username
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Post by username on Apr 24, 2017 18:03:34 GMT
Yeah fair point, but it's a bit implicit to go from 'growing the business' to 'forcing investors to hold to term'. I really would like to know what value they place on a liquid SM, and what the lack of that liquidity will do to incoming cash flow. They are not forcing you to do anything - you invested, which was your choice. It is clear in the T&Cs that an early exit is entirely dependent on somebody prepared to buy that loan part A liquid SM benefits LY no end; not being liquid is not a situation that suits them as they will be less likely to fill new loans, and it generates a negative vibe amongst investors Yeah I did quote that on purpose - maybe I should have been more explicit
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username
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Post by username on Apr 24, 2017 18:04:57 GMT
I think your post should be why I am leaving p2p as you appear to want everything but not accept any risk. There is a reason why people pay the rates that Lendy charge and that is not because there are all great borroweres with a stellar history. I guess we need to remember that it's not just asset risk, but also platform management risk.
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hantsowl
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Post by hantsowl on Apr 24, 2017 18:10:35 GMT
When I first joined SS over two years ago when they were first getting in to property backed lending it had a number of unique USP'S 1/ It was simple all loans at 12% so it did not price risk. 2/ INPL which was great and allowed one to invest quickly. 3/ A provision fund. 4/ A very liquid SM so if you needed funds quickly you could sell almost instantly.
As a result well over half of my P2P funds went to SS, however now every one of those USP'S have gone I am getting out but oh no 'I cant' ! Because other than a couple of loans I have no chance of selling unless I sit at the end of an unmoving queue owning no interest, when we complained about not being able to buys loans on the SM some 12 months ago we were told the primary reason for the SM was to provide liquidity to those wishing to sell loans! So much for that idea !!!!
At least on FS where I now have the largest part of my P2P funds if I want out I can discount my loan parts and they WILL sell. Well, I have been trying to sell loans on FS recently and the discount is totally irrelevant. Numerous loans are not available for sale in an unredeemed state. Many others are within one month of finish date and again NOT available for sale. I am moving in the opposite direction to you. I see too many heading for default at FS and not a penny of interest has been paid on those. At least with SS you can generally sell most things (even though there will be difficult periods like the present) and get out of what looks like a possible tricky loan. With FS there seems no way to predict what will have trouble redeeming, and when clues do arise it is too late to sell because a block will have been put on it. I feel that next weeks interest payment and hopefully one or two repayments will clean out most of the SM and free up your money to invest in the FS property loans which seem to pop up one or two each day.
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Post by onion12 on Apr 24, 2017 18:14:52 GMT
I will add my penny's worth if ppl want out then I suggest they do it in an orderly way crying like baby's becouse you can't sell your loans is not going to sell them any quicker all you will do is panic the market and when you have done that enough you can consider the door closed just sit back say nothing and wait
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Post by mrclondon on Apr 24, 2017 19:00:58 GMT
Never one to follow the herd, I'm taking advantage of super liquidity on the FS SM at present (I've sold many thousands of pounds worth of 32-47 remaining day loans today alone at less than the 20% tax liability) and am transfering the funds to LfSS and into loans I'm underweight in without the usual FFF bun fight. My redemption funds from Pickering and Huddersfield will likely flow back to FS as the loans I'm targetting will be snapped up very quickly once the redemptions occur (and/or 1st May interest arrives).
There was over £48,000 of DFL009 available earlier today - its all gone now (I took a 4 figure chunk out it, a few moments later someone took a £10k bite)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 19:13:57 GMT
There was over £48,000 of DFL009 available earlier today - its all gone now (I took a 4 figure chunk out it, a few moments later someone took a £10k bite) That was a 50k mini-tranche that appeared today
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GeorgeT
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Post by GeorgeT on Apr 24, 2017 19:51:31 GMT
Don't panic guys. I would recommend holding your horses until the middle of next week after the interest run and hopefully a repayment or two. The tide turns very quickly here on Ly.
I am stuck in 12 sale queues that have barely moved in the last few days but I am not panicking. This is a time to be British and not throw in the towel.
Yes it is true I have decided to reduce my exposure on this platform and I am in the process of doing that and I will be only holding very high class, select loans from now on once I have managed to clear my decks of dross. My dross being loans with two months plus to go at 12% that never used to be dross. But this week they are dross. Next week they could be gold dust again.
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Post by supernumerary on Apr 24, 2017 19:59:01 GMT
When I first joined SS over two years ago when they were first getting in to property backed lending it had a number of unique USP'S 1/ It was simple all loans at 12% so it did not price risk. 2/ INPL which was great and allowed one to invest quickly. 3/ A provision fund. 4/ A very liquid SM so if you needed funds quickly you could sell almost instantly.
