acorn
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Post by acorn on Jul 16, 2014 14:13:08 GMT
Okay, David, message sent...
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star dust
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Post by star dust on Aug 11, 2014 14:47:02 GMT
Had to dig deep to find this loan....so much has happened since. Good to see we will get interest until drawdown now, although I guess if drawdown doesn't transpire then it will be meaningless really. This is the last loan I bid on - only the AM for me now however tempting the loan, unless the system changes of course!
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baz657
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Post by baz657 on Sept 4, 2014 18:27:29 GMT
The four weeks is up this coming Monday 8th September. I've just asked a question on the AC site hoping for an update. Over two months since the auction ended (and before I'd set up a shadow bid account  ). This is why I'm going with the AM and not bidding. |
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star dust
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Post by star dust on Oct 6, 2014 9:11:04 GMT
The latest AC update stated that despite daily contact the borrowers solicitors were not 'communicating' any progress and
"We ...... will update lenders further by close of business, Wednesday 8 October following the return from annual leave of the Relationship Manager dealing with this loan so he can speak to the borrowers and introducer directly."
in my experience when solicitors go silent for weeks/ months it usually ends badly. Can I ask AC whether it is their 'Relationship Manager' who is on leave? If so why couldn't this task be re-assigned/ delegated rather than leave investors funds tied up yet another week? It's been nearly three months since auction now.
if I was supposed to have 'thought pink' perhaps a Mod could move this post?
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star dust
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Post by star dust on Oct 6, 2014 11:09:57 GMT
Well, this is a bit weird, but it seems that someone posted more or less the same Q as me on the AC Platform at virtually the same time - it wasn't me Guv honest. I actually checked the Q&A and updates before I posted, and only posted here because AC have ignored my Qs on their Platform. In any event AC have even more amazingly actually responded to the Q on their Platform (is this an AC response record?) thus:
"with interest accruing at full rate and the fact that borrower does have to complete this deal or property will be sold elsewhere we feel it appropriate to continue to push for drawdown as quickly as possible.
Given Relationship Manager returns tomorrow it was felt acceptable to wait for his return given his relationship with borrowers / introducer"
My comment to this is that I suspect the borrower might be trying to arrange a (cheaper possibly?) Loan with someone else hence non-communication with AC and I won't be holding my breath about any accruing interest if the whole deal goes pear shaped. I think AC should set initial deadlines for borrowers and stick to them; if the borrower really does want the loan they'll soon be communicating to AC if there are genuine issues / problems. So next Q, just how long is AC going to give this particular borrower to complete the deal?
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hendragon
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Post by hendragon on Oct 6, 2014 11:46:14 GMT
perhaps ac need to take this interim interest upfront. If the borrower wants the loan they will pay up.
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sqh
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Before P2P, savers put a guinea in a piggy bank, now they smash the banks to become guinea pigs.
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Post by sqh on Oct 6, 2014 11:57:22 GMT
Must admit I've got rather annoyed with AC on this one. I was at my shadow bid limit and rang them up; was told this loan would be drawn imminently. So I settled the shadow bid to free up room. Two months later and we seem ever further away. Could AC please just kill it off and return my cash. It may not be their fault but they should not be dependent on a specific "Relationship Manager". That doesn't seem a robust approach. According to "The Steps to Drawdown" tab this loan is already paying the full rate of interest.
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star dust
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Post by star dust on Oct 6, 2014 12:05:16 GMT
sqh the loan isn't paying anything; it is merely 'accruing' interest that AC has 'arranged' with the borrower. If the whole deal goes pear shaped then AC will have to 'sing' for the interest, and I wish them luck, but won't be holding my breath for it.
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Post by Ton ⓉⓞⓃ on Oct 6, 2014 12:23:18 GMT
Must admit I've got rather annoyed with AC on this one. I was at my shadow bid limit and rang them up; was told this loan would be drawn imminently. So I settled the shadow bid to free up room. Two months later and we seem ever further away. Could AC please just kill it off and return my cash. It may not be their fault but they should not be dependent on a specific "Relationship Manager". That doesn't seem a robust approach. According to "The Steps to Drawdown" tab this loan is already paying the full rate of interest. But if, as some think the borrower maybe tempted to hawk round other lenders comparing our deal trying to get an even better one; on finding one he may feel unable to complete the arrangement with us to receive the compensation you mention. I hope that doesn't happen & I don't think it will, but some maybe fearing this. Some deals just take a long time to sort out. IN EDIT Sorry Crossed posts there, I was on the phone...
