skippyonspeed
Some people think I'm a little bit crazy, but I know my mind's not hazy
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Post by skippyonspeed on Jun 7, 2017 11:26:55 GMT
I think in these days there is nowhere to put your "savings" and sit back and watch them grow. You have to be prepared to move your cash around on a regular basis because market sentiment can change so quickly. I was quite late coming to P2P ie about 2 years ago, and was happy up to about 6 months ago. But goal posts keep moving.......usually not favourably. I think I will gradually reduce funds in this area......and increase my investment on the stockmarket, aiming to deal on a daily basis, selling at the closing bell every day......long term investments seem to be a thing of the past, unless you are an expert in some area of collectables eg fine art, antiques etc. If you want to lose a lot of money then go ahead with that stock market strategy! Stay away from stocks unless you are investing longterm 10 years + I have been using that strategy for over 8 years now with my "play" money, often dealing in one or two stocks two or three times a day. In that time I have averaged a 32% return per annum. Yes, a couple of years I made small losses, but overall it is by far where I get the best yield. Some of the cash I made from the stock market I started building a portfolio in P2P because I believe in diversifying and updating loans on a regular basis was working fine up to a couple months ago. Now, I feel trapped with L as getting my cash back is going take months rather than minutes, my attractive loans are getting less attractive every day. On the stock market I follow the rules below 1 Cash is king. (A crash in any market can snowball at any time) 2 It is never wrong to take a profit sometimes as little as 0.5%. 3 A long term investment is a short term investment that has gone wrong. 4 Don't fall in love with a stock. 5 Don't be too greedy, stocks that spike due to some good news generally drift back down during the same trading session. I very rarely break the above rules and I do currently hold 1 "long term" stock, I bought them at 8p last year and halved my holding each time they doubled in price. I did mention them on this board in November when they were circa 20p, they are currently trading circa 44p. My holding is of course "free" shares. I have also used my short term trading strategy with the stock several times. The more volatile the markets are the more opportunities arise. In the 6 months after Brexit Ref I doubled my "play" money. At the moment there is a lull in the type of stocks I trade so apart from my 1 "free" holding, my cash is safe......but easy to get to.......not in my p2p portfolio sadly. Back in the 90's there was a stock that I did hold for circa 8 years, that company was called Rhino when I bought them I think I paid 8p each, after a couple of name changes Electronic Boutique being one they were a high street name, Game plc. I sold them at circa £2.50 they peaked at about £3.00, but went bust because they mis-read the way the gaming market was going and tried to expand in a shrinking market caused by the internet. However, the shops are still on some high streets. If I had not sold them I would have lost the lot!!!
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skippyonspeed
Some people think I'm a little bit crazy, but I know my mind's not hazy
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Post by skippyonspeed on Jun 7, 2017 11:57:20 GMT
I can finally say that I'm not leaving lendy I have now left 98% just 2k left in one loan on sale so that best part of 100k out i done it nice and quiet no screaming and shouting about the sm like many have and are still doing and to be fair that is the main reason imo that the sm is the way it is becouse people won't stop going on about it so that was the alarm bell ringing telling me unless I wanted to hold all my loans to term it was time to get out I started the proses just over 2 months ago and I then had the probolem what to do with the money and decided it was not just leaving lendy it was leaving P2p for a safer home I decided no over valued funds so after a lot of reasearch I ended up buying a shed load of shares in Sirius minerals and after 9 weeks I'm on a 70% paper gain so I'm quite happy about the move and now I just sit back and enjoy rather than having to monitor on a daily basis loads of loans so to sum up there are things out there appart from P2p and over valued funds but as a disclaimer I'm not recommending anyone does what I have done DYOR before you invest in anything and good luck to anyone that stays put I have just had a look at SXX and yes you have done well. I would definitely bank some of the profit if it was me. I see they want to move onto the main index from AIM, they may consolidate at the same time and if so, it may be worth reducing your holding during that process, as there usually is a buy back opportunity at cheaper price. I may be wrong , but as I say in my post it is never wrong take a profit.
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lobster
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Post by lobster on Jun 7, 2017 11:58:55 GMT
If you want to lose a lot of money then go ahead with that stock market strategy! Stay away from stocks unless you are investing longterm 10 years + I have been using that strategy for over 8 years now with my "play" money, often dealing in one or two stocks two or three times a day. In that time I have averaged a 32% return per annum. What are you messing about with P2P for ?! That is a phenomenal return, which could just be classed as luck over a single year or even a couple of years but over 8 years ? With all that intra-day buying and selling, I can't even imagine how you could make a profit doing that once you factor in all the spread and transaction costs.
