oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Oct 31, 2014 14:06:48 GMT
Yes. I suppose we do make everything rather public anyway.
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shimself
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Post by shimself on Oct 31, 2014 18:33:08 GMT
Do we know who are the insolvency practioners at AC?
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Oct 31, 2014 18:57:22 GMT
Do we know who are the insolvency practioners at AC? Andrew Holgate, but he may have some sidekicks now. edit - ah... seen unmaden's post below -- Mark is the main man - Andrew has spent many years in insolvency too which is what I remembered.
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unmadem
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Post by unmadem on Oct 31, 2014 19:10:20 GMT
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mark
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Post by mark on Nov 6, 2014 9:05:13 GMT
So another week past and no action or reported progress on this shambles. Lenders have obviously been deceived over the past four months by, at least, the borrower and introducer, confident in the knowledge of the lack of any action taken by AC with empty threats of deadlines. Why does AC not just get on with taking action to recover lenders funds rather that repeatedly moving deadlines or stalling on action. No votes, no more meaningless updates, after four months of BS why not just get on with recovering lenders funds.
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ramblin rose
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“Some people grumble that roses have thorns; I am grateful that thorns have roses.” — Alphonse Karr
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Post by ramblin rose on Nov 6, 2014 9:36:55 GMT
So another week past and no action or reported progress on this shambles. Lenders have obviously been deceived over the past four months by, at least, the borrower and introducer, confident in the knowledge of the lack of any action taken by AC with empty threats of deadlines. Why does AC not just get on with taking action to recover lenders funds rather that repeatedly moving deadlines or stalling on action. No votes, no more meaningless updates, after four months of BS why not just get on with recovering lenders funds. Can't disagree with your general sentiment here, but as there are no units of this for sale at the moment, does that not mean that all those of you who are in the loan are in because you are still happy being there? Other default extension loans that people want out of have plenty up for sale, and there are people who buy defaulted loans for the interest. Or are sales not allowed on this extension for some reason?
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merlin
Minor shareholder in Assetz and many other companies.
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Post by merlin on Nov 6, 2014 9:53:34 GMT
There was a promise by AC on Tuesday that there would be a vote in the coming week once they had again talked to the introducer. How much you believe this is a matter for you but given all the previous promises on this and other defaults I am not convinced. Why not a vote either today or latest tomorrow. Time to put prevarication in the past tense AC.
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Nov 6, 2014 10:00:15 GMT
So another week past and no action or reported progress on this shambles. Lenders have obviously been deceived over the past four months by, at least, the borrower and introducer, confident in the knowledge of the lack of any action taken by AC with empty threats of deadlines. Why does AC not just get on with taking action to recover lenders funds rather that repeatedly moving deadlines or stalling on action. No votes, no more meaningless updates, after four months of BS why not just get on with recovering lenders funds. Can't disagree with your general sentiment here, but as there are no units of this for sale at the moment, does that not mean that all those of you who are in the loan are in because you are still happy being there? Other default extension loans that people want out of have plenty up for sale, and there are people who buy defaulted loans for the interest. Or are sales not allowed on this extension for some reason? AFAIK sales are permitted as it's an extension so can be sold. I sold my loan parts but am owed defaulted interest and hoping if everything doesn't end in tears then it will get paid. The only one I'm aware of that cannot be traded is L*******l BL but that's (yet) another shaggy dog. I'm owed default interest on a couple of others which I'm out of and pleased to see the back of. Will I get that interest? - not so sure as each day goes past. 
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Nov 6, 2014 10:05:49 GMT
There was a promise by AC on Tuesday that there would be a vote in the coming week once they had again talked to the introducer. How much you believe this is a matter for you but given all the previous promises on this and other defaults I am not convinced. Why not a vote either today or latest tomorrow. Time to put prevarication in the past tense AC. I'm not convinced that all this chasing done by AC is really achieving anything. Phone calls not returned (I assume), a general lack of communication from the introducer/borrower etc. Why not just state if we don't hear by whenever, then we (meaning AC) will revert to plan B without any further following up. It seems to get to the stage where the threats from AC are being taken with a pinch of salt. These defaults really do need pulling back onto a disciplined timetable IMO.
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mark
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Post by mark on Nov 6, 2014 11:24:55 GMT
Great contributions from all above. I have now sold my complete holding in this loan on the aftermarket ( still owed substantial deferred interest ) due to my gut feeling and lack of confidence in AC's handling of this situation which, in my opinion, has contributed to the ongoing delay in the return of lenders funds through their numerous meaningless deadlines and inaction over nearly 5 months.
It is just not good enough that in updates, when they do happen, lenders are informed that AC are having difficulties with obtaining responses or details from the borrower / introducer and when they do its at best some obvious stalling tactic designed to mislead lenders into believing some progress is being achived. This is perhaps because they know they can get away with treating AC / lenders this way without any fear of any action actually being taken.
I await with interest but not much confidence AC's next update . I hope it reports actual factual progress with concrete repayment dates or legal action already commenced to recover OUR money. No votes , ( apart from maybe one of no confidence ), no moving deadlines and no more empty words please.
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mark
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Post by mark on Nov 6, 2014 12:11:20 GMT
for all lenders info.......
a timely response to my question on AC website...........
Per our terms and conditions we cannot progress to recovery action without a mandate from lenders. This is obtained through a vote.
The email for this is being drafted this afternoon and in the absence of any update will be issued tomorrow morning for lenders to vote on over the weekend.