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Oct 6, 2014 16:42:33 GMT
According to "The Steps to Drawdown" tab this loan is already paying the full rate of interest. But if, as some think the borrower maybe tempted to hawk round other lenders comparing our deal trying to get an even better one; on finding one he may feel unable to complete the arrangement with us to receive the compensation you mention. I hope that doesn't happen & I don't think it will, but some maybe fearing this. Some deals just take a long time to sort out. While accruing interest at the full rate while waiting for drawdown sounds great, if it isn't paid up front (as suggested above by hendragon) then the longer the drawdown is delayed the greater the incentive for the borrower to find an alternative source of finance, as it could allow them to avoid paying all that accrued interest. AC may think they're entitled to that interest even if the deal doesn't happen, but a claim based on few letters from AC saying they'll be charging the interest is unlikely to stand up in court unless AC also have a signed agreement from the borrower that they'd pay it. Even that might not be enough if the 'agreement' states that the extra interest would be payable at drawdown, for if drawdown never occurs ... Situations like this are what are making AC lenders extremely reluctant to place bids in the primary market, instead deciding to take their chances on being able to pick up loan units in the Aftermarket once loans have drawn down. This has become a 'no-brainer' for larger loans -- even for those with shadow bidding privileges -- and even smaller loans are failing to fill in the primary market. Look at the Fostering Agency Loan -- it's only for £100k, yet it's been available for more than a day and still has attracted less than £3k of bids. I won't be the least bit surprised if the primary market fades away -- or at least pales into insignificance -- when the long-promised 'new' AC system finally is released.
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Post by Ton ⓉⓞⓃ on Oct 6, 2014 17:14:04 GMT
But if, as some think the borrower maybe tempted to hawk round other lenders comparing our deal trying to get an even better one; on finding one he may feel unable to complete the arrangement with us to receive the compensation you mention. I hope that doesn't happen & I don't think it will, but some maybe fearing this. Some deals just take a long time to sort out. While accruing interest at the full rate while waiting for drawdown sounds great, if it isn't paid up front (as suggested above by hendragon) then the longer the drawdown is delayed the greater the incentive for the borrower to find an alternative source of finance, as it could allow them to avoid paying all that accrued interest. AC may think they're entitled to that interest even if the deal doesn't happen, but a claim based on few letters from AC saying they'll be charging the interest is unlikely to stand up in court unless AC also have a signed agreement from the borrower that they'd pay it. Even that might not be enough if the 'agreement' states that the extra interest would be payable at drawdown, for if drawdown never occurs ... Situations like this are what are making AC lenders extremely reluctant to place bids in the primary market, instead deciding to take their chances on being able to pick up loan units in the Aftermarket once loans have drawn down. This has become a 'no-brainer' for larger loans -- even for those with shadow bidding privileges -- and even smaller loans are failing to fill in the primary market. Look at the Fostering Agency Loan -- it's only for £100k, yet it's been available for more than a day and still has attracted less than £3k of bids. I won't be the least bit surprised if the primary market fades away -- or at least pales into insignificance -- when the long-promised 'new' AC system finally is released. Everything you say is quite valid of course. What ever the agreement is verbal or written it probably won't be worth pursuing for long, it's not for that much, but I seem to remember that the gentleman in the agreement was of mature years and I'm 'banking on' (need to find a replacement for that phrase really) him being a man of his word...  Auctions are a great way to attract people, they engender a feeling of openness and equality of participation and excitement, even a trade mark, yes I think they will go eventually about the same time that p2p is as big as the banks. I still like to put in shad-bids, as of course, I'm being paid full rate on the promise that I will put in the money. So that money is getting interest on some other loan right now whilst getting the full here too, if all works out...
