|
|
Post by BrianC on Nov 8, 2016 0:10:03 GMT
I've spent a long time researching P2P sites to find a third platform I can invest in. None seem to meet my needs though. I've read a lot on this forum and maybe I'm being fussy but certain platforms just don't appeal to me.
I currently use Ratesetter and Zopa and have significant sums invested hence the need for a 3rd to spread my risk. A 4th may be nice too but I'm struggling finding the 3rd for now.
I like Ratesetter as it's easy to invest, I don't need to choose individual loans, just a product. No investor has ever lost a penny, there is a provision fund, rates are reasonable if not great but it feels safe. I like Zopa for similar reasons, mainly that it is established and loans are diversified and I feel my money is safe. Zopa+ gives me the chance to improve my returns for a little risk. They both just work for me.
So in looking for another platform I tried LW but gave up when it was taking 4 weeks to lend. I tried signing up to FC but I they wanted bills counter signing to pass their security so I gave up. I've looked at SS but it sounds effort choosing loans and getting part of one before it's all gone. I just had a bad feeling about it too when researching. I just read up on AC but didn't particularly like the sound of that either. The last 2 is simply a feeling and nothing more. They just don't suit me.
So what I'm asking is what other site runs like Zopa and RS and has the same benefits. Mainly those below.
- Established
- Financial Conduct Authority authorised and regulated
- Good liquidity - money not sat idle waiting to be loaned and loans can be sold.
- Range of products but not having to choose individual loans.
- Provision fund.
- Feels more like a regular savings account
- Access to money early if required
Any advice welcomed. Or is the reason I've not found one that it doesn't exist?
Thanks
|
|
bigfoot12
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,817
Likes: 816
|
Post by bigfoot12 on Nov 8, 2016 9:40:22 GMT
I think that FC would meet most of your requirements, expect there is no provision fund. But as there is a large supply it is very easy to diversify across 100's of loans (as long as your investment is bigger than £2,000), and the new tax rules reduce the need for a provision fund. If you are struggling to register, one possibility is to buy the FC investment trust - which you can do in an ISA. There are quite a few threads about it on this forum, worth reading before you invest (and today's election is likely to impact the price one way or another). I think that KYC rules are getting tougher and more frustrating for all honest customers, with everything I do. Obviously faking a utility bill and especially faking a witness signature is easier than getting it done properly. I don't understand why they still bother.
Wellesley would meet your requirements as stated, but the rates they now pay are so low, I am not convinced that the risk is worth it.
|
|
|
|
Post by dudave on Nov 8, 2016 11:04:13 GMT
The two platforms i would recommend for your needs would be Assetz capital and Bondmason, both of them absolutely automated and effortless, both of them feels very secure as well. Not sure regarding the amounts you are looking to invest but it could take some time for all your money to be invested on both platforms, that would probably be the only issue.
|
|
|
|
Post by stevefindlay on Nov 8, 2016 11:18:32 GMT
BrianC - at BondMason we enable clients to target a 7%+ return from P2P Lending opportunities, easily and hassle-free. We do three main things: (1) Source, review and diligence the best P2P Lending platforms; (2) Filter the best loans from approved platforms; and (3) Enable clients to have 50+ loan investments ("Receivables") from a minimum investment amount of £1,000 (which meets your desired approach of not choosing individual loans) Track record: we've made 1,100+ loans over the last 12 months; 400 have repaid in full so far (3 went in default - 2 with full recovery and the third is still expected to achieve full recovery). The headline return is 8.93%, less our 1% fee is 7.93%, although cash drag for some clients brings this closer to 7.0% p.a. The team has good investment experience (Fidelity, Blackstone, HSBC, Babson etc) and a proprietary tech and distribution platform to deliver this. I would caution though, that at present it can take 21-28 days to be fully invested based on current demand, but we are working hard to deploy funds faster. Liquidity is often achieved in full in 24-48 hours. We would be very happy to discuss our approach further at BondMason: invest@bondmason.com ; 020 3126 6705. [Thank you to @magenta14 and dudave for mentioning BondMason]
|
|
|
|
Post by davee39 on Nov 8, 2016 11:49:56 GMT
If your views on Assetz have been influenced by an individual critical poster you might want to have another look.