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skippyonspeed
Some people think I'm a little bit crazy, but I know my mind's not hazy
Posts: 787
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Post by skippyonspeed on Jun 7, 2017 12:34:48 GMT
I have been using that strategy for over 8 years now with my "play" money, often dealing in one or two stocks two or three times a day. In that time I have averaged a 32% return per annum. What are you messing about with P2P for ?! That is a phenomenal return, which could just be classed as luck over a single year or even a couple of years but over 8 years ? With all that intra-day buying and selling, I can't even imagine how you could make a profit doing that once you factor in all the spread and transaction costs. It is a great return, but I do like to spread the risk, ie a few eggs in many baskets, and I have always had money earning some interest. I have not traded any shares for about 4 weeks now and know from past experience, timing of doing a deal is probably the most important thing and in the early days jumped in too soon on quite a few occasions. Patience is not easy for me and hopefully once the election is over things will get back to "normal". If I miss a good opportunity for being too patient, there will always be more. The types of shares I trade in are diluting on a fairly regular basis. So buying after new shares are released is reasonably safe. Another recent example, I bought a small mining exploration stock, I thought they would be safe for the trading session, but I was unlucky in that they issued news that were going to have a name change and share CONsolidation (caps. intended  ) a couple hours after my trade, that's like trying to polish a t*** and throw glitter on it at the same time as far as I am concerned! I sold immediately and lost 10%. (I did make it back and some after the process). Dealing charges are 1% (£7.50 min per trade, to buy and sell, but I do get 1/3 discount as I hold shares in the company I deal thru', which has covered the share cost many times over the years), there use to be stamp duty as well on the buys until it was scrapped a couple of years ago. You have probably seen the film Wall Street, well share price movements can be witnessed like that on quite a regular basis. Just had a look at my share spreadsheet, my best trade was a company called Puricore on 30/4/09-01/05/09. I bought them just before the close for 16p, hit the sell button bang on 8am the next day for 24p, holding them for less than 15 trading minutes.......including all costs I made just over 40%. It was when we were all going to die of bird flu and they supposedly had the only known vaccine, and I think they changed their mind overnight about the seriousness!
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littleoldlady
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Running down all platforms due to age
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Post by littleoldlady on Jun 7, 2017 20:23:08 GMT
You have done well. However there must be others that have done just as badly. The average gain cannot be higher than the overall market increase. And that is without considering dealing costs. Over most periods (excluding big bulls) frequent trading must be about break even on average across all traders taking trading costs into account. Winners and losers - make sure you stay in the first group.
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GeorgeT
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Post by GeorgeT on Jun 7, 2017 20:32:09 GMT
Believe it or not I have never invested in shares.
However a late uncle of mine did and he did so upon the advice of a financial advisor. He had approximately 200k and it was all in building society type accounts earning High Street rates of interest. In around 2006 or 2007 he was advised that he would do a lot better in shares and bought into some sort of managed bonds where they supposedly spread the risk a bit.
Of course we all know what happened in 2008 and sadly my late uncle died in 2009 or 2010 and the value of his savings had almost halved, or at least been reduced by over 1/3, once the executor had sorted out his estate. I was quite miffed because he didn't have any children and had left me as one of his nephews 50% of his his estate and I had known roughly how much money he had because he was always telling me that I would be ok when he was gone. Had he kept his money in the building societies I would have inherited a lot more money.
Given that he was a fairly elderly man and shares are known to be a long-term investment I often thought afterwards that the financial adviser could have been sued for giving bad financial advice. But I still had quite a nice inheritance so I couldn't be bothered to look into it any further.
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Post by lendinglawyer on Jun 8, 2017 6:50:30 GMT
Just to correct something above stamp duty (or more accurately for electronic trades stamp duty reserve tax) does still exist. At 0.5% of the consideration. It must be factored into the 1% dealing fee if you aren't paying it separately.
Of course there's an exemption for individual trades of less than £1,000. So if you're doing small trades there won't be any.
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littleoldlady
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Running down all platforms due to age
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Post by littleoldlady on Jun 8, 2017 6:58:59 GMT
Just to correct something above stamp duty (or more accurately for electronic trades stamp duty reserve tax) does still exist. At 0.5% of the consideration. It must be factored into the 1% dealing fee if you aren't paying it separately. Of course there's an exemption for individual trades of less than £1,000. So if you're doing small trades there won't be any. True, but then dealing costs become proportionately higher.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 8, 2017 7:25:41 GMT
Just to correct something above stamp duty (or more accurately for electronic trades stamp duty reserve tax) does still exist. At 0.5% of the consideration. It must be factored into the 1% dealing fee if you aren't paying it separately. Of course there's an exemption for individual trades of less than £1,000. So if you're doing small trades there won't be any. Not quite correct. Its charged on electronic trades settled through CREST and non CREST trades over £1000. Growth markets trades AIM/NEX exempt unless Irish stocks.
