended rate until your first default. After that I don't know... but I'd hope that defaults are taken out of the calculation, then we might well ask at what point will Zopa take Late Payments out of the calculation. So I'm hoping the figure will change as things develop. Is this what you're asking? Or have I got the wrong end of the stick? Time for a spreadsheet me thinks. Thanks for replying. My question is when defaults start to occur, will Zopa tell me what rate I'm actually achieving having taken the defaults in account? Seems to me to be a very important piece of data. It's all very well telling me the blended rate is x% and the projected rate is y%, but what if the actual rate turns out to be lower than those numbers. Need to know this in order to make rational decisions such as sell the loans or invest more money. FC supply three figures, can't remember actual names but basically the blended rate, the projected rate after anticipated defaults and a third rate which is what you are actually achieving with your investment. All I want to know is what rate is my money achieving and I can't see it anywhere on the zopa site. But maybe I'm missing something. Maybe Zopa will provide raw data so I can work it out for myself, but I really can't be bothered to do that. I've only put a reasonably small amount of money in, but if I wait a while I'll probably find out what happens. I've tried asking Zopa but the responses I get are pretty meaningless.
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Post by Ton ⓉⓞⓃ on Apr 11, 2016 22:04:34 GMT
@zopamat might be able to answer your question retired , I don't know the answer, but Zopa is still developing how these three products appear. I know that they're planning/trying to get a representation to show where your money is in the queue to be lent. That was on the old site but is missing here. But you're right it's the main reason people invest or deposit money so the accurate current figure does need to be available, it might even be a requirement now. |
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Post by propman on Apr 12, 2016 7:07:46 GMT
No they don't tell you how you are doing. There is a breakdown monthly (although I can't reconcile the figures) if you click on each product showing return and defaults for the month, but it would take a huge portfolio for defaults to even out so for most this will show a wild swing between months depending on defaults. They do show the bad debt performance of the entire loanbook by years as compared with projected defaults, so you can see that they have beaten their projections consistently, but of course any lender's return will differ from this. Having said that, I would say this is more useful than your historical bad debt rate as any variation from it is just bad luck and there is no reason to suspect that this will continue. What I would like to see is the performance of the different loan ratings or at least different products as otherwise Z+ performance will be blended with Classic.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Apr 12, 2016 9:09:08 GMT
I'm not entirely sure what the phrase, 'This is the average rate of all your money that is currently lent out....' means (Under the drop down for Z+). Does it mean defaulted (and paid back) loans are NOT included in that rate, which is how I read it, then that is the rate I want to see. Or does it exclude paid back, but include defaulted?
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Post by propman on Apr 12, 2016 9:50:45 GMT
I'm not entirely sure what the phrase, 'This is the average rate of all your money that is currently lent out....' means (Under the drop down for Z+). Does it mean defaulted (and paid back) loans are NOT included in that rate, which is how I read it, then that is the rate I want to see. Or does it exclude paid back, but include defaulted? It would also be useful to confirm that this rate is a weighted average of the amount lent and so it is representative of interest and not giving equal weight for a loan that is nearly repaid (both this and the above is unlikely to make much difference now but will become more important over time).
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Post by Ton ⓉⓞⓃ on Apr 12, 2016 10:06:08 GMT
I see that two people have paid back early already one had the loan for two days the other had for one day, I'm up a penny now! So My £1010 is now down to £990. I've got re-lending off so the money seems to have gone into my Holding A/c. All the Z+ money is in the pool for matching(£230) or is Pending(£250) or is lent, and there's no notice saying add money to get back up to £1k, as there was a couple of weeks ago when I only had about 4 or 500 in there. I'll switch lending back on (my default is is ZC), but I'll leave Z+ at £990 to see what happens My Update on this is; One more has made a full early repayment, but as I've switched on re-lending (Auto top up) I can see that the money in Z+ is indeed recycling itself back into Z+. So it appears that capital will now stay in the Z+ a/c with out any effort from me. Thus I imagine all the other a/c will also recycle back into themselves so long as I have re-lending switched on.
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aju
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Post by aju on Apr 12, 2016 10:14:15 GMT
Apr 12, 2016 10:50:45 GMT 1 propman said:
It would also be useful to confirm that this rate is a weighted average of the amount lent and so it is representative of interest and not giving equal weight for a loan that is nearly repaid (both this and the above is unlikely to make much difference now but will become more important over time).