The 3.75% instant in normal markets account now compares well with the 5yr Zopa and RS offers, the 7% packages might not always allow quick access but there is some provision fund protection, which might take a while to pay out.
Octopus choice is interesting. They currently have an excess of investors and are quoting 10 days to invest funds, but the supply will increase as they develop. A monthly investment option is available.
An offering from Hargreaves Lansdown is expected next spring. I am not expecting high rates but will probably invest due to the solid company providing the financial backing.
|
|
littonowl
Member of DD Central
Posts: 398 
Likes: 355
|
Post by littonowl on Nov 8, 2016 12:09:16 GMT
I've spent a long time researching P2P sites to find a third platform I can invest in. None seem to meet my needs though. I've read a lot on this forum and maybe I'm being fussy but certain platforms just don't appeal to me. I currently use Ratesetter and Zopa and have significant sums invested hence the need for a 3rd to spread my risk. A 4th may be nice too but I'm struggling finding the 3rd for now. I like Ratesetter as it's easy to invest, I don't need to choose individual loans, just a product. No investor has ever lost a penny, there is a provision fund, rates are reasonable if not great but it feels safe. I like Zopa for similar reasons, mainly that it is established and loans are diversified and I feel my money is safe. Zopa+ gives me the chance to improve my returns for a little risk. They both just work for me. So in looking for another platform I tried LW but gave up when it was taking 4 weeks to lend. I tried signing up to FC but I they wanted bills counter signing to pass their security so I gave up. I've looked at SS but it sounds effort choosing loans and getting part of one before it's all gone. I just had a bad feeling about it too when researching. I just read up on AC but didn't particularly like the sound of that either. The last 2 is simply a feeling and nothing more. They just don't suit me. So what I'm asking is what other site runs like Zopa and RS and has the same benefits. Mainly those below. - Established - Financial Conduct Authority authorised and regulated - Good liquidity - money not sat idle waiting to be loaned and loans can be sold. - Range of products but not having to choose individual loans. - Provision fund. - Feels more like a regular savings account - Access to money early if required Any advice welcomed. Or is the reason I've not found one that it doesn't exist? Thanks , I have a friend that lends through Bond Mason, he likes it, rates are pretty decent, he tells me that they are well run and their Owner/Forum Rep stevefindlay is a good communicator, courteous and friendly. It may be worth having a wee look if you've not already discounted the Platform yourself. Steve I'm not a lender there as I prefer to self manage my modest portfolio and tend toward higher risk lending. Best regards. Hi @magenta14 ! Couldn't have put it better myself!  In all seriousness, what magenta says is correct. stevefindlay at BondMason, is a great communicator, very honest and open, and I think someone who has the best interests of his investors at heart. There's a bit of an issue atm with cash drag and repaid capital taking time to be reinvested (think they took on a very large investor in September?), but even so, return rates of c.7-8.5% after costs are still very reasonable for a passive investment. BrianC , you mention that you feel Rate and Z feel safe with their provision funds, yet few (if any) of the loans there are secured (unlike at BM and many of the other more active investment P2x platforms available) and the funds arguably haven't been stress-tested yet... If you were inclined to try some self-selection of loans, then I would also recommend Moneything, who much like BondMason, operate in a very open and honest way, with great communication from their rep, Ed, and whose loans, generally, appear to be of high quality and secured against sale-able assets on relatively conservative LTV's.
|
|
|
|
Post by brokenbiscuits on Nov 9, 2016 11:08:22 GMT
Another vote for bondmason here from me having read what you are looking for.
You can use other sites and get higher rates if you want to spend time doing your own due diligence and regularly reviewing your investment choices.
When you already invest with Zopa and ratesetter, the most obvious next step is bondmason. They will do all the leg work and should get you a slightly higher return than your current two p2p platforms. It's very much a fire and forget approach where diversification and loan selection is all taken care of.