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skippyonspeed
Some people think I'm a little bit crazy, but I know my mind's not hazy
Posts: 787
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Post by skippyonspeed on Jun 8, 2017 7:49:47 GMT
Believe it or not I have never invested in shares. However a late uncle of mine did and he did so upon the advice of a financial advisor. He had approximately 200k and it was all in building society type accounts earning High Street rates of interest. In around 2006 or 2007 he was advised that he would do a lot better in shares and bought into some sort of managed bonds where they supposedly spread the risk a bit. Of course we all know what happened in 2008 and sadly my late uncle died in 2009 or 2010 and the value of his savings had almost halved, or at least been reduced by over 1/3, once the executor had sorted out his estate. I was quite miffed because he didn't have any children and had left me as one of his nephews 50% of his his estate and I had known roughly how much money he had because he was always telling me that I would be ok when he was gone. Had he kept his money in the building societies I would have inherited a lot more money. Given that he was a fairly elderly man and shares are known to be a long-term investment I often thought afterwards that the financial adviser could have been sued for giving bad financial advice. But I still had quite a nice inheritance so I couldn't be bothered to look into it any further. I suspect if you were to check the value of those funds today you would have been more than happy, the Footsie sank to about 3500 in 2009, today it is currently 7500, and those funds should have at least doubled even if they just just average. Over recent years the boom, bust cycle is about every 4 years. We are due one any time soon. If you have never invested in shares and have no experience, try an experiment with say, £1000. Wait for the crash.......wait a further 6-12 months.......pick a Footsie share, not a tech stock or anything in "fashion", something like Standard Life * or maybe a food stock (we will always need it!!).........if you do not make a good profit within 12 months.......I will shave my avatar's hair off!! I avoid all managed accounts 'cos I hate being out of control, however, I do have a couple small pension funds from when I was self employed 'cos I was persuaded by family and friends. I make most of my decisions 'cos I think logically, Here are my reasons-: 1) Managed accounts charge you win or lose. They should only charge if they make money.....therefore in my my mind that shows even they do not fully believe in themslves. 2) If these account managers, financial advisors etc are so good at what they do.....why do they need jobs! They could be earning a mint using their own money and spending quality time with their family. *I got some free shares 'cos one of my small pensions is with them..........they have always pay 2 reasonable divis a year and the capital growth is quite healthy.........they also paid a nice bonus a couple years ago after selling part of the business........there was a small consolidation but the sp has more than made up for that.
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dovap
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Post by dovap on Jun 8, 2017 8:01:22 GMT
Sounds like complete and utter cobblers tbh
still if it works for you
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skippyonspeed
Some people think I'm a little bit crazy, but I know my mind's not hazy
Posts: 787
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Post by skippyonspeed on Jun 8, 2017 8:07:32 GMT
Just to correct something above stamp duty (or more accurately for electronic trades stamp duty reserve tax) does still exist. At 0.5% of the consideration. It must be factored into the 1% dealing fee if you aren't paying it separately. Of course there's an exemption for individual trades of less than £1,000. So if you're doing small trades there won't be any. Thanks for that info. I usually buy in chunks of £750-£1000 (eggs baskets etc.) as this is the most economcal batch size for me and also what I feel comfortable with. So I do not pay stamp duty on any trades and assumed incorrectly that it applied to all trades. You could avoid it by splitting a £5k investment into 5 batches, I assume. However, you may do better with a company who charges a flat rate on deals.
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skippyonspeed
Some people think I'm a little bit crazy, but I know my mind's not hazy
Posts: 787
Likes: 424
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Post by skippyonspeed on Jun 8, 2017 8:14:29 GMT
Sounds like complete and utter cobblers tbh still if it works for you Yes it does thanks, but making a good profit isn't for everybody!!
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 8, 2017 9:10:27 GMT
Just to correct something above stamp duty (or more accurately for electronic trades stamp duty reserve tax) does still exist. At 0.5% of the consideration. It must be factored into the 1% dealing fee if you aren't paying it separately. Of course there's an exemption for individual trades of less than £1,000. So if you're doing small trades there won't be any. Thanks for that info. I usually buy in chunks of £750-£1000 (eggs baskets etc.) as this is the most economcal batch size for me and also what I feel comfortable with. So I do not pay stamp duty on any trades and assumed incorrectly that it applied to all trades. You could avoid it by splitting a £5k investment into 5 batches, I assume. However, you may do better with a company who charges a flat rate on deals. Shouldnt you know what the fees are before you invest, basic due diligence research I wouild have thought, rather than assuming/guessing? AFAICS youve guessed/assumed wrongly twice now. You arent paying fees becuase I suspect you are investing in AIM stocks which are generally exempt, though Id watch out for any Irish domiciled stocks as you'll get a 1% nasty surprise. Cant fault your results. Not really brave enough to gamble on day trading myself.
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dandy
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Post by dandy on Jun 8, 2017 9:52:00 GMT
seems unfair to have a long general discussion about investing in shares on a thread titled - Why I am leaving Lendy.
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) a couple hours after my trade, that's like trying to polish a t*** and throw glitter on it at the same time as far as I am concerned! I sold immediately and lost 10%. (I did make it back and some after the process).