As a result well over half of my P2P funds went to SS, however now every one of those USP'S have gone I am getting out but oh no 'I cant' ! Because other than a couple of loans I have no chance of selling unless I sit at the end of an unmoving queue owning no interest, when we complained about not being able to buys loans on the SM some 12 months ago we were told the primary reason for the SM was to provide liquidity to those wishing to sell loans! So much for that idea !!!!
At least on FS where I now have the largest part of my P2P funds if I want out I can discount my loan parts and they WILL sell. Dad's Army: DON'T PANIC supercut www.youtube.com/watch?v=nR0lOtdvqygMy favourite "don't panic" sketch with Corporal Jones is this one (although surprisingly Jones does not mention his favourite 'catch phrase'); www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcrdAhNVFns#t=1033secsJames, in a few days time there will be interest paid, then the repayments from a number of loans will occur at some point. Most of the secondary market will be cleared out again. Shame to see you go.
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Post by scerbera on Apr 24, 2017 21:15:11 GMT
Surely the very point of p2p is that you are in complete control over who you lend to and how much. If your strategy is just to loan on anything then you may not get the best possible outcome. I am personally reducing my lending on lendy, but my strategy is to only fund what in my opinion are the best loans. I have 1 left, and it is dfl20, it has a long time to run yet. I think I will hold for a year unless I see something in the platform to concern me.
I do think there are a few reality checks to come with the defaulted loans.
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twoheads
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Programming
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Post by twoheads on Apr 24, 2017 21:36:37 GMT
Surely the very point of p2p is that you are in complete control over who you lend to and how much. If your strategy is just to loan on anything then you may not get the best possible outcome. I am personally reducing my lending on lendy, but my strategy is to only fund what in my opinion are the best loans. I have 1 left, and it is dfl20, it has a long time to run yet. I think I will hold for a year unless I see something in the platform to concern me. I do think there are a few reality checks to come with the defaulted loans. Yes, there are reality checks to come. Especially because the current raft of defaults are for loans under the new Ts & Cs where the lenders are lending directly to the borrowers and not to LfSS. I think that this gives LfSS an opportunity to be less enthusiastic about their repayment policy (which has been perfect so far). Now that LfSS is not the direct recipient of our funds, will they be as willing to dip in to the infamous PF to pay back loans that go West?
And why are so many of the 'DEF' loans in the West?
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GeorgeT
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Post by GeorgeT on Apr 24, 2017 22:46:14 GMT
I'm not the prophet of doom but I am a realist. I will eat my hat if quite significant capital losses have not been suffered on this platform by the end of 2017.
However that should not worry the users of this forum who are all more savvy than the average investor and that is why they read this forum on a regular basis and contribute expert opinion and advice.
Unfortunately I feel it is the mugs and less knowledgeable and well-informed who will bear the Brunt of the losses. And unfortunately I also feel that some of those people may be those who are less able to afford to lose some of their money.
It is important to remember that the loan rates quoted to investors are headline rates before losses. Losses are inevitable and therefore the real rate of return should be expected to be lower than the rates quoted. The sensible investor will realise this if he or she is in it for the long term and they will have factored that into their equations and perhaps be content with a real return of 8% as opposed to the quoted 11 or 12%.
It is quite painful when you burn your fingers on the oven but in a way it is an important and salutary lesson that results in the sensible person going out and buying a pair of oven gloves and therefore being more aware of the risks in the future and acting accordingly and in an improved and better informed manner.
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Post by jackpease on Apr 25, 2017 6:35:22 GMT
>>>>>If Lendy keep issuing new loans willy nilly, In periods of famine, the mood was 'when are we going to get new loans'. That cry is quite loud at Moneything at the moment. Could you really tell a potential borrower talking to Lendy and tell them that money was not available so the secondary market could be calmed? Lendy differentiates itself from the establishment banks by being flexible and we must expect - indeed welcome - bursts of activity. That said, fingers crossed for month end! I drastically reduced my position in Lendy last month not because I think Lendy is suddenly unsafe, rather I think we are well overdue for some investors to lose capital pretty soon. As many lenders persist in being surprised at the prospect, I think there may be a temporary panic while lenders freak out and we get the mother of all illiquidity, after which hopefully expectations are more realistic and lenders less flighty. Jack P
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2017 7:22:07 GMT
We moan when there are not enough loans and moan when there are too many loans...... just wait a few months.
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Apr 25, 2017 7:40:50 GMT
We moan when there are not enough loans and moan when there are too many loans...... just wait a few months. Ah, yes. The traditional summer holiday famine, when the lawyers hit the beach and even Tenanted Office Blocks sell like ice-lollies
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withnell
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Post by withnell on Apr 25, 2017 9:04:51 GMT
Surely the current SM glut is just due to PBL122 and PBL135 not repaying?
Current SM: 3,087k Repayment of 122/135: 2,835k
Remaining SM: 253k
Even with pipeline loans, if the dodgy Poole loan falls through then following the monthly interest run there'll be nothing left. From past experience there are a lot of investors in new loans who don't use the SM so unlikely to be a 2.7m hit on SM even if Poole releases
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