blender
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Post by blender on Apr 19, 2014 22:05:58 GMT
If it's a coincidence, it must be a widespread coincidence then. I've had loan parts at par not shifting, for a while. Some of those relisted recently have gone through quite quickly after being listed. Things are starting to move at last. Is this FC's answer to the Zopey Cokey? EDIT: OK so curiosity (and superstition) got the better of me. There is definitely something odd going on. I delisted a whole bunch of parts that have been sat on the secondary market. All are below current MBR. Most were listed at par. They hadn't sold, and that's after 3-4 complete relist cycles. "Average 2 days" my ****. Removed and relisted. 10 sold that night. 12 more by the following morning (today). Welcome to the "Circular Shuffle" ? If FC insist that the 2ndry market is working correctly, and that nothing nefarious is happening, no bias on autobid etc. how do you explain that? When FC engaged in discussion on this issue on the other (lesser) forum they gave statistics for how long it was taking for a loan part to sell, which clearly only included those which had sold; those which fell off after 14 days or were removed or relisted were selling attempts which were unsccessful and did not seem to be included in the analysis. What was given was the average time to sell, not to fail to sell, or at least that was the implication. If you give Autobid a strong preference for fresh meat on the secondary market, say for example if it only considered loan parts which had been on sale for four days and ignored the rest, then the average time to sell a loan through Autobid would be less than two days. Even if most of the loan parts never sold. The same effect can be acheived by giving priority to the most recently listed parts. The manual sales are a separate matter of course, and you can see why FC might want to exclude all those parts at a large premium which just dangle there in the hope of a bite. That is a very different measure from a measure of how long it takes to sell a portfolio at par, but a lack of transparency and obfuscation can seem to blur the difference. When the existence of a loss-free secondary market is presented as an alternative for a cooling-off period there is a greater incentive to create and present the best statistics.
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min
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Post by min on Apr 20, 2014 7:11:50 GMT
Well there's no new loans for 4 days or so, thus any recycled money (loan repayments etc) is going to have to be autobid onto the secondary market rather than new loan requests - that should speed things up. Ditto the 'bought at premium/discount' market, for people trying to spend their income more manually - nothing much new to buy, so may as well buy SM 'bargains' (or were you selling rubbish?). One man's rubbish is another man's.......(fill in the blank). Possibly some rubbish - just stuff I need to get rid of to get through the FC exit.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Apr 20, 2014 9:54:30 GMT
I sold twelve Bs at par since yesterday afternoon, to three people. All were around 8.4%, well below MBR which will be 9% soon. Picking up a few "adequate" replacements on SM at around 2-2.5% above the bargains/rubbish (choose your noun) I'm selling.
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maxmarengo
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Post by maxmarengo on Apr 20, 2014 11:23:01 GMT
Luck you. I have some par Cs at better than MBR that are just not shifting.
Perhaps I will try some of my Bs and As.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Apr 20, 2014 14:52:11 GMT
Actually it's been surprisingly quiet on the SM the last few days, but I'm not selling at Par (did that), so I'm not a supplier for autobid, and what I do have out there is priced about 0.2% above what it 'ought to sell for' since there's nowt much to buy at auction right now (but even my +0.2%s are still above MBR .. just not as much above as I figure is needed .. I mean there still 400 (small) A parts at 9.4% and up on the SM, vs MBR of 8% (soon).
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smee
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Post by smee on Apr 21, 2014 16:27:53 GMT
I put 800 loan parts up on the SM three and a half weeks ago. I'm now down to 150 and definitely slowing down. I agree that delisting and then relisting speeds up the process. I found too that when 14 days were up and the loans automatically delisted, it was several days before I was allowed to relist them.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Apr 21, 2014 18:55:44 GMT
Yes, do NOT let the listings time out at 14 days because it can take a long while for them to show up on the can be sold list again. I delist them all after x days, and relist them. Got a script for it, actually.
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blender
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Post by blender on Apr 21, 2014 19:19:57 GMT
Agreed. This morning I delisted ten parts of a C- 11.5% loan at par, which had done nothing for about 11 days despite equalling the best offer for that loan. I relisted eight parts at a discount and two at par, for autobid. Within an hour one of the parts at par had sold, but none at a discount. Clearly that was Autobid and clearly it likes the freshest parts - probably that practice helps the Autosale performance statistics for the sold parts. No other sales today!
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dorset
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Post by dorset on Apr 22, 2014 9:07:43 GMT
The secondary market seems to be moving at the moment. Have just put up a mix of parts at par and five went within the first 10 minutes.
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merlin
Minor shareholder in Assetz and many other companies.
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Post by merlin on Apr 22, 2014 9:14:55 GMT
The secondary market seems to be moving at the moment. Have just put up a mix of parts at par and five went within the first 10 minutes. Similar experience. Sold about 30 parts over night at par, mainly C- that had been around for awhile and getting close to the new MBR.
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mikeb
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Post by mikeb on Apr 22, 2014 17:46:13 GMT
So there must be some kind of unfair "stack" of loan parts, not a fair queue, which mean we all need to start writing scripts to list and delist anything we want to sell. Repeatedly. Frequently.
I suspect the resulting listing and delisting, if done hard enough, could amount to a Denial Of Service attack ... I wonder if that would encourage FC not to implement daft ideas like that, and then pretend it's not happening.
Again, loan parts that were not selling (as of this morning), delisted and relisted exactly the same, picked off by an autobidder.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Apr 22, 2014 17:55:01 GMT
"Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence or stupidity" !!
Would be good if FC would explain, or even check, how's it's intended to work.
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fasty
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Post by fasty on Apr 22, 2014 18:05:49 GMT
So there must be some kind of unfair "stack" of loan parts, not a fair queue, which mean we all need to start writing scripts to list and delist anything we want to sell. Repeatedly. Frequently. I suspect the resulting listing and delisting, if done hard enough, could amount to a Denial Of Service attack ... I wonder if that would encourage FC not to implement daft ideas like that, and then pretend it's not happening. Again, loan parts that were not selling (as of this morning), delisted and relisted exactly the same, picked off by an autobidder. Some people might regard the existing "characteristic" functionality as rather useful.. Providing one understands it 
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fasty
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Post by fasty on Apr 22, 2014 18:15:00 GMT
"Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence or stupidity" !! Would be good if FC would explain, or even check, how's it's intended to work. I described the peculiar functionality in a thread in the official FC forum weeks ago. A few posts later, a representative of FC confirmed :
"...there are no problems with Autobid - it's working correctly...."
I don't feel inclined to waste my time repeatedly spelling it out to them.
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blender
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Post by blender on Apr 22, 2014 19:27:29 GMT
Agree with that. I read those posts when the FC board was more usable, and it seemed clear that Autobid working correctly meant working as FC wished it to, and further explanation of how it worked and was scheduled to run was not going to be forthcoming. And questions about how long it took to get money back were responded to with statistics about how quickly were sold the loan parts which actually sold. (The stack at work?) Statements on the platform about average times to sell a portfolio at par were just removed as if they had never been.
I usually go for the c*ck-up theory with FC, rather than the conspiracy theory, but perhaps this is an exception. And I begin to wonder if the sad demise into uselessness of the FC forum was entirely accidental. Now that there is a regulatory to read the commentary is it an asset or a liability?
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