Edit --------------------------------------- Sorry forgot to say what I was responding to
I think it might be simpler than that even - the old MLB has a toplevel %age return of each criteria group but its not very clever in that it counts all loans that fit the criteria you select - I used to use "by Month" or whatever they called it and rebuilt the tables in excel from the new tables (Alltimeloan and Current loan) it seems that the %age they showed in oldMLB were simply the average of all the loans in any selected criteria minus or plus the early adopter bonus depending whether it is old data or new data.
Perhaps the new one does this as well and forgets about the closed items - not sure haven't checked its all so confused IMO.
Perhaps thats why they removed OldMLB or if its still available they trashed it because it was a kludge. Who knows.
The sad fact is that you will not know what your real return is until loans are closed and then you will need to use the XIRR function - I think thats right although not sure how you would do this on an individual loan basis. I tend to use it on a toplevel basis and hope its right !
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Post by blanik on Apr 12, 2016 10:25:41 GMT
If, as Z+ lenders we are in an A*,A, B or C loan that could also be offered to Classic lenders, do we get a higher rate because it's not safeguarded? The borrower has presumably paid additional fees to support the safeguard fund, but we get no benefit unless we get a balancing increase in rate, so I hope that is the case. I haven't seen any extremely low rate A* loans (sub 3%) that I did see on the old safeguarded loans, but not sure if this is coincidental. I've some exceptionally low ZA loans* but the lowest Z+ is 3.11 with about 5more greater than that but still in the 3% band. *ZA loans of 1.53 & 1.15 % Only one Z+ below 3%. A2 2 year - 2.92%
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momac
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Post by momac on Apr 12, 2016 22:27:13 GMT
I am not an accountant or anything associated with accountancy.
I do not want to download csv's or fiddle around with Excel or any of his relations.
How can I work out what has happened to my money without faffing about?
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Apr 13, 2016 7:51:25 GMT
What do you want to know that isn't on the main lending screens? I want to look at the detail, particularly for the new Zopa Plus account, which means delving into the loan book, but if you don't want to all the summary information is on the main screens. And as usual drop in on the forum sometimes to see if anyone who does look at the detail has found anything unexpected.
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Post by retired on Apr 13, 2016 8:32:32 GMT
In a previous post I asked if there was any way to find out the return I am actually achieving after defaults lending to the Z+ market. The info currently displayed is'Lent Out at x%' and 'Projected Return y%'. Neither of these fulfill this requirement.
I had an email conversation with customer support who at first didn't understand the question and then told me what I wanted ' is an unsatisfactory way to view your account'.
Eventually someone phoned me who was able to understand and said they intend to introduce this information but unable to provide a timescale. Telling me what I wanted to hear?
Appreciate responses from members on this point.
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aju
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Post by aju on Apr 13, 2016 10:50:14 GMT
you could find out on a monthly basis by using your statements its not split from the other products so unless you were only in Z+ it would be not very accurate but at least its a start.
earnings / zopa total for beginning of month
You could use show to leave out items and you could calculate the default rate on any basis that the pull down gives.
Thats the only way at the moment unless you resort to excel or other means using csv etc. Hopefully Zopa will fix this soon
edit: Just a thought after writing this is that this really only works over a longer time perhaps a year as I noticed that last month I got about £50 in interest and bonuses etc but has a new default that was £10 which is 20% default rate but you can certainly still see the true interest rate - some lenders will take out loans and cancel them after a few days and they may be the high rates which skew the low ones. Always a problem at search an early point
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wapping35
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Post by wapping35 on Apr 18, 2016 12:26:23 GMT
Hi,
Just got paid the Z+ "no lending at the start" (for want of a better name) incentive. £11.30.
W35...
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Post by newlender on Apr 18, 2016 17:22:08 GMT
I have some loans in Z+ for £8k, £10k and even more. If we take a loan of £8k, that would require 400 lenders at £20 each. If we assume hundreds (thousands?) of Z+ loans in the pipeline I can see why lending is so slow. Solution, microloans of £50 or even £100 by agreement with the lender. We all know that there is a risk in Z+ and I personally wouldn't mind taking on a bit more in exchange for faster lending.
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