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Oct 6, 2014 21:30:41 GMT
But if, as some think the borrower maybe tempted to hawk round other lenders comparing our deal trying to get an even better one; on finding one he may feel unable to complete the arrangement with us to receive the compensation you mention. I hope that doesn't happen & I don't think it will, but some maybe fearing this. Some deals just take a long time to sort out. Situations like this are what are making AC lenders extremely reluctant to place bids in the primary market, instead deciding to take their chances on being able to pick up loan units in the Aftermarket once loans have drawn down. This has become a 'no-brainer' for larger loans -- even for those with shadow bidding privileges -- and even smaller loans are failing to fill in the primary market. Look at the Fostering Agency Loan -- it's only for £100k, yet it's been available for more than a day and still has attracted less than £3k of bids. I won't be the least bit surprised if the primary market fades away -- or at least pales into insignificance -- when the long-promised 'new' AC system finally is released. I agree it is situations as you describe that are possibly directing lenders towards the AM. Fortunately they still appear to be in the minority but combined with the steady downward trend on returns then these type of delays really do eat into the investment viability. Looking at the S***** D********** L*** at 9% for 12 months. Assuming a couple of months drawdown 'delay' and assuming the loan runs it's full term, then the return would equate to 7.71%. So there's little point in jumping in especially as no doubt the U/W's will pick up the slack.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Oct 6, 2014 22:59:40 GMT
While accruing interest at the full rate while waiting for drawdown sounds great, if it isn't paid up front (as suggested above by hendragon) then the longer the drawdown is delayed the greater the incentive for the borrower to find an alternative source of finance, as it could allow them to avoid paying all that accrued interest. AC may think they're entitled to that interest even if the deal doesn't happen, but a claim based on few letters from AC saying they'll be charging the interest is unlikely to stand up in court unless AC also have a signed agreement from the borrower that they'd pay it. Even that might not be enough if the 'agreement' states that the extra interest would be payable at drawdown, for if drawdown never occurs ... Situations like this are what are making AC lenders extremely reluctant to place bids in the primary market, instead deciding to take their chances on being able to pick up loan units in the Aftermarket once loans have drawn down. This has become a 'no-brainer' for larger loans -- even for those with shadow bidding privileges -- and even smaller loans are failing to fill in the primary market. Look at the Fostering Agency Loan -- it's only for £100k, yet it's been available for more than a day and still has attracted less than £3k of bids. I won't be the least bit surprised if the primary market fades away -- or at least pales into insignificance -- when the long-promised 'new' AC system finally is released. Everything you say is quite valid of course. What ever the agreement is verbal or written it probably won't be worth pursuing for long, it's not for that much, but I seem to remember that the gentleman in the agreement was of mature years and I'm 'banking on' (need to find a replacement for that phrase really) him being a man of his word... Auctions are a great way to attract people, they engender a feeling of openness and equality of participation and excitement, even a trade mark, yes I think they will go eventually about the same time that p2p is as big as the banks. I still like to put in shad-bids, as of course, I'm being paid full rate on the promise that I will put in the money. So that money is getting interest on some other loan right now whilst getting the full here too, if all works out... I'm not sure I'd agree that the pre-drawdown interest is "not for that much". It was 4% from 11/Aug to 30/Sep, which I calculate to be about £1700. It was 10% from 1/Oct, so that's about £85/day, and would bring the total to about £2400 by Tuesday. But perhaps that's peanuts in the larger picture. I hadn't thought that shadow bids would be earning the full 10% interest since they are just pledges. If they are, then that's a real bonus for shadow bidders.
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Oct 6, 2014 23:03:44 GMT
Similiar potential situation to Red....th D****p****t Loan which promised compensation for lenders due to the extended drawdown and that loan ultimately didnt go ahead. As far as Im aware the promised interest has yet to be paid despite andrewholgate suggesting robust action would be taken to secure it in the August Q&A. Perhaps would could get an update on that? (Cant find loan on site anymore) |
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Oct 6, 2014 23:23:21 GMT
Situations like this are what are making AC lenders extremely reluctant to place bids in the primary market, instead deciding to take their chances on being able to pick up loan units in the Aftermarket once loans have drawn down. This has become a 'no-brainer' for larger loans -- even for those with shadow bidding privileges -- and even smaller loans are failing to fill in the primary market. Look at the Fostering Agency Loan -- it's only for £100k, yet it's been available for more than a day and still has attracted less than £3k of bids. I won't be the least bit surprised if the primary market fades away -- or at least pales into insignificance -- when the long-promised 'new' AC system finally is released. I agree it is situations as you describe that are possibly directing lenders towards the AM. Fortunately they still appear to be in the minority... I don't know whether bugs4me meant drawdown delays or lenders choosing to use the primary market rather than the Aftermarket when referring to the 'minority', but I've just taken a look at the most recent two pages of the loan archive. Of the 20 loans listed, five were replacements for existing loans, so that leaves 15 new loans. Of those, three were fully funded via the primary market, and the other 12 required underwriting. Taking all 15 loans together, there were £2.0M of 'user' bids out of £7.9M of loans, so just 25% of the funding came via the primary market, and the remaining 75% came from underwriters.
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). This is why I'm going with the AM and not bidding.