Obviously do your own home work before you invest, but I would be looking there if I was you.
|
|
markr
Member of DD Central
Posts: 766
Likes: 426
|
Post by markr on Nov 9, 2016 11:45:56 GMT
I would agree that Assetz is worth a look, definitely. Their provision fund protected "fire-and-forget" accounts pretty much fit your list, and should you decide to get more hands-on, you can try out the Manual account and choose your own loans for higher returns, but no protection. Unlent funds can be swept into a quick access account and there's a 30 day account which currently has higher rates than Ratesetter's rolling market.
|
|
oldgrumpy
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,087
Likes: 3,233
|
Post by oldgrumpy on Nov 9, 2016 12:40:02 GMT
I have had £7K in Bondmason since late September, but since around 26 September have never been fully invested, having all the time between £730 and £1300 unplaced. Therefore, I have felt unable to add more resources for more than six weeks because Bondmason cannot cope with what I already have. Withdrawing all the surplus would be pointless, because then their system would report that I would be 100% invested, so not deploy any repayment money until my actual deployment was back down to most people's average c 85%, resulting in c£600-£1000 again being unlent all the time.
Since late September, I estimate the actual return (after fees, before losses if there are to be any) around 6.7% (headline rate has been 8.8%-8.9%) ... which I suppose is close to "targetting 7.0%" but not getting there.
You can see why I cannot send them more cash.
Edit: today's activity saw three loan parts of £80, but I still have £951 undeployed, Deployment this moment = 86.9%)
|
|
|
|
Post by stevefindlay on Nov 9, 2016 13:25:18 GMT
I have had £7K in Bondmason since late September, but since around 26 September have never been fully invested, having all the time between £730 and £1300 unplaced. Therefore, I have felt unable to add more resources for more than six weeks because Bondmason cannot cope with what I already have. Withdrawing all the surplus would be pointless, because then their system would report that I would be 100% invested, so not deploy any repayment money until my actual deployment was back down to most people's average c 85%, resulting in c£600-£1000 again being unlent all the time. Since late September, I estimate the actual return (after fees, before losses if there are to be any) around 6.7% (headline rate has been 8.8%-8.9%) ... which I suppose is close to "targetting 7.0% but no getting there. You can see why I cannot send them more cash. - your frustration at the deployment rate on BondMason is fair, and a frustration we share - and are working hard to resolve. As discussed on our forum board: in September and October we saw a combination of a significant influx of new investors (more demand) coinciding with the seasonal repayment of Invoice Discount finance (less supply). I am pleased to report we are making good headway and moving in right direction in terms of average deployment across the platform: - 30 Sep: 100%
- 11 Oct: c75%
- 19 Oct: 71.9%
- 28 Oct: 81.4%
and are continuing to make further progress this week. What I would say, is that clients' on BondMason aren't dragged down to the platform average quickly - if you are 100% invested then it should take 6-8 weeks before your percentage reverts to the platform average. And our target for the platform is 98%+ - there is no structural reason why we can't operate at this level (as we have done for most of 2016).
|
|
oldgrumpy
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,087
Likes: 3,233
|
Post by oldgrumpy on Nov 9, 2016 15:52:40 GMT
oldgrumpy , You've thrown a considerable amount of cash at BM without having to make any kind of investment decisions and in just over a month it's managed to return slightly under the targeted 7%. It's not SS or MT but I think it's still early days and using BM requires a different mindset involving transferring money then falling asleep. FWIW my XIRR on BM is 6.06% since starting but, still early days and I do intend continuing for longer still. Yes, I shan't bale out yet. I'll be looking every day though. My comment was factual rather than a "rant" (c6.7% in the period since late Sept, but nearer 7.5% between July and late September, so overall still clear of 7% approximately (I don't understand spread sheets IRR etc - not very bright really ) PS I was 99.9% fully deployed with £6.6K on 29th or 30th Sept BondMason sent us all an email to tell us. Immediately after that by 1st October I was under 80% IIRC certainly way over £1400 uninvested because of end-of month repayments - never recovered.  Stephen has explained why in several places. I still maintain I (we) cannot send further funds until 95%+ is regular. Edit: today's activity saw three loan parts of £80, but I still have £951 undeployed, Deployment this moment = 86.9%)
|
|
Stephen has explained why in several places. I still maintain I (we) cannot send further funds until 95%+ is regular.