Answered by Assetz Capital
6th Nov 2014 at 11:39
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Post by Ton ⓉⓞⓃ on Nov 6, 2014 12:31:05 GMT
Great contributions from all above. I have now sold my complete holding in this loan on the aftermarket ( still owed substantial deferred interest ) due to my gut feeling and lack of confidence in AC's handling of this situation which, in my opinion, has contributed to the ongoing delay in the return of lenders funds through their numerous meaningless deadlines and inaction over nearly 5 months. It is just not good enough that in updates, when they do happen, lenders are informed that AC are having difficulties with obtaining responses or details from the borrower / introducer and when they do its at best some obvious stalling tactic designed to mislead lenders into believing some progress is being achived. This is perhaps because they know they can get away with treating AC / lenders this way without any fear of any action actually being taken. I await with interest but not much confidence AC's next update . I hope it reports actual factual progress with concrete repayment dates or legal action already commenced to recover OUR money. No votes , ( apart from maybe one of no confidence ), no moving deadlines and no more empty words please. The updates on all the BL's read as if a serious game of chess or a card game is being played each side has standard moves to play and each produces a similar response but AC is playing with a shot-gun under the table. Everyone knows it's there and in polite company it never comes out. But when it has to the gun will come out and even then not fired unless it's forced. No one will play chess with you in future if you're always getting the gun out and shooting the other player. I'm being a bit silly, I'm saying that AC are playing to the rules.
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niceguy37
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Post by niceguy37 on Nov 6, 2014 12:40:37 GMT
Great contributions from all above. I have now sold my complete holding in this loan on the aftermarket ( still owed substantial deferred interest ) due to my gut feeling and lack of confidence in AC's handling of this situation which, in my opinion, has contributed to the ongoing delay in the return of lenders funds through their numerous meaningless deadlines and inaction over nearly 5 months. It is just not good enough that in updates, when they do happen, lenders are informed that AC are having difficulties with obtaining responses or details from the borrower / introducer and when they do its at best some obvious stalling tactic designed to mislead lenders into believing some progress is being achived. This is perhaps because they know they can get away with treating AC / lenders this way without any fear of any action actually being taken. I await with interest but not much confidence AC's next update . I hope it reports actual factual progress with concrete repayment dates or legal action already commenced to recover OUR money. No votes , ( apart from maybe one of no confidence ), no moving deadlines and no more empty words please. The updates on all the BL's read as if a serious game of chess or a card game is being played each side has standard moves to play and each produces a similar response but AC is playing with a shot-gun under the table. Everyone knows it's there and in polite company it never comes out. But when it has to the gun will come out and even then not fired unless it's forced. No one will play chess with you in future if you're always getting the gun out and shooting the other player. I'm being a bit silly, I'm saying that AC are playing to the rules. Well said Ton. AIUI bridging loans generally over-run, and we are getting default interest in compensation for the added risk, and one would like to think that the default interest is motivating the borrower to sort things out. So long as there is decent security I'm not unhappy. As you say, if we are to include BL's in our portfolio going forward, we have to be seen to be as reasonable as possible with the borrowers, and to try and work out sensible plans (as I'm pleased to see we're trying to do with H*****y). Otherwise no one will want to borrow from us.
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merlin
Minor shareholder in Assetz and many other companies.
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Post by merlin on Nov 6, 2014 13:56:28 GMT
The updates on all the BL's read as if a serious game of chess or a card game is being played each side has standard moves to play and each produces a similar response but AC is playing with a shot-gun under the table. Everyone knows it's there and in polite company it never comes out. But when it has to the gun will come out and even then not fired unless it's forced. No one will play chess with you in future if you're always getting the gun out and shooting the other player. I'm being a bit silly, I'm saying that AC are playing to the rules. Well said Ton. AIUI bridging loans generally over-run, and we are getting default interest in compensation for the added risk, and one would like to think that the default interest is motivating the borrower to sort things out. So long as there is decent security I'm not unhappy. As you say, if we are to include BL's in our portfolio going forward, we have to be seen to be as reasonable as possible with the borrowers, and to try and work out sensible plans (as I'm pleased to see we're trying to do with H*****y. Otherwise no one will want to borrow from us. The inverse is the opposite of what you are suggesting, and AC will be seen by potential borrowers as a soft touch. This particular loan is in my opinion an excellent example of AC bending too far and for too long. I don't suggest they get the gun out from under the table but a big stick or a growling German Shepherd might be a better solution. Action, that is what is required and I am afraid we are seeing to little of that in this case!!!
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mark
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Post by mark on Nov 7, 2014 8:45:25 GMT
for all lenders info....... a timely response to my question on AC website........... Per our terms and conditions we cannot progress to recovery action without a mandate from lenders. This is obtained through a vote.
The email for this is being drafted this afternoon and in the absence of any update will be issued tomorrow morning for lenders to vote on over the weekend.
Answered by Assetz Capital
6th Nov 2014 at 11:39
Once again the nonsense form this borrower, incredibly either believed by AC, or, who were complicit in delaying any decision to take any recovery action, suggesting that they were going to seek new refinancing that should complete within a week has been found to be just more BS . The credibility of this borrower and introducer is in my opinion is now non-existent. I await with interest the details of the promised mandate email from AC. Let us hope they stick to this deadline at least and include the many lenders who are owed deferred interest on this loan in the vote. A vote for a mandate may well be in AC's T&Cs but this is months overdue. Promised action and constantly moving deadlines from AC never materialised. AC seem to have believed all the nonsense from this borrower and introducer over the past five months on face value without undertaking any due diligence, which really questions their procedures and ability to deal with such cases. I wonder how much effort was actually taken AC to confirm all the delaying stories of progress. Anyway we are where we are. AC should get on with taking action asap, get their head out of their backside on this one and get a grip of the situation. This is a rogue borrower / introducer who has pulled the wool over their eyes for months on end which in itself is quite a concern. In my opinion, AC's reputation has been damaged on this one